Author Topic: 390 FE Carburetor Size  (Read 7833 times)

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RangerRat

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390 FE Carburetor Size
« on: November 16, 2019, 10:03:23 AM »
My motor-390, .030 over, flat top pistons, 9.7 compression, stock heads, Comp XE262 cam, Sanderson shorties, Eddy Performer RPM intake and Holley 770 Street Avenger.

Shortly after the first of the year I'm planning to buy a new carb. I'm itching to try one of the new Edelbrock AVS2 650 cfm carbs. But I'm concerned that it might be too small for my application.

I'd love to hear some input from those who have experience running a 600-650 cfm carb on a similar built 390.

blykins

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Re: 390 FE Carburetor Size
« Reply #1 on: November 16, 2019, 10:08:23 AM »
If I were in your spot, I’d be reaching for either a Quick Fuel HR-750 if you want mech secondary or an HR-780 if you want vac.

I’ve sent many of these carbs out to replace street avengers and the feedback has always been great in terms of both throttle response and power.
Brent Lykins
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RangerRat

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Re: 390 FE Carburetor Size
« Reply #2 on: November 16, 2019, 10:33:34 AM »
I can only speak about my application. But the Street Avenger has terrible throttle response for me. I'm running a run of the mill 4160 on my CJ-7 and it's a way better all around carburetor than my Street Avenger

GerryP

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Re: 390 FE Carburetor Size
« Reply #3 on: November 16, 2019, 11:03:09 AM »
The 650 AVS isn't too small for your engine.  You could use an Autolite 2bbl and you'd still be fine.  Of course, an 850 of any manufacturer could also be just fine.  It would go without saying that the 2bbl would be limiting in a performance application, but it would work just fine for tooling around town.  The properly tuned 850 would also be fine for tooling around town and be great when you pour the coals to the engine even with that very mild 262 cam.

Your current carburetor may be flawed or you may have other tuning issues.  Perhaps you should look into all of the possibilities before throwing money at the problem, no? 

What's a "run of the mill 4160"?  You might not be aware that the 4160 is just a model type, not a specific carburetor.  In that regard, it could be anywhere from 390 to 750 cfm.  A 4160 Holley just means it uses a metering plate on the secondary, rather than a metering block.  Doesn't mean double pumper, dual cathedral float bowls or anything else.  Just metering plate on the secondary.

You also might not be aware that out of the box carburetors are great for nothing in particular.  They work fine in most situations, but are not optimal by any standard you'd care to use.  The difference between what some might consider too large CFM capacity working and not working is tailoring the boosters to the engine.

There is another similar thread running on this site that makes this thread look suspiciously provocative.

Joe-JDC

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Re: 390 FE Carburetor Size
« Reply #4 on: November 16, 2019, 11:45:28 AM »
Ford installed a 600 cfm Holley on thousands of higher performance 390 engines all throughout the '60s.  The Edelbrock will work just fine with tuning.  Nearly everyone to a person who has used an Avenger carb has had issues and wanted something ELSE.  Edelbrock also makes a 750 cfm carb, and an 800 cfm carb.  I will be trying two of their 800 cfm on my FE build with the Performer RPM 8V intake.  Joe-JDC
Joe-JDC '70GT-500

RangerRat

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Re: 390 FE Carburetor Size
« Reply #5 on: November 16, 2019, 03:37:32 PM »
Well there's no way I'm putting a 2 bbl on this thing lol.

The 4160 I referred to is a 0-80457SA 600 cfm vacuum secondary with no tuning other than idle mixture. It's been a great carb.

The street Avenger is great as far full throttle goes.

I've gotten the 390 pretty well dialed in as far as timing and such. I'm happy with that.

A smaller carb is gonna have better throttle response. But I don't want to give up anything at full throttle.

The Street Avenger is fine overall I guess. But I certainly don't think it's the best carburetor on the market and I think I could have chosen better. There really isn't any drivability issues per say. The big Street Avenger is also a very thirsty carb. If a 650 cfm will do the job just fine on the top end and have better throttle response too and get better mpg seems like a win,win. I just wanted to hear from some folks that are running a 600ish cfm on their 390 how they felt about it.

blykins

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Re: 390 FE Carburetor Size
« Reply #6 on: November 16, 2019, 04:27:39 PM »
Well there's no way I'm putting a 2 bbl on this thing lol.

The 4160 I referred to is a 0-80457SA 600 cfm vacuum secondary with no tuning other than idle mixture. It's been a great carb.

The street Avenger is great as far full throttle goes.

I've gotten the 390 pretty well dialed in as far as timing and such. I'm happy with that.

A smaller carb is gonna have better throttle response. But I don't want to give up anything at full throttle.

The Street Avenger is fine overall I guess. But I certainly don't think it's the best carburetor on the market and I think I could have chosen better. There really isn't any drivability issues per say. The big Street Avenger is also a very thirsty carb. If a 650 cfm will do the job just fine on the top end and have better throttle response too and get better mpg seems like a win,win. I just wanted to hear from some folks that are running a 600ish cfm on their 390 how they felt about it.

A smaller carb doesn't always have better throttle response. 

I have never heard anything good about a Street Avenger, so I think anything you swap to will be an improvement.   
Brent Lykins
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Sand hauler

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Re: 390 FE Carburetor Size
« Reply #7 on: November 16, 2019, 05:00:57 PM »
Might also consider the demon line , I've heard alot more good than bad about them. Had an Edelbrock carb once on a stock 390 , never could get it to run as well as the 4160 Holley 600 that was on it before. Ended up trading it for a Holley 750 VS that someone had on there stock SB Chevy truck. The Edelbrock worked very well on the 350 , but for some reason the 390 just didn't like it no matter what I tried. Ended up rebuilding the 600 Holley and putting it back on instead.Sounds crazy I know,but that was my experience with the Edelbrock carb.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2019, 05:21:59 PM by Sand hauler »
Bobby-   Carlsbad, NM

Drew Pojedinec

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Re: 390 FE Carburetor Size
« Reply #8 on: November 16, 2019, 07:51:18 PM »
A smaller carb doesn't always have better throttle response. 

I have never heard anything good about a Street Avenger, so I think anything you swap to will be an improvement.

I try to avoid carb threads on most forums.....

I had a customer with a 570 street avenger.  he wanted something that ran better on his 350.  He was also concerned about fuel economy.
I built him a 780cfm 3310 based carburetor.
His report back was "it's a totally different engine! it feels like I have 100hp more, I don't even care about economy anymore."  6 month later he reported a 4mpg increase.

If anyone thinks fuel economy is dictated by the cfm of a carburetor, they clearly do NOT understand the physics behind it all.  Look to a 390cfm carb, in order to idle you either need massive drilled holes and a massive IFR or you need to have pretty much the entire transfer slot showing at idle.  Generally speaking, going from a stock 600 to a 390 will cause you to suffer in economy.

If anyone says "A street avenger runs awesome" I immediately think that the person needs to experience a properly set up carb.  That said I try not to generalize about Street Avengers as every version of them is drastically different for no particular reason.  I have taken a view that modern Holleys are for the most part an advertisement for their fuel injection systems.

But what do I know?

My427stang

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Re: 390 FE Carburetor Size
« Reply #9 on: November 16, 2019, 07:59:46 PM »
A smaller carb doesn't always have better throttle response. 

I have never heard anything good about a Street Avenger, so I think anything you swap to will be an improvement.

I try to avoid carb threads on most forums.....

I had a customer with a 570 street avenger.  he wanted something that ran better on his 350.  He was also concerned about fuel economy.
I built him a 780cfm 3310 based carburetor.
His report back was "it's a totally different engine! it feels like I have 100hp more, I don't even care about economy anymore."  6 month later he reported a 4mpg increase.

If anyone thinks fuel economy is dictated by the cfm of a carburetor, they clearly do NOT understand the physics behind it all.  Look to a 390cfm carb, in order to idle you either need massive drilled holes and a massive IFR or you need to have pretty much the entire transfer slot showing at idle.  Generally speaking, going from a stock 600 to a 390 will cause you to suffer in economy.

If anyone says "A street avenger runs awesome" I immediately think that the person needs to experience a properly set up carb.  That said I try not to generalize about Street Avengers as every version of them is drastically different for no particular reason.  I have taken a view that modern Holleys are for the most part an advertisement for their fuel injection systems.

But what do I know?

What those guys said ^^^^^ 

Especially the mileage and street avenger part...I won't use them, and I'll use almost anything
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centredautomag

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Re: 390 FE Carburetor Size
« Reply #10 on: November 17, 2019, 07:49:49 AM »
Ask Drew to build you a carb.
Marc.

e philpott

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Re: 390 FE Carburetor Size
« Reply #11 on: November 17, 2019, 02:20:31 PM »
For what it’s worth, a friend stopped by Saturday to show me his new ride a 1970 Buick GS 455 Stage 1 he bought off the original owners widow still wearing original paint, anyhow it’s a real nice day2 car with an old Edelbrock F??? Intake manifold, headers and small Cam maybe 2500 ish stall speed ( car doesn’t have a Tach ) but when we went for a ride at a 35 mph roll he kicks it down and then smokes a one peel for about 150 yards while still pulling hard . When we get back to my place and pop the air cleaner off I was quite surprised it had a newer Edelbrock 750 #1411 , I would have guessed double pumper had we not taken the lid off , 600 should work on yours.

About 20 years ago or so I used to install a Comp 260 with Edelbrock Performer Intake and 600 Edelbrock manual choke Carb on some hard working Farm trucks with 351 and 400 M 2 barrel engines that really ran great after the mods

RangerRat

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Re: 390 FE Carburetor Size
« Reply #12 on: November 18, 2019, 09:22:39 AM »
So from what I'm seeing here and elsewhere most are leaning towards a 750ish cfm. I was hoping to try out the annular discharge boosters on the 650 AVS2 but looks like I'll be trying an Edelbrock 1407 750 cfm. I really like how quick and easy it is to make adjustments the Eddy. And the Performer style boosters offer pretty good throttle response.

Falcon67

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Re: 390 FE Carburetor Size
« Reply #13 on: November 18, 2019, 09:44:40 AM »
The AVS should be a good carb for your application IMHO.  But the 1407 would work too - the Performer carbs do a good job metering fuel.  If you go with the 1407, plenty of good used ones on the market.

e philpott

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Re: 390 FE Carburetor Size
« Reply #14 on: November 18, 2019, 10:06:41 AM »
The AVS should be a good carb for your application IMHO.  But the 1407 would work too - the Performer carbs do a good job metering fuel.  If you go with the 1407, plenty of good used ones on the market.

I installed a Edelbrock 650 AVS on a 1962 Lincoln 430 convertible a couple summers ago and the customer loves it and runs fine right out of the box , I think you would be fine with a AVS 2