1966 to 1968 1/2 What Happened to Ford Total Performance?

[Flucas Lucas]

Ford appeared to abandon it's performance image in 1966. Example In 1967 Brand X rolled out the Camaro with a 396 option that killed Mustangs 390. In 1968 Hot Rod challenged readers to send letters to Ford about it's lack of performance, resulting in the 428 Cobra Jet.
What happened internally at Ford? Was it the mountain of money spent on the Le Mans effort? In my opinion this gap in performance basically gave brand X the street performance market.

[RJP]

What helped change was when Hot Rod magazine prompted it's readers via a survey on what Ford should do regarding the lack-luster performance of the 390 Mustang/Fairlane and submitted the results to the brass at Ford. Along with the encouragement from Bob Tasca to build a low cost performance option to compete with the Camaro, Firebird and Mopar's budget offerings. Hence the 428 CJ/SCJ. People forget that Ford also had the 427 Fairlane [66-67] that could hand the Camaro, Chevelle, Firebird and Mopars their collective asses when needed. It's too bad that the 427 Fairlanes were in such limited production as most 427 blocks were mostly reserved for NASCAR, Le mans, H&M, Shelby and marine with both Chris-Craft marine and hot boats using 427 crate engines. Holman-Moody-Stroppe also using many 427s in endurance race boat applications. Keep in mind, the Camaro/Chevelle had higher performance options such as the 375/396 option as well as Mopar with the 426 Hemi and the 440 option. If you compared the 350/396 [standard engine for the SS Chevelles] to the 320-335/390 Ford/Merc the 320/390 Merc was quicker and faster in the 1/4 mile. Check out the 7 muscle car comparo on the Oldsmobile website. [OLDSmobility.com] [ The 320/390 Comet Cyclone is 2nd quickest only to the 375/440 Dodge. [Dodge: 14.92 @ 96.98 vs Comet: 15.12 @ 99.49]

[Flucas Lucas]

This was the car aimed at the youth market. What was the thinking behind this marketing decision? You mention the 427 Fairlane being rare, I have never even seen one at a car show. The super high performance cars were usually a loss leader item.
Was money tight during the development of the 429/460 and 351C 351M/400?

[RJP]

This was the car aimed at the youth market. What was the thinking behind this marketing decision? You mention the 427 Fairlane being rare, I have never even seen one at a car show. The super high performance cars were usually a loss leader item.
Was money tight during the development of the 429/460 and 351C 351M/400?

Ford inadvertently gave up the "youth market" back in the mid 50s. It had a lock on that market with the Flathead V8 up to about 53-54 when the other mfgs brought out OHV V8 such as the Chrysler 331" Hemi in 1951, Oldsmobile and their 303" OHV V8 with many others soon to follow. When Chevy came out with the 265" SBC in 1955 Ford was pretty much having to play catch-up. The 292-312 Y-block did not get the attention all the others did although it was considered a decent performer. The AMA ban on racing, high performance and competition that was engineered by GM in June of 1957 killed any hopes of Ford competing in the so called youth market was pretty much a done deal by late 57. Go forward to the mid 1960s as Ford was not really interested in the youth market as the powers that be believed professional racing and winning could fill any gaps left open to people that were interested in and wanted a HP vehicle...Win on Sunday...Sell on Monday was their mantra even though the car that won on Sunday was not available to the public even if they "looked the same" with taped on racing stripes and funny looking hood doodads. As for the 427 Fairlane I do remember a magazine ad for the 427 Fairlane with Mario Andretti standing near his NASCAR 67 Fairlane and a stock Fairlane with the ad caption reading "...Also available without numbers" The good speed equipment Ford had was mostly available to the pro racers with the grass roots people largely forgotten. Lets not forget the Mustang played a big presence in overall sales in 64-65-66 and was the media darling until the Camaro came out in 1967. They didn't have to build a true high performance Mustang at that time...They were selling all they could build without "performance"     

[wsu0702]

...As for the 427 Fairlane I do remember a magazine ad for the 427 Fairlane with Mario Andretti standing near his NASCAR 67 Fairlane and a stock Fairlane with the ad caption reading "...Also available without numbers"   

[gt350hr]

   Ford's corporate "philosophy" during those years was to win races with cars/parts they controlled. Ford had the parts already developed and could have ruled the "muscle car" revolution MUCH sooner if they had onle released them. Keeping John Q Public from having the same level of parts kept their race performance at a lower level than the factory "teams". This came to a head in a multi page letter to "the big brass" from Donald Frey regarding the poor sales of "pony cars" and performance cars in general after Chrysler and GM set out to hurt Mustang sales. The letter ( I've seen a copy) complained that Ford was hung up on things like insurance companies , economy cars , family cars when it was clear there was a "youth explosion"  screaming for high performance cars and the other companies were killing Ford's sales by providing them. The Hot Rod article had already been out and this letter was his response to his bosses. Along with some changes in Ford management , the Hot Rod article opened the exec's eyes and the instant success of the Cobra Jet vehicles put Ford back on the map. All was good until the BS "gas crunch " and the EPA wanting reduced emissions. Performance took a back seat until the '79 Mustang hit the scene and started the latest "revolution".
     Just this old guy's opinion while I saw it happening back in the day.
       Randy

[wsu0702]

Ford appeared to abandon it's performance image in 1966. Example In 1967 Brand X rolled out the Camaro with a 396 option that killed Mustangs 390. In 1968 Hot Rod challenged readers to send letters to Ford about it's lack of performance, resulting in the 428 Cobra Jet.
What happened internally at Ford? Was it the mountain of money spent on the Le Mans effort? In my opinion this gap in performance basically gave brand X the street performance market.

I always chuckle when I read that Eric Dahlquist's November 1967 Hot Rod article asking people to write to HFII somehow helped to convince Ford to produce the 428CJ.  They were almost done with the engine/cooling/drivetrain validation by November of 1967 as the "428 GT" engine program was kicked off almost a year before that. 

[TomP]

Yes, the write-in campaign just confirmed a market for something almost ready.

Ford could have easily made a beefier version of the 390. The standard 396-325hp and the Firebird 400's were even matches but those cars had optional engines too. A 350+hp 390 with PI intake, 780 carb and 427 Fairlane exhaust could have changed everything.

But GM was hardly the innocent beneficiary of Fords lack of performance. They slipped ringers in the press test pool. They had their own version of Holman Moody whipping up race cars for the "independent" teams... like Roger Penske, Malcolm Durham, etc...

Where do you think aluminum 427 Chev blocks came from? Why did Bill Jenkins give up a factory Chrysler deal in 65 to run an "independent" Chevy in 66? Who made Hayden Proffitt a Corvair funny car body? One day the lid may blow off the GM "out of racing after 63" farce.

[Katz427]

I'll add a little different take to this topic.
If you remember Ralph Nader was really making noise about how unsafe cars were, especially the Corvair. If you get to look at film of the Senate hearings of that time period with GM chairman James Roche, he looked like a " duck out of water", to put it mildly. His performance was so bad, it cost him the GM chairmanship. The only one with a name.was Henry Ford II, "the deuce".
 Henry was charged to be the auto manufacturers lead representative to the government, after the poor Roche showing.
Upon traveling to Washington, Henry found a hostile Congress, wanting first to nationalise the auto companies. While the idea didn't bother Chrysler, and GM brass, it sure bothered Henry, for he knew the Ford family, would lose any control of the Ford Motor Company.
Thus we have Henry in the middle of a high stakes game, to save his family's legacy. Henry , with John Bugas ( former FBI) decided best to tone down the street cars and emphasise safety, and maybe the next administration in Washington would be more favorable to the automakers. In the next election Nixon won, and stated he was in favor of nationalising the auto industry, Congress just needed to put a bill on the desk.
Thus after a long talk with close friend Bob Tasca, Henry decided to ok the Cobrajet. He gambled that the new administration would be too busy with Vietnam to worry about nationalising the auto industry. 
That is pretty much the story as I remember relayed to me.

[Russ67Scode]

Didn’t FORD already have a 375hp  and 401 HP 390 in the early 60’s ?  Why didn’t they put that in the 67 mustang!

[FERoadster]

sorry to say this but FORD performance marketing was dead to us in Oakland County. We were putting 427's into 55-56  Fords and heading to Woodward  Ave. HenryysNephew was at Lapeer or Detroit Dragway. We had our engine  the Mustangs and Fairlanes were out of our price range.

Richard >>> FERoadster

[Katz427]

I have to agree, installing a 390 or 427 in a mid fifties Ford was the way too go for those of us in the low rent crowd. The 55 didn't handle great, but won a fair share of races. It was a good value, for the money spent (which we didn't have much of).

[Pentroof]

It changed to Total Quality.

In the 50s and early 60s, while GM was hiring designers, Ford was hiring engineers and accountants.  Warranty would become the lowest per unit in Detroit. Selling racing hardware in the showroom to any kid with a couple bucks was against that philosophy. They preferred to handle that more directly...and specifically without a warranty.
Look at the ads from those years. GM was all about styling and Ford was promoting quality, utility and innovation.
As an example, the materials engineering that was taking place at Ford was head and shoulders above the other 2, and had been for a while. If you look at the subtle engineering and quality that went into fasteners on our beloved FEs, they were the ARP of the time. Compare the head bolts to some GM crap of the era and it's clear.
Pontiac had no choice but to sell you anything you wanted, sitting in the shadows of Chevy within the corporate brotherhood. At that time, they still had their own motor. It would be interesting to see what their warranty payouts were compared to the others under the GM umbrella.

[cammerfe]

I got my '64 Custom/427 in February of '64. During that coming summer, we discovered that the new X-way-connector running from Livonia over to Ann Arbor was all paved but final touches necessary were such that it wasn't open---there were barricades at both ends of both sides. But they were of the saw-horse variety and easily moved.

Some of us decided that the temptation was too great, and Geo. Speaks, who owned the station that was the local source for 260 Sunoco had just put another 427 in his '57 Ford and wanted to try me out. By the time everything was arranged, there were probably 40 or 50 cars in the entourage.

We went way down into the new section and lined up. The caps on my exhaust dumps were fixed on with wingnuts and I was skinny enough at the time to be able to reach them without having to get out the jack. George jumped me a bit when the flag went up because I was a bit traction limited, but I caught him in second gear and had a clear advantage when we passed under the first overpass. I looked up and saw a cop watching us so we quit and I quickly drove back to pick up Brother Lon and my GF (became my wife the next March), re-capped the dumps and beat it.

It was a toss-up as to which end to go to, to avoid the cops we knew must be coming, but we got away before anyone showed-up. They put concrete barriers across both ends of the X-way until it opened later that summer.

An engine swap 427-into -a-'57 wasn't faster than the factory Custom '64, at least in that instance, with the few mods I'd done to it by that time. (You did have a choice of a 3.50 or 4.11 'open' rear end from Ford, and I got the 4.11.)

My next car was a '65 1/2 Mustang with the 271-289 engine. I put a Paxton on it. And my next car after that was a '67 Cougar 390 that I got in 'late '68. I put a 427 engine in that in early 1969 so, from my standpoint, there was always some sort of performance FoMoCo product available at the turn of the key. 

KS

[WerbyFord]

What helped change was when Hot Rod magazine prompted it's readers via a survey on what Ford should do regarding the lack-luster performance of the 390 Mustang/Fairlane and submitted the results to the brass at Ford. Along with the encouragement from Bob Tasca to build a low cost performance option to compete with the Camaro, Firebird and Mopar's budget offerings. Hence the 428 CJ/SCJ. People forget that Ford also had the 427 Fairlane [66-67] that could hand the Camaro, Chevelle, Firebird and Mopars their collective asses when needed. It's too bad that the 427 Fairlanes were in such limited production as most 427 blocks were mostly reserved for NASCAR, Le mans, H&M, Shelby and marine with both Chris-Craft marine and hot boats using 427 crate engines. Holman-Moody-Stroppe also using many 427s in endurance race boat applications. Keep in mind, the Camaro/Chevelle had higher performance options such as the 375/396 option as well as Mopar with the 426 Hemi and the 440 option. If you compared the 350/396 [standard engine for the SS Chevelles] to the 320-335/390 Ford/Merc the 320/390 Merc was quicker and faster in the 1/4 mile. Check out the 7 muscle car comparo on the Oldsmobile website. [OLDSmobility.com] [ The 320/390 Comet Cyclone is 2nd quickest only to the 375/440 Dodge. [Dodge: 14.92 @ 96.98 vs Comet: 15.12 @ 99.49]

A great thread featuring discussion of that crazy 7-car comparo back on the old fordfe.com

https://www.fordfe.com/viewtopic.php?f=74182&t=107110&p=989104&hilit=cyclone#p989104

The June 1967 Road Test mag. et/mph/weight just don't line up.

I DO think in this thread a lot of points make sense (some of them new to me at least)
* From 1965-68 Ford performance was dismal, with the exception of the 427 which you couldn't get, and didn't have a warranty anyway.
* Ford was right near/at the top of the pack from 1960-64 but then suddenly the bottom dropped out, so I understand the OP's question
* The answers involving safety and Congress do make sense
* In addition, I do think Ford was just ignoring the customer and catering to the pro racer, starting with the Tbolt and LWG and getting worse in 1965-68.

* The problem is as stated - Ford's BASE engines did ok, 390gt and even 428 7-Liter in the big cars. But there was no step-up. The 390gt was no match for Chevy's L78 or even Pontiac's 400RA1 or the 440 Mopar, let alone the Hemi. The 7-Liter didn't cut it against the L72 Biscuit or the 421HO.
* I can see a legit argument Ford wanted to avoid warranties with solid cams - but still, they had better parts on the shelf that could have gone into the 390 Mustang/Fairlane and 428 Gal. They just chose not to.
* If they were stressing quality/reliability instead, that was a good choice. Chevy starter and GM wiring for example. Ford sure won those battles.

It's just CHOICES FoMoCo made - and this thread has covered most of them. Ford just chose not to give us their best combos (in any volume anyway) and to avoid solid cams except in the tiny 289.

As for that 1967 7-crazy-cars comparo I will see what else I can dig out, I may have Gonkulated them somewhere. As I said in the old Feb.2016 thread on fordfe.com, I gave up trying to find all the typos and cut&paste errors in the article itself.