My 427 SOHC Build..... Finally the time has come!

[My427stang]

Try to get it close and get me those running values when you can.  In the end, you could always drive the TBs with a different controller, but I don't think you need that yet.

I still think the 60 BTDC timing is screaming at you telling you something isn't marked right or   Just doesn't make sense

[cobracammer]

Hi Ross,

I will definitely get you those #'s.  I just have a few things to do (change out oil filter and redo the plumbing on the radiator) and then I will get her started again.  I will post another video.... I will also try and go through each screen of the handheld so we can see everything.  Unfortunately (Unlinke the FAST EFI 2.0) where all of the live data is on one screen....  This version has like 5 different screens you have to scroll through.

Thanks again

[Heo]

Just a thought! Is the cams timed right when you have to run 60 deg.ingnition
and the engines minor respond to you rotating the distributor
and you timed the cams after the old 0 mark that was wrong??

[machoneman]

Heo may be on to something here!

Jay may be the best one the one to really answer but....if TDC wasn't anywhere near correct beforehand, how can the cam timing be correct?

Yet, it did run albeit with 60 degrees BTDC.

'Course, one way to check is to degree the cams now in light of a correct or almost near correct TDC mark. 

[jayb]

Very good point, Heo.  Jason, I hate to open that can of worms again but you should do what you need to do to accurately find TDC, with a piston stop, and then check the cam timing.  If the original TDC mark was off, your cam timing is off, and the engine won't run right if the cam timing is off by much.

I'd suggest you torque that front bolt on the crank way up, so that you can turn the engine backwards with it, or else pull the starter, or the inspection cover on the bell (if there is one), so you can rotate the flywheel backwards with a screwdriver in the teeth (careful with that, so you don't damage the teeth).  Or, find some other way to turn the engine backwards so you can use the piston stop to find TDC.  Once you are positive on the location of TDC, you can check the cam timing the way you did before.

I can imagine how frustrated you must be at this point, but hang in there, you'll get it worked out...

[drdano]

Dumb question, but timing is being set on front passenger side cylinder right?

If you took a long plastic straw and dropped it through the #1 plug hole as you very slowly turned the motor over, you should be able to feel roughly where TDC is with the rise and fall of the piston.  That would at least get you in the ballpark.  May take a few revolutions, but I think you could get a really good idea where true TDC is at.

[WConley]

Heo makes a good point!  I wonder if the cam timing is retarded.  That would make it harder to start for sure! 

That's dangerous territory on a SOHC, as we all know.  Hopefully Jason hasn't hurt any exhaust valves from closing too late.

- Bill

[cobracammer]

Hey guys. Cam timing is correct (100% sure) because i did this when I had TDC correct ( with the temporary pointer and the degree wheel). I checked cam timing 3 times. Lol  Of note, Jay had me alter the time caming a little on each cam (right was different then left)....  105 degrees on the drivers side cam and 102 degrees on the passenger side cam.  I think (and I may be wrong) this was in anticipation of chain stretch?

If you all remember, the cams I got from Racedyne were not marked correctly. This is basically why I had to ignore the cams marks and degree the cams solely with the dial indicator.

I originally had TDC correct (again 100% sure) with the degree wheel.  The wire timing pointer you use with the degree wheel was my source for TDC.  It was at this point (because where the timing pointer that gets installed on the timing cover did not point to "true" TDC) that I should have used a timing tape to mark TDC.

Long story short, I am 1000% sure on the cams.  I even checked how much room I had between the piston and the valves at 15 degrees BDTC, 10 degrees, 5 degrees, TDC and up to 15 degrees ATDC.  All of this checked out perfectly too.

After I timed the cams the last time, I even turned the engine over to make sure that the intake valve and exhaust valves opened where the cam card said they should (checking it against the degree wheel and the wire pointer.

All in all, my biggest mistake in this whole build was not marking TDC with a timing tape (because the balancer TDC did not show true TDC as found with the degree wheel) at that time.

I may take Jays advice and Tighten that crank bolt tighter in order to be able to turn the crank backward....  And be exactly on TDC instead of 2 or 3 degrees off in one direction or the other.

[blykins]

Yes, cam timing is set when you degree, in which you should have found true TDC with the degree wheel.   Has nothing to do with the harmonic balancer.  If you used a piston stop in conjunction with the degree wheel, then based your cam timing adjustments off of that, you should be good. 

I don't think I followed when you were bolting on the timing pointer/balancer, but is there a valid reason to believe that it's jacked up?  I've seen balancers out 2-3 degrees, then we have the normal 7° issue with ATI's, but other than that, you shouldn't have a 30-40 degree discrepancy unless the pointer is in the wrong spot and you didn't remark the balancer.

Does the computer control the amount of ignition timing advance?  Do you have REALLY fast curve?

[jayb]

Hey guys. Cam timing is correct because i dis this when I had TDC correct ( with the temporary pointer and the degree wheel). I checked cam timing 3 times. Lol

Well, that's a relief LOL!  (As you can see, we are all pulling for you...)

[cobracammer]

From what I remember, the Area where the timing pointer went was not close to TDC as it was found with the degree wheel. Its a pioneer harmonic balancer.

Efi system does not control timing, so jay suggested the correct bushing and spring combo to use in the MSD distributor

[machoneman]

If you need to jam something into the flywheel teeth to get max torque and don't have a pro tool, grab a 2X4 (no kidding) cut to size and jam that in.  It may fracture and get splintered at 150 lbs/ft but it will not damage the teeth. No kidding!

[cobracammer]

Cant i just put itt in gear and leave the back tires on the ground?  Then I can torque?

[Heo]

Put it i the highest gear and parkingbrake on that shall do it
but for safetys sake dont lay under it if you have the front
end on jackstands

[machoneman]

Cant i just put itt in gear and leave the back tires on the ground?  Then I can torque?

As Heo said, I wouldn't. As mentioned you could instead jack it up (rears) and set your emergency parking brake. If the brake slips as you approach 150 lbs, no harm to you or the car!