Kinda surprised

[475fetoploader]

So I bought a 390 core this weekend, took it to the shop and tore it down. It’s from a 1970 pickup. Standard bore, had ford part numbers on all the bearings, had ford part numbers on the intake gaskets, there’s no silicone from Joe’s garage anywhere. I think I may have actually gotten lucky. Typically my purchases have .060 over pistons 3 sleeves, and 2 bent rods. Thought I’d share a good experience.

[cammerfe]

 


KS

[BattlestarGalactic]

Ya, went through that 20 yrs ago looking for a good 428 block.  I think we tore down 3 before I found one that wasn't screwed up too bad and was std bore.  There were all those industrial pump motors so they were mostly scabbed together at some point in their life.

I just picked up a 410, though it was fixed at "Joe's Silicone Repair Shop", I think the bottom end is original.  I haven't gotten the pan off yet, but it had one Felpro head gasket on it and lots of blue smoo around the intake.

[4twennyAint]

Pretty cool and rare discovery.  50 years and never touched. 

[KsHighboy]

My dad bought me a 1968 f100 when I was 16. I ran that thing out of oil I don't know how many times. You know, dumb kid stuff. Throw a couple of qts in and she'd quiet right down. That was in the late 80's. I still have that original 390 sitting in my garage. You can pull the rod caps and look at the bearings and they still look pretty good. Always kept it around for a rebuild and it sounds like it was a good decision. I knew one day this old stuff would get tougher to find.

[TomP]

The last couple engines i've got lucky, a 272 Y Block (in case that is luck) that had never been apart and a 360 that sat full of water which froze in the pan yet was not cracked or rusty.

Almost makes up for the two 428's, a CJ that's .040 and has a sleeve and a 66 block that was .030 with two adjacent sleeves or the 427 that was cracked through the main web oil hole between the cam and crank.

[cjshaker]

When I partially disassembled the 390 in the '65 Galaxie, I was pleasantly surprised to find a standard bore block and stock bearings. As far as I can tell, the engine has never been apart in its 55 year history...at least until I partially took it apart in 2018. It was still running good with no smoke either.

If you think finding an all original FE is hard, try finding a flathead in the same shape. I've sold 2 flathead V8s in the last year. Both were untouched originals with no cracks in the valve seat areas. They were pulled from low mileage cars many many years ago and had never been apart until I pulled the heads and oil pans to check the blocks and bearings. They even still had the nylon cam gears still intact. To say the guys who bought them were extremely happy to get them, is an understatement. I have one left, but will be keeping it to build up with some vintage speed parts that I have.

[machoneman]

When I partially disassembled the 390 in the '65 Galaxies, I was pleasantly surprised to find a standard bore block and stock bearings. As far as I can tell, the engine has never been apart in its 55 year history...at least until I partially took it apart in 2018. It was still running good with no smoke either.

If you think finding an all original FE is hard, try finding a flathead in the same shape. I've sold 2 flathead V8s in the last year. Both were untouched originals with no cracks in the valve seat areas. They were pulled from low mileage cars many many years ago and had never been apart until I pulled the heads and oil pans to check the blocks and bearings. They even still had the nylon cam gears still intact. To say the guys who bought them were extremely happy to get them, is an understatement. I have one left, but will be keeping it to build up with some vintage speed parts that I have.

Did not know that Ford used nylon gears way back then. I swear, more Ford engines were lost to dried-up, cracked and fallen off nylon than any other cause. Too often, with years of hot oil and normal wear (loose chain slappin' around) the cam gear would  shed a big piece of nylon, instantly losing valve control, and smacking pistons to valves, often breaking a valve head and or cylinder wall and holing a piston or two.

'Bro James almost lost his gennie 18,000 mile 1970 Boss 302 engine to this fate. Just cruisin' along and blam, one bent valve and wrecked head. Mike Sea at Warshafsky's now old and likely closed north side Chicago shop fixed us up with a good used head and valves. 

Oddly enough, many an old full-sized Pontiac, circa '61-'64 with the 389 engines, also had bad nylon cam gears, gears we got very good at diagnosing and fixing. Good used tow cars btw, all of which we bought for a song as owners and even some shops didn't' know why the engine ran crappy or broke. Non-interference valves save the heads and blocks.

Anyway, Ford made a huge mistake as did GM in opting for those 'silent' nylon gears rather than noisy steel gears.

I'll ask how many others here either lost an engine or ran across mucho nylon in the oil pan. 

[fryedaddy]

i got lucky on a 66 gt 390. got it for 200 dollars.it was supposed to belong to a drag racer from way back.it has stock pistons,stock bearings,etc.it had washers under the rocker stands?

[frnkeore]

I believe the FH cam gear was a fiber, maybe phenalic but, not nylon.

I lost a 302, to the nylon cam sprocket. It deteriorated into many small chunks, and the oil pickup screen, didn't fit the round housing very well, leaving a small gap. A piece got into the oil pump and stopped the rotor from turning, twisting off the hex drive.

 

[Stangman]

Dropped a ton of oil pans for low pressure to find plastic from the gear blocking screen, never had a piece go through the screen. Before oil was as good as it is now between sludge from people not changing there oil enough to the broken gears it was fairly common.

[cjshaker]

I believe the FH cam gear was a fiber, maybe phenalic but, not nylon.

I lost a 302, to the nylon cam sprocket. It deteriorated into many small chunks, and the oil pickup screen, didn't fit the round housing very well, leaving a small gap. A piece got into the oil pump and stopped the rotor from turning, twisting off the hex drive.

 

Frank is right. It was my mistake to call them nylon, when they are actually a fiber gear. They didn't typically bust up like the later plastic ones, but they did wear out quicker, causing other issues. The typical replacements back then were aluminum, which I have a few of.

[plovett]

Did not know that Ford used nylon gears way back then. I swear, more Ford engines were lost to dried-up, cracked and fallen off nylon than any other cause. Too often, with years of hot oil and normal wear (loose chain slappin' around) the cam gear would  shed a big piece of nylon, instantly losing valve control, and smacking pistons to valves, often breaking a valve head and or cylinder wall and holing a piston or two.

'Bro James almost lost his gennie 18,000 mile 1970 Boss 302 engine to this fate. Just cruisin' along and blam, one bent valve and wrecked head. Mike Sea at Warshafsky's now old and likely closed north side Chicago shop fixed us up with a good used head and valves. 

Oddly enough, many an old full-sized Pontiac, circa '61-'64 with the 389 engines, also had bad nylon cam gears, gears we got very good at diagnosing and fixing. Good used tow cars btw, all of which we bought for a song as owners and even some shops didn't' know why the engine ran crappy or broke. Non-interference valves save the heads and blocks.

Anyway, Ford made a huge mistake as did GM in opting for those 'silent' nylon gears rather than noisy steel gears.

I'll ask how many others here either lost an engine or ran across mucho nylon in the oil pan.

I agree with that.  It reminds of everybody going to timing belts instead of chains.  For quietness and cost.   Now it swings back to chains.......

pl

[sixty9cobra]

don't forget petrified valve seals in the pan also.