Author Topic: 360 horse 352  (Read 7718 times)

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mbrunson427

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Re: 360 horse 352
« Reply #15 on: September 08, 2020, 09:57:30 AM »
Here's the things you can look for fairly simply that aren't internal to the engine.

-3/8" fuel line
-AC 10 bolt fuel pump
-generator has large pulley
-3 row radiator, the core should fill up the radiator space front to back
-3" wide front drum brakes
-no power steering, no power brakes
-On the door data plate, needs to be a Y-code, the axle code spot left blank
-if you get lucky the KH wheels will be left on it with the cats eye slots in them.
-5 leaf rear leaf springs

some pictures:





Royce

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Re: 360 horse 352
« Reply #16 on: September 08, 2020, 10:10:01 AM »
OK  big gen pulley check.. Y code Check..no ps psb check. COAE D heads  check,  Shorty manifold check, 3 inch drums Check, 3/8 fuel line check,
I will look at the wheels, fuel pump, leaf springs. What is the correct carb list number?
1955 Thunderbird Competition Coupe Altered Chassis "War Bird" 383 Lincoln Y block 520 hp
1955 Thunderbird 292 275 hp Y Block
1956 Ford Victoria 292 Y block
800hp 476 cu in Edsel MEL.. 2 time EMC winner
1957 Mercury 2dr Wagon "Battle Wagon" drag car  Currently engineless,  Boss 9 transplant coming soon.
1957 Thunderbird Glass body Tube Chassis drag car 333 cu in 500 hp Ford Y block
1958 Mercury Monterey  430cu in 400hp 3x2 Super Marauder
1961 Starliner 390/375 clone
1960 Starliner 352/360hp, real one
1966 Falcon Pro Touring project

mbrunson427

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Re: 360 horse 352
« Reply #17 on: September 08, 2020, 10:22:48 AM »
If it has all that then you're pretty much there.

Carb is a Holley 2112 List. Part# C0AE-9510-AA


WerbyFord

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Re: 360 horse 352
« Reply #18 on: September 08, 2020, 12:03:50 PM »

Before the 360HP Ford had any manufacturer offered an engine as completely engineered with unique parts from air cleaner to exhaust manifolds? Seems to me this was the first to have what became all of the standard bits and pieces that constituted a muscle car engine.

Maybe the Chevy W-Motor 348/335hp-6v of 1959.
Quite a few eg Mouse Motors had special cam and carbs already.
AFAIK the 348/335-6v was the 1st to ALSO have special heads and exhaust manifolds AND be factory production.

Unless you count the 1950s Hemi's.

Pontiac had lots of full-on combos starting in 1956 but most/all were "over the counter" so I would not count those.

The Merc 430/400-6v of 1958 might well have been the 1st one, if produced as planned.
I'm convinced that the 400hp was a real prototype, but with early heads, and cam that didn't make production.
Gonkulator puts the production 1958-1/2 430/400-6v at about 345 gross HP.

wayne

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Re: 360 horse 352
« Reply #19 on: September 08, 2020, 01:17:11 PM »
A friend had a 60 two door post  in 69 or 70 with a 3 speed od it had one hell of a top end we did not know it was a 352-360 guy he got it from said  it was a pi.I know for sure it was way north of 120 next to a six pack runner.Know now thats what it was.
« Last Edit: September 09, 2020, 11:38:19 AM by wayne »

pbf777

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Re: 360 horse 352
« Reply #20 on: September 08, 2020, 01:21:13 PM »
The Merc 430/400-6v of 1958 might well have been the 1st one, if produced as planned.
I'm convinced that the 400hp was a real prototype, but with early heads, and cam that didn't make production.
Gonkulator puts the production 1958-1/2 430/400-6v at about 345 gross HP.


    I don't know of any special cylinder head castings, but I believe in the original pre-production configuration there was a camshaft change intention, but this was lost probably due to the drivability complaint concerns associated (maybe just the vac. wipers wouldn't work?     ::) ) by the time the "Super Marauder" option "J"  code on ones' '58 Mercury Marauder meet with available production. 

    But, it's the torque that moves these "boats" around, and the 430 MEL wasn't nick-named the "Bulldozer" for nothin' !                ;)

    Scott.

Royce

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Re: 360 horse 352
« Reply #21 on: September 08, 2020, 02:43:45 PM »
There was a running change on the 58 430 due to customer complaints about idle quality.. They softened up the cam and reduced the size of the intake valve.  The 430 really got neutered in 60 with a 2bbl carb.. The super marauder package was induction only,  no special cam or head.  Based on my experience I would say the 430 6V actually made about .85-.90 hp/cu in. The 6V intake is not a performance piece.. I think the single 4bbl is actually a better manifold.  It does have the coolest air cleaner ever put on an American car though. That's worth 50 hp
1955 Thunderbird Competition Coupe Altered Chassis "War Bird" 383 Lincoln Y block 520 hp
1955 Thunderbird 292 275 hp Y Block
1956 Ford Victoria 292 Y block
800hp 476 cu in Edsel MEL.. 2 time EMC winner
1957 Mercury 2dr Wagon "Battle Wagon" drag car  Currently engineless,  Boss 9 transplant coming soon.
1957 Thunderbird Glass body Tube Chassis drag car 333 cu in 500 hp Ford Y block
1958 Mercury Monterey  430cu in 400hp 3x2 Super Marauder
1961 Starliner 390/375 clone
1960 Starliner 352/360hp, real one
1966 Falcon Pro Touring project

C6AE

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Re: 360 horse 352
« Reply #22 on: September 08, 2020, 05:25:05 PM »

Before the 360HP Ford had any manufacturer offered an engine as completely engineered with unique parts from air cleaner to exhaust manifolds? Seems to me this was the first to have what became all of the standard bits and pieces that constituted a muscle car engine.
As Werby mentioned, the Chrysler 300 series... (In particular the 300C with fuel injection in 1958)
Much like the the early 60's Mopars, these cars were rare but real contenders and sort of set the standard for street racing. Not that I ever did that!
more here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chrysler_300_letter_series

pbf777

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Re: 360 horse 352
« Reply #23 on: September 08, 2020, 05:44:34 PM »
The 430 really got neutered in 60 with a 2bbl carb.....................  It does have the coolest air cleaner ever put on an American car though. That's worth 50 hp!   


     Fortunately, at least the '60 "J" code Thunderbird's were build with the '59 specification engines.        8)

     And, dog-gone-it, that air cleaner doesn't fit (without modifications) under the hood of the T-Bird; but I guess considering what they sell for these days it wouldn't work out as cheap H.P. anyway!        ::)

     Scott



     




     

RJP

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Re: 360 horse 352
« Reply #24 on: September 09, 2020, 02:05:48 PM »
I think some of you who posted and criticized the 360hp/352 are a little harsh on the first high performance FE ever. It is very easy to look back 60+ years, play the "what if" game and lament of what Ford should have done. Very easy to say now, 60+ years later. One poster criticized the 360/352 intake manifold, which, IMO it was not bad considering it was said to be a "layed out" on Don Sullivan's kitchen table and using only Sullivan's knowledge, common sense and the sound of the engine was the only way they had a general idea the manifold worked. No flow benches, no dyno testing because the 4 man team [Sulliven, Frey, John Cowley, a chassis/suspension engineer and Bill Innes from engine/foundry div.] did not rank high enough on the corporate food chain to have access to dyno facilities. In one link posted in this thread showed the 360hp/352 was a close second to the Pontiac which the article indicated the Pontiac was a "ringer" set up by the Royal Pontiac dealership for the 4 car test. Pontiac used the 'Tripower" on a 389 which also had a 37 cubic inch advantage, had an Isky cam and several other "options" the Pontiac had over the Ford. IMO the Ford did remarkably well considering the lack of experience, lack of time involved and lack of manpower that the Pontiac/GM enjoyed over that of the Ford "team".  Also consider that GM went "underground" since June 1957 when the AMA passed a resolution that all car mfgs. would adhere to the "racing ban" and the advertising of horsepower, racing and any other type of speed contest. GM then marketed their high performance parts as "police/emergency vehicle" or "heavy duty". Ford purged any and all parts connected to high performance and racing and got completely out of the high performance market which as a result left GM with a 2 year advantage over Ford.   

allrightmike

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Re: 360 horse 352
« Reply #25 on: September 09, 2020, 02:32:30 PM »
What was the general nature of the high performance cams ford used back then? Long duration low lift?

RJP

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Re: 360 horse 352
« Reply #26 on: September 09, 2020, 03:39:23 PM »
What was the general nature of the high performance cams ford used back then? Long duration low lift?
Ford cams were mild compared to other factory HP cams. The HP-352/390/406 solid lifter cam [with minor timing changes only] was .479" lift using a .025" lash, 276 deg duration [advertised]  I don't know if they used the typical .004"-.006" lift to determine duration. Actual lobe lift should be .504". I still run an old 406 solid lifter cam [C2AZ 6250-A] in my Q code 66 Galaxie/428. For an antiquated and obviously obsolete cam it still runs pretty good. Valve timing: I/O 24* BTDC - I/C 72* ABDC- E/O 72* BBDC - E/C 24* ATDC, 48* overlap

wayne

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Re: 360 horse 352
« Reply #27 on: September 09, 2020, 08:00:03 PM »
I am sure i have read a 60 ford was the fastest car tested on daytona beach speed trials but i cant find it still looking

SSdynosaur

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Re: 360 horse 352
« Reply #28 on: September 09, 2020, 08:35:50 PM »
Don't overlook the fact that the post-57 AMA Racing Ban was actually requested by General Motors, Ford and Chrysler Corp. were eating GM's lunch in NASCAR and, as such, racing was becoming an advertising liability to the General.

wayne

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Re: 360 horse 352
« Reply #29 on: September 09, 2020, 09:52:39 PM »
Found it Vicki Wood 150 mph 60 two door post.John Barber ford Belleville michigan on the side of the car.
« Last Edit: September 09, 2020, 10:07:39 PM by wayne »