69 Cobra (Torino) Factory Appearance?

[FESCJ]

Both Greg and 427fastback are correct, Drag Pack and SCJ are synonymous.

Boss 429's, Talladega, and to extent, Boss 302's are  anomaly's. Both the Boss 429 and Talladega used the oil cooler assy. But these car's were not RPO's. They were being built to homologate the 429 engine and Talladega body for NASCAR. Ford had to get both of these car's/engine done quickly in hopes of racing them at Daytona 69.

Boss 302's were an RPO option. In standard form, the car received a 3.50 open rear end. But,you could order 3.91/4.30 gears for this car. It appears that both of those ratio's gave you the oil cooler on a Boss 302. However, the cooler for the Boss 302 is not stated in the order guide.

Ford did some strange things with mixing and matching performance options. It has also been stated that Bunkie Knudsen had a lot to do with the craziness.

Brian

[427John]

I was also under the impression that there were 68 SCJ's that had nothing to do with the 3.91/4.30 rear gears.Was the 70 429SCJ also tied to the drag pack,there is some confusion on whether the engine codes are for CJ or SCJ,or ram air or non ram air,I always thought it was ram air or non ram air like it was with the 428 but there are people that are sure it is for CJ/SCJ.

[Gregwill16]

There were 68.5 and early 69 cars that had 3.91 or 4.30 gears that did not receive the SCJ components. That is where Ford learned they had an issue to address. So along came the SCJ components in the September 68 timeframe.

[427John]

There were 68.5 and early 69 cars that had 3.91 or 4.30 gears that did not receive the SCJ components. That is where Ford learned they had an issue to address. So along came the SCJ components in the September 68 timeframe.

So the Cobra Jet lightweights weren't SCJ?I knew they had the Canadian heads and the C8AX-C cam but always assumed they had SCJ shortblocks.But now that you bring up the 69 model year thing,I remember now that I have some super marked 428 pistons.Instead of where they normally have the CJ cast in them these have the word super cast there,I think they also have a C9 part number cast on them,I'll have to take another look at them to verify the part number,that would corroborate the timeline you gave.

[FESCJ]

I appreciate Jay rolling with this, kinda off topic, but fun regardless!

The 68 Mustang race car's, built in Dec, 67 were made so that Ford could go racing with the 428 engine. The 427 engine was expensive for Ford to build, the 428 much less expensive. Ford chose Pomona as the place to introduce it, with each car being given (actually sold very cheaply) to each team. These were really race car's, not an RPO option.

The CJ engine option became RPO in March/April 68.......which is why they are considered 68.5 cars. Yes, 3.91/4.30 gears were available, but not SCJ/Drag Pack.

There were no special engine codes to denote an SCJ apart from CJ in 69. Q code denotes non ram air, R code denotes ram air. As stated, early in the model year 69, the only way to get the SCJ engine, was in conjunction with ordering 3.91/4.30 gears....Mustang, Cougar, Torino,Cyclone. Later in 69 ( Feb, 69) this became known as Drag Pack.

Also remember the oil pan issue which delayed SCJ production until November 68.

428CJ pistons and the 428 Super piston has alway's been a source of confusion. There is no SCJ piston, CJ/SCJ were the same cast aluminum piston made by TRW. The early 428 CJ piston had issues in the pin boss area and would tend to crack. An updated part was released for production in Dec 68 to take care of this which is the piston cast as 428 super.

And yes, in 1970 Drag Pack and Super Drag Pack were available on the 428 Mustang's and Cougar's, as well as on 429 Torino's and Cyclone's.

Brian

[Rory428]

Concerning the 428 CJ piston situation, my understanding was that the earlier pistons were lighter, and as a running change , Ford changed to a slightly heavier piston, and these are the pistons that have "428 Super" cast around the pin boss. But regular (non SCJ) 428 CJs used this same piston. The 428 CJ in my 59 Ford is standard bore, and still is running it`s "428 Super" marked pistons, and it is a regular Cobra Jet, with a 1UB crank and 13/32" nut and bolt connecting rods. Despite misinformation over the years, the 428 Cobra Jet and Super Cobra Jet were indentical other than the SJs capscrew connecting rods, and the different crank, balancer/spacer/flywheel-flexplate which were needed to compensate for the heavier LeMans style rods. Same pistons, camshaft, intake, carb etc. No power difference, just a heavier bottom end.

[427John]

There has been so much misinformation on this over the years I can remember when it was believed that scj pistons were the lighter ones to help offset the extra weight of the Lemans rods,I knew about the cam,heads,intake and exhaust,there was nothing different on the production SCJ's to affect power production just durability upgrades.I had never heard about the problem with wrist pin bosses on the pistons cracking.I've always been surprised at how many 428's I've come across that have set of standard bore TRW forged L2303 pistons in them,and its not like they had been hot rodded everything else had been pretty much stock.I mean you occasionally find 390's with forged pistons too but they've usually been bored and had bigger cams or larger valves installed in the heads or some other kind of hot rod work.

[rockhouse66]

I always thought the later SCJ pistons were heavier.  But regardless, they were a different weight and required a different crank in a SCJ engine.  The 1UA was early, the 1UA "B" was later to compensate for the different piston weight.

[427John]

As far as the questions of the original post since there doesn't appear to be any consensus on the answer the bright side is that if you paint it all body color,it will be relatively easy to go back and add the blackout if necessary.You can look at it see what you think without it since you've already seen what it looks like with.I'm leaning toward doing the same with my Cyclone when I get it painted it came with the optional side hockey stick stripes,but being jade black with gold stripes,I'm not sure I'll like that much gold since the hood scoop and hood peak are supposed to be that color too.

[BrentL]

Hello Jay,
       I have had to do some touch up on my 69 Cobra Grille for rock chips and such. Here is the paint that I use. It is a perfect
match to the original colors.
SEM Matte Black #49133 for the bars and
Dupli-Color Ford Silver Frost #BFM0341 (TS)
for the perimeter. The upper and Lower Lips are Polished.
                                                     Thanks, Brent

[jayb]

Thanks Brent!  I took the grille out of the car the other day and found that the grill sections surrounding the headlights were blacked out in the middle but polished on the perimeter lips.  However, the center grille piece did not have any evidence of black paint.  My guess is that it is a replacement, done prior to when I purchased the car a few years ago...

[427John]

Thanks Brent!  I took the grille out of the car the other day and found that the grill sections surrounding the headlights were blacked out in the middle but polished on the perimeter lips.  However, the center grille piece did not have any evidence of black paint.  My guess is that it is a replacement, done prior to when I purchased the car a few years ago...

The grille blackout treatment seems to have been fairly commonly used in Fords performance models the 69 Cyclone CJ's used it too,it continued with the Cobra into later years also,and I believe with the Cyclone Spoilers too.

[Falcon67]

Definitely agree guys. What we know now is just a "in most cases" point of view. My 68 1/2 has 3 anomalies itself that the "experts" will say are not correct for the car. No one size fits all with these old cars.

LOL.  We went through that stuff with the 67 Mustang we owned at one time.  289/auto, nothing fancy. Not an early car as I recall, later in production.  But the entire windshield washer setup was all 1966 parts.  With the hood open you'd think "66" until you looked at the VIN stamp.  Ford did whatever it took to move the cars out the door IMHO.  I think I also have some 70 literature and as a Falcon guy, looked like the "Fairlane/Torino" line at that time was everything and the kitchen sink.  They got pretty standard under the metal around 67.  I could bolt 70 Fairlane sheet metal on my 67 Falcon, the chassis stuff measures nearly identical, if not exact.   Anyone up for a 67/69 Falcon/Fairlane notch back 4 door?  Ah, probably not.

[mike7570]

Oct.1968 HR magazine

[Joe-JDC]

Hot Rod pictures were Ford promotion pictures, not actual production pictures of the cars.  I never saw that Cobra sticker on the sides of the early cars, it came several months into the model year.  I bought a new Fairlane Cobra formal roof,  Ram Air, Four speed, when they first came out in 1968.  Joe-JDC