Author Topic: engine temp range  (Read 6147 times)

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62f100

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engine temp range
« on: April 08, 2013, 09:41:14 PM »
i have a stock 352. efi with warm up, iac & fan functions. i live in southern california so weather is usauly 60-80F. this being said do you think i should use a thermostat & if so what temp? what should i set my fans to come on at? while im asking any idle rpm suggestion for in gear & park? thank for any suggestion,dan.
62f100-352fe ,efi by megasquirt, cop,91 towncar frame&suspension.

plovett

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Re: engine temp range
« Reply #1 on: April 08, 2013, 11:12:25 PM »
In my opinion you should use a thermostat.   I think 180 degrees is the best bet for most old engines.   I've used a 160 degree thermostat before, but I noticed condensation in the valve cover breathers if I didn't take a longer trip and get the engine fully hot.   I changed to a 180 and it works better.   I don't see the need to go higher.

As for idle speed, I'll guess maybe around 850 in park and and 650 in drive.   That's just a guess though, and I like to err on the high side for idle speed.

paulie

66FAIRLANE

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Re: engine temp range
« Reply #2 on: April 09, 2013, 01:03:22 AM »
Yeh I would use a 180. Perhaps set fans to come on at 190ish. What sort of EFI do you have?

jayb

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Re: engine temp range
« Reply #3 on: April 09, 2013, 07:40:10 AM »
I'm a low temp guy, and always use a 160 degree thermostat and set the fans to come on at 170.  Why do you want to have two different idle speeds?  With EFI and your IAC you should be able to maintain a single speed.  I'd say 650 or 700...
Jay Brown
- 1969 Mach 1, Drag Week 2005 Winner NA/BB, 511" FE (10.60s @ 129); Drag Week 2007 Runner-Up PA/BB, 490" Supercharged FE (9.35 @ 151)
- 1964 Ford Galaxie, Drag Week 2009 Winner Modified NA (9.50s @ 143), 585" SOHC
- 1969 Shelby Clone, Drag Week 2015 Winner Modified NA (Average 8.98 @ 149), 585" SOHC

   

machoneman

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Re: engine temp range
« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2013, 09:25:54 AM »
180 for what sounds like a street-only driven car. Around 190-195 for the fans.  And yes, one should always use a stat for any street car or for racing, a restrictor plate (small hole in the center of essentially a flat plate).

I agree with the 160 stat for cars driven hard on the street (stoplight stuff and really high speed runs on the highway ) and to keep the intake charge as cool as possible. But heck, the tiny hp gain won't be missed driving around Rodeo Drive!
« Last Edit: April 09, 2013, 09:29:01 AM by machoneman »
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plovett

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Re: engine temp range
« Reply #5 on: April 09, 2013, 12:15:00 PM »
Why do you want to have two different idle speeds?  With EFI and your IAC you should be able to maintain a single speed.  I'd say 650 or 700...

I was thinking like a carburetor guy, Jay.    Actually my engine has at least 4 idle speeds:  1)cold in drive = 0.   2)cold in park = 0 unless you tap dance on the throttle.  3)warm in drive = 900.   4)warm in park/neutral = 1200.

Point taken on the EFI and IAC.    :)

paulie

My427stang

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Re: engine temp range
« Reply #6 on: April 09, 2013, 06:44:19 PM »
i have a stock 352. efi with warm up, iac & fan functions. i live in southern california so weather is usauly 60-80F. this being said do you think i should use a thermostat & if so what temp? what should i set my fans to come on at? while im asking any idle rpm suggestion for in gear & park? thank for any suggestion,dan.

How does your Megasquirt deal with coolant temp?  I imagine you can tune it to behave however you want, but I'd guess it would like some sort of minimum temp to change from one fuel curve to another.

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Ross
Bullock's Power Service, LLC
- 70 Fastback Mustang, 489 cid FE, Victor, SEFI, Erson SFT cam, TKO-600 5 speed, 4.11 9 inch.
- 71 F100 shortbed 4x4, 461 cid FE, headers, Victor Pro-flo EFI, Comp Custom HFT cam, 3.50 9 inch

jayb

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Re: engine temp range
« Reply #7 on: April 09, 2013, 07:15:04 PM »
Ross, here's an excerpt from the manual showing how coolant temp affects some parameters:

Cold Accel Enrichment (ms): The acceleration enrichment pulse also
varies depending upon coolant temperature. The value specified here is the
pulse width added to the value from the bin calculations at -40 F. The
Cold Acceleration Enrichment amount is linearly interpolated from full
amount at -40 F down to zero at 165 F. A typical value might be 2.0 ms.

o Cold Accel Multiplier (%): Another means for increasing the amount of
fuel delivered by the acceleration enrichment pulse is supplied by this
value; it is likewise interpolated from the full specified amount at -40F
down to zero at 165 F. Before the Cold Acceleration Enrichment value is
added to the base acceleration enrichment pulse width, it is multiplied by
this value. Total AE = Base AE * CAM + CAE The difference between
the two types of AE cold modify can be easily seen with a few examples:

1) Assume we have a calculated AE pulse of 5.0 ms. Say our coolant
temperature is 40 F, giving a CAE pulse of 2.0 ms and CAM is turned off
(100%). The result is 5.0+2.0 = 7.0 ms.

2) Assume same base AE and temperature, but now we turn off CAE (0.0
ms) and set CAM to give 140%. The result is the same, we get 5.0*1.4 =
7.0 ms.
Jay Brown
- 1969 Mach 1, Drag Week 2005 Winner NA/BB, 511" FE (10.60s @ 129); Drag Week 2007 Runner-Up PA/BB, 490" Supercharged FE (9.35 @ 151)
- 1964 Ford Galaxie, Drag Week 2009 Winner Modified NA (9.50s @ 143), 585" SOHC
- 1969 Shelby Clone, Drag Week 2015 Winner Modified NA (Average 8.98 @ 149), 585" SOHC

   

62f100

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Re: engine temp range
« Reply #8 on: April 10, 2013, 12:28:38 AM »
thanks for all the great replay. :) efi is megasquirt ms3 with msx board. Running semi-sequential till I get my cam sensor built. The truck is a weekend toy that's going to see a lot of light to light & freeway action on the way to various car shows. So I think the 160° will be my best bet. As for idle I was worried that 650 rpm may be to low for power steering & c6 trans. So that why I asked for two rpm. After doing a little driving 650rpm seems to be too slow for the ps pump. That's probably my pully ratio though. There a lot of custom made  stuff on the motor. I'm going to try to post a member project soon.
 thanks again Dan. P.s. I have short YouTube of the motor running. There posted by "the62fordf100" I have figured the link thing yet.
62f100-352fe ,efi by megasquirt, cop,91 towncar frame&suspension.

My427stang

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Re: engine temp range
« Reply #9 on: April 10, 2013, 06:46:33 AM »
I'd run a 180

If the cold enrichment circuits go to zero at 165, a 160 will probably run real close, but why run on the edge of that circuit?  The 180 takes that multiplier cleanly out of the picture.  In addition, the thermostat wont affect how it behaves in traffic, that is primarily radiator and fan combo. 

FWIW I ran a 195 in mine because literature said I had to, I went into the program and realized 155 was my cold enrichment limit, so I went with a 180.  Absolutely no difference in behavior except the needle is in a slightly different location other gauge LOL

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Ross
Bullock's Power Service, LLC
- 70 Fastback Mustang, 489 cid FE, Victor, SEFI, Erson SFT cam, TKO-600 5 speed, 4.11 9 inch.
- 71 F100 shortbed 4x4, 461 cid FE, headers, Victor Pro-flo EFI, Comp Custom HFT cam, 3.50 9 inch

lovehamr

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Re: engine temp range
« Reply #10 on: April 10, 2013, 08:53:50 AM »
I'm running a powerjection III set up on mine and use a 190 thermostat for the water.  The warmer your engine runs (to a point) the more efficient it is and the less wear you have.  There is something to be said for charge cooling but with a return type EFI it's not like the OP will have to worry about vapor lock.  If his engine, even with EFI, will idle at 650 rpm it's not like it's on the ragged edge needing the charge cooling effect of an overly cool engine.   And, as Ross pointed out, overall cooling is a function of the WP, fan and radiator.  No matter what thermostat you are using, if those aren't up to the task then the ride will over heat.  Therefore make the decision based on your engine and at what temp it will work best.

62f100

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Re: engine temp range
« Reply #11 on: April 11, 2013, 12:07:53 AM »
so then the question becomes what temp is too warm? Right now I'm running no thermostat & as expected It takes awhile to warm up to 145°. This is with iac idle at around 1300rpm,then at 145° its set to idle down to 600-650 rpm. After driving around its around 170-185° max so far. I'm still working on tuning & haven't taken it on the freeway.  I know from driving it before around 210 it starts to spit out alittle coolant. Thank for the input its good to hear everyone's experience. Btw the enrichment can be set to any temp you want.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2013, 12:11:37 AM by 62f100 »
62f100-352fe ,efi by megasquirt, cop,91 towncar frame&suspension.