Dyno Mule to Test 351C Intakes on the Intake Adapter, Carb and EFI

[Barry_R]

I found the dyno sheets on the Bud Moore we tested here.

Engine is an all aluminum 412 inch Cleveland with Scott Cook CNC heads
The engine made 570 HP @ 5800-5900, and 534 TQ at 5100 running an Inglese IR system

Stuck the Moore manifold on it just for the sake of trying it.
After two pulls we removed it and went back to work with the IR EFI deal

Best pull on the Moore was 482 HP @5800, and 475 TQ @ 4800

Cannot remember much about the carb etc - but A/F on the Moore pull was mainly in the mid-12s to mid 13s

I am sure there was more "in it" but it was never, ever gonna catch up to what we were already using.

[jayb]

Thanks for that data, Barry, it will be interesting to see how that manifold does on my engine...

[Ford428CJ]

WOW!!! Very cool Jay! I run that adapter on my .020 over 390 with a Torker intake. Topped with a Holley 4011 800CFM. Works very well. I'm  very curious to see how well it will do on a 360ci high revving FE.... Guess I'll find out

[Dumpling]

Thank you for running the two intakes in various configurations.  It was a rainy day of interesting results.

Thank you for the time, tour, and input.

[jayb]

You're very welcome, and thank-you for bringing them to test.  I thought the results were very interesting.  I will post the results in the next few days, along with some others I have tested in the meantime...

[machoneman]

I found the dyno sheets on the Bud Moore we tested here.

Engine is an all aluminum 412 inch Cleveland with Scott Cook CNC heads
The engine made 570 HP @ 5800-5900, and 534 TQ at 5100 running an Inglese IR system

Stuck the Moore manifold on it just for the sake of trying it.
After two pulls we removed it and went back to work with the IR EFI deal

Best pull on the Moore was 482 HP @5800, and 475 TQ @ 4800

Cannot remember much about the carb etc - but A/F on the Moore pull was mainly in the mid-12s to mid 13s

I am sure there was more "in it" but it was never, ever gonna catch up to what we were already using.

Well, so much for a Bud Moore box intake!

Your post and results though triggered another thought. I'm sure I've seen a box top type FE intake on NASCAR engines long ago. Come to think of it, not much has been said here, if ever, nor at the old FE Forum about this intake. Now that intake must have worked on certain tracks as they had lots of other intakes to run if they had to.

Anyone here have one of those rare beasts?   

[Dumpling]

FElony had an example of that intake I believe.

You can close a factory hood down on a box intake, which was a requirement it needed to meet, along with other various restrictive parameters called for by class rules (single 4V).

[mtburger]

I would like to add some additional dyno information from my 351c build with a Bud Moore dominator top Maxi Box intake.

The engine is 408 inches, 4v iron heads with closed chambers. It has Roush intake inserts installed and PME hi-port exhaust plates.

The Roush hi-port plates were no longer available at the time when I bought the BME intake and inserts from Red at Roush racing in 1990.

It is 10.0:1 compression so it is pump gas friendly and has a custom solid flat tappet cam.

The only work done to the intake was the floor of the ports were epoxied up to match the height of the intake inserts about 6 inches into the intake runners, and it has Pro Systems 1050 dominator installed on top.

The engine made 582 HP at 6800.

Please PM me if you have questions not related to the thread topic.

Thanks, Mike H.

[fekbmax]

Jay,
Would it be practical to 0 ring the intake side of the adapter ? (You may have commented on this before).  I have thought about it a few times, especially not having dyno access and having to use the drag strip and data acquisition for back to back test and tuning. It could possibly help make the intake switch a little easier. Unless you guys can recommend a good gasket that would be re usable a few times and wouldn't need any sealant.  I like the way the Mr gasket's fit but for some reason i just cant help myself and always use a tiny bit of sealant.  Is the O ring plausible or just a plane bad idea ?

[Joe-JDC]

Jay,
Would it be practical to 0 ring the intake side of the adapter ? (You may have commented on this before).  I have thought about it a few times, especially not having dyno access and having to use the drag strip and data acquisition for back to back test and tuning. It could possibly help make the intake switch a little easier. Unless you guys can recommend a good gasket that would be re usable a few times and wouldn't need any sealant.  I like the way the Mr gasket's fit but for some reason i just cant help myself and always use a tiny bit of sealant.  Is the O ring plausible or just a plane bad idea ?

If you use a paper style gasket/asbestos style, you can use a small amount of gasket cement on the head side, and then use white grease(lithium grease) on the intake side, and the manifolds will seal 100%, but not stick for removal and quick changes.  I have done this on dyno testing intakes and carburetors for three days using one set of gaskets.  If you want to leave the last intake on, it will still seal, and eventually the white grease will soak completely into the gasket, and dry out some, but the intake will still come off easily.  Since there is no water, it is a cost effective way to reuse the same intake gaskets many times.  Learned this trick from Ted Eaton.  Joe-JDC

[jayb]

Keith, what Joe says works fine, and in fact I've been running the same set of intake gaskets on the dyno mule for all the intakes I've tested so far.  I haven't even been using the grease, just used TA-31 to glue the gasket to the intake adapter, and it seems to stay in place and still allow the intake to be removed.  A couple of times I've had the gasket pull away from the adapter a bit but I've just been gluing it back down, and it still works fine and seals to the intakes with no issues.  I'm sure I could avoid pulling the gasket away from the adapter if I had used some grease.

With the intake adapter as is, one issue regarding the O-Rings is that it is designed to use a 0.060" gasket between the intake and the adapter.  So, if you took that out, the manifolds would fit too low on the adapter.  Also, when I was looking at doing this originally, after seeing a bunch of different 351C intakes it was not clear to me that I could design an O-ring groove that would allow the O-ring to contact the port face of every intake.  It seemed that some would miss on the inside of the manifold port, and some would miss on the outside, etc. etc.  So even if I had left an additional 0.060" on the face of the adapter, I don't think I could have designed an O-ring groove that would fit properly on every 351C manifold.  So, the gasket became the best option.

FYI I am running the last intake tests, with Joe's Trick Flow intakes, today.  After today Royce's Engine Masters engine will be going on the dyno, and we'll be running that this weekend.  So, latest early next week I should have all the data collected and a post written with all the results.

[fekbmax]

Sounds like a plan, thanks guys for the info. Now i just gotta do some testing and tuning lol. First things first though, its chassis set up weekend.

[cjshaker]

First things first though, its chassis set up weekend.

Keith, does that mean you're making some passes to sort it out, or just installing?

[fekbmax]

No, i wont be making any passes this weekend. I'll be spending my time Baselining the chassis. Something that alot of people neglect and don't fully do. I'll start by establishing a centerline and then Squaring the chassis, Squaring the rear suspension making sure everything is parallel, checking pinion angle, making sure the rear axle is perpendicular to the centerline, checking wheel base and check the suspension both front and rear for binding. Checking the front suspension for alignment and BUMP STEER, checking and setting preload and ride height, finding instant center and calculating the percentage of rise. Of course this involves scaling the car front to rear and all 4 corners. So anyway i plan on being plenty busy this weekend. Its alot of work and of course its all base line but i enjoy it and believe its well worth the efforts in the end. Anything to make the actual limited drag strip testing go as smoothly as it can..  A few guy plan on renting the track in a few week's and I'm hoping to be ready to tag along. 

[KMcCullah]

What happened with the 13006 intake adaptor/Edelbrock 2863 combo?