Author Topic: FE Power Cylinder Heads - More Test Results  (Read 17083 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

blykins

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4822
    • View Profile
    • Lykins Motorsports
Re: FE Power Cylinder Heads - More Test Results
« Reply #30 on: January 18, 2021, 02:52:07 PM »
According to motion ratio, there should be a little difference in lift, I figure .008.

That based on the push rod angle of 7.72* (std PR length of 9.59 x 1.3 offset, 1.3/9.59 = .1355 tan = 7.72*). The motion ratio of 7.72* = cosin of the angle or, .991. .991 x .5 cam lift = .4955. .4955x 1.76 = .872

A checker spring test should show this.

You have to watch about using checking springs in that situation.   They can give you a false reading of lift because most rockers have a little more ratio engineered into them to combat deflection.   You can easily get .060-.070" MORE lift with a checking spring than you actually have.  Jay's may not be this way because he designed them, but if you were to test a T&D rocker or similar, you'd be surprised on the results.

Short of a Spintron, we don't really know what happens at rpm, so the closest thing we can check is a static situation, by checking lift at the valve with the actual components that will be used in the engine.

As Barry mentioned, an offset lifter would probably help quite a bit in Jay's case, in order to get the pushrod to a more vertical situation.  Less spring pressure will help quite a bit too now that Jay has proven his rocker arms. 
« Last Edit: January 18, 2021, 02:56:11 PM by blykins »
Brent Lykins
Lykins Motorsports
Custom FE Street, Drag Race, Road Race, and Pulling Truck Engines
Custom Roller & Flat Tappet Camshafts
www.lykinsmotorsports.com
brent@lykinsmotorsports.com
www.customfordcams.com
502-759-1431
Instagram:  brentlykinsmotorsports
YouTube:  Lykins Motorsports

jayb

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7405
    • View Profile
    • FE Power
Re: FE Power Cylinder Heads - More Test Results
« Reply #31 on: January 18, 2021, 02:56:06 PM »
Very good news imo on the SE head performance, ie more potential customers...
Do you think the SE head is overperforming expectations or is there alot more potential for the RE head?

The SE head is definitely overperforming MY expectations, but I think there is more power to be had in both head types.  Gotta get 'er dialed in.  I'm hoping I'll be able to offer up a recipe for a bracket race FE making 900+ horsepower, without a lot of special porting work.
Jay Brown
- 1969 Mach 1, Drag Week 2005 Winner NA/BB, 511" FE (10.60s @ 129); Drag Week 2007 Runner-Up PA/BB, 490" Supercharged FE (9.35 @ 151)
- 1964 Ford Galaxie, Drag Week 2009 Winner Modified NA (9.50s @ 143), 585" SOHC
- 1969 Shelby Clone, Drag Week 2015 Winner Modified NA (Average 8.98 @ 149), 585" SOHC

   

jayb

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7405
    • View Profile
    • FE Power
Re: FE Power Cylinder Heads - More Test Results
« Reply #32 on: January 18, 2021, 03:27:46 PM »
OK, I just installed a checker spring on one of the valves, and got 0.872" lift.  Calculated lift with the measured lash is 0.860".  So assuming the cam is ground correctly with a 0.500" lobe, my rocker ratio is just a bit high at 1.78:1.  And also, I'm losing about .050" in lift due to valvetrain deflection.
« Last Edit: January 18, 2021, 03:30:03 PM by jayb »
Jay Brown
- 1969 Mach 1, Drag Week 2005 Winner NA/BB, 511" FE (10.60s @ 129); Drag Week 2007 Runner-Up PA/BB, 490" Supercharged FE (9.35 @ 151)
- 1964 Ford Galaxie, Drag Week 2009 Winner Modified NA (9.50s @ 143), 585" SOHC
- 1969 Shelby Clone, Drag Week 2015 Winner Modified NA (Average 8.98 @ 149), 585" SOHC

   

blykins

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4822
    • View Profile
    • Lykins Motorsports
Re: FE Power Cylinder Heads - More Test Results
« Reply #33 on: January 18, 2021, 03:44:58 PM »
OK, I just installed a checker spring on one of the valves, and got 0.872" lift.  Calculated lift with the measured lash is 0.860".  So assuming the cam is ground correctly with a 0.500" lobe, my rocker ratio is just a bit high at 1.78:1.  And also, I'm losing about .050" in lift due to valvetrain deflection.

A .050" loss is quite a bit statically.  Next time you have the intake off, maybe you could try a 1/2 or 9/16" pushrod to see if it helps.  Reduced spring pressure would probably help as well. 
Brent Lykins
Lykins Motorsports
Custom FE Street, Drag Race, Road Race, and Pulling Truck Engines
Custom Roller & Flat Tappet Camshafts
www.lykinsmotorsports.com
brent@lykinsmotorsports.com
www.customfordcams.com
502-759-1431
Instagram:  brentlykinsmotorsports
YouTube:  Lykins Motorsports

Cyclone03

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 338
    • View Profile
Re: FE Power Cylinder Heads - More Test Results
« Reply #34 on: January 18, 2021, 04:19:11 PM »


 Gotta get 'er dialed in.  I'm hoping I'll be able to offer up a recipe for a bracket race FE making 900+ horsepower, without a lot of special porting work.


Let’s all just think about that last sentence ,how many FE’s are out there making rounds with 900hp?
Lance H

Dumpling

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 394
    • View Profile
Re: FE Power Cylinder Heads - More Test Results
« Reply #35 on: January 18, 2021, 05:32:51 PM »


 Gotta get 'er dialed in.  I'm hoping I'll be able to offer up a recipe for a bracket race FE making 900+ horsepower, without a lot of special porting work.


Let’s all just think about that last sentence ,how many FE’s are out there making rounds with 900hp?

Rough math, (427/510)x850 = 711 HP for a 427 cubic inch FE..
« Last Edit: January 18, 2021, 05:35:45 PM by Dumpling »

cammerfe

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1659
    • View Profile
Re: FE Power Cylinder Heads - More Test Results
« Reply #36 on: January 18, 2021, 10:42:22 PM »


 Gotta get 'er dialed in.  I'm hoping I'll be able to offer up a recipe for a bracket race FE making 900+ horsepower, without a lot of special porting work.


Let’s all just think about that last sentence ,how many FE’s are out there making rounds with 900hp?

Ask instead, "How many FEs will be out there making rounds when the 900 HP IS available?"

1968galaxie

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 311
    • View Profile
Re: FE Power Cylinder Heads - More Test Results
« Reply #37 on: January 19, 2021, 11:05:33 AM »
There are a few 900+ HP Fe's making rounds already - not many but a few.
Costly engines for sure - Pro-port high riser modified type cylinder heads.
Not exactly low cost. I believe the FE Power heads are being developed to fill a void.

Would be fantastic to see a 900+ HP FE compete in price with a 385 series engine with A460 heads.
Just need a competitively priced block capable of 500+ inches to go along with an awesome cylinder head package!!

e philpott

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 923
    • View Profile
Re: FE Power Cylinder Heads - More Test Results
« Reply #38 on: January 19, 2021, 12:41:45 PM »
maybe 4 or so traditional design that crack 1000 hp na

Barry_R

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1915
    • View Profile
    • Survival Motorsports
Re: FE Power Cylinder Heads - More Test Results
« Reply #39 on: February 17, 2021, 05:53:27 PM »

philminotti

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 115
    • View Profile
Re: FE Power Cylinder Heads - More Test Results
« Reply #40 on: February 17, 2021, 07:21:41 PM »
That was incredibly interesting.  It makes you realize that the dynamics of the induction system up to intake valve of a NA engine is far more complex than it appears and that NA intake flow is a nearly endless series of compromises.  Any thoughts about the sharp turn on your crossram Jay?  Like he said, race engineers don't need to contend with packaging requirements like hood line.  Great video.

WConley

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1160
  • No longer walking funny!
    • View Profile
Re: FE Power Cylinder Heads - More Test Results
« Reply #41 on: February 17, 2021, 07:54:42 PM »
A certain guy named Larry Widmer would take exception to that "never supersonic flow in an intake or exhaust tract" statement.  Widmer created Glidden's winning Cleveland and Shotgun engines.  That Boss 9's secret sauce was supersonic exhaust ports.

I'd agree that sonic choking is a hard limit in an intake tract.  Compressibility creates a standing shock at the choke point, which is the classic "sound barrier".  I've seen it many times in wind tunnels.
A careful study of failure will yield the ingredients for success.

jayb

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7405
    • View Profile
    • FE Power
Re: FE Power Cylinder Heads - More Test Results
« Reply #42 on: February 17, 2021, 09:37:18 PM »
That was incredibly interesting.  It makes you realize that the dynamics of the induction system up to intake valve of a NA engine is far more complex than it appears and that NA intake flow is a nearly endless series of compromises.  Any thoughts about the sharp turn on your crossram Jay?  Like he said, race engineers don't need to contend with packaging requirements like hood line.  Great video.

That was an interesting video, although I've read about most of that stuff before.  Key points are that the last couple inches of the port before it hits the valve are much more important than the rest of the induction tract, and that hitting that 0.55 Mach number causes the engine to hang at the peak power level, if the cam is designed to make it run a little higher.  After I changed cam in the dyno mule, and didn't really see a big increase in the RPM where the engine peaked in power, I'd kind of concluded that the port cross sectional area needed to be increased; i.e. the velocity was too high to get the HP level any higher.  Watching the video kind of reinforced this for me.

On the crossram, especially the #1 and #8 runners have some pretty good turns in them prior to hitting the head port, and I'm sure that will hurt peak power production.  But the crossram is designed with long runners, to make a lot of low end torque at the cost of some top end power, and also they have to fit under the hood of the car.  And since the really key area, the head port, is still the same, I'm hoping the effect on peak power won't be real dramatic.  It's finally starting to warm up here now, so we'll get back on the dyno and see in a few days...
Jay Brown
- 1969 Mach 1, Drag Week 2005 Winner NA/BB, 511" FE (10.60s @ 129); Drag Week 2007 Runner-Up PA/BB, 490" Supercharged FE (9.35 @ 151)
- 1964 Ford Galaxie, Drag Week 2009 Winner Modified NA (9.50s @ 143), 585" SOHC
- 1969 Shelby Clone, Drag Week 2015 Winner Modified NA (Average 8.98 @ 149), 585" SOHC

   

Blueoval77

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 173
    • View Profile
Re: FE Power Cylinder Heads - More Test Results
« Reply #43 on: February 17, 2021, 10:24:11 PM »
I shudder to ask what you consider "Warm" up there Jay......

jayb

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7405
    • View Profile
    • FE Power
Re: FE Power Cylinder Heads - More Test Results
« Reply #44 on: February 17, 2021, 10:57:34 PM »
Anything over 15 degrees is a freaking heat wave these days... :o
Jay Brown
- 1969 Mach 1, Drag Week 2005 Winner NA/BB, 511" FE (10.60s @ 129); Drag Week 2007 Runner-Up PA/BB, 490" Supercharged FE (9.35 @ 151)
- 1964 Ford Galaxie, Drag Week 2009 Winner Modified NA (9.50s @ 143), 585" SOHC
- 1969 Shelby Clone, Drag Week 2015 Winner Modified NA (Average 8.98 @ 149), 585" SOHC