Felony heads vs edelbrock

[BigBlockFE]

I have been reading about the new felony head by Survival, is this the way to go for a 482 street build or are the edelbrocks cheaper and just as effective.

[My427stang]

Depends on the build, and I have not had my hands on a set yet but

1 - Edelbrock is cheaper
2 - Edelbrock will not be as effective as the Felony heads as the performance level climbs.  As the rpm and power climbs even more, the Felony heads will have an even greater margin

[BigBlockFE]

I thought that for a 575hp street build the edelbrocks are fine a tested, I also read where the felony heads make for a perfect street head between 2500 and 5500 rpm, for drivabilty and power due to there design. Its cool to see so many different options now...

[My427stang]

I think you'd find a 575 horse Edel headed 482 would be a 600+ horse 482 after the head swap

[BigBlockFE]

The felony heads ported will be a nice addition to the street strip market. And the Ed heads ported are always a great option for power.

[Joe-JDC]

On a 482, you are going to have to do some serious porting to get 575hp out of a set of Edelbrock heads.  That will require the heads and intake to flow well together, and a serious camshaft.  300-310cfm would be the target flow number to reach 575hp with Edelbrock heads.  You can get there easier with the Survival head on a 4.250" bore.   310cfm is also easier to obtain with porting the Survival head.   Joe-JDC

[BigBlockFE]

I believe all the hydro rollers Kraft builds with his stage 2 heads all reach the 575hp level or close to if not more. Those are Ed heads ported. I could be wrong. I think the felony heads are sweet.

[Joe-JDC]

KC Stage II heads are CNC ported, and usually have 2.150 or larger intake valve, depending on which head you ask him to start with.   The last three sets I have flowed on my SF-600 flowed in the 335-340cfm range at .750".  Joe-JDC

[BigBlockFE]

So if you don't have your own machinist port the heads you can just order them already done.  Do most guys get the port work done themselves or just order the heads already done. I realize it depends on the build. 

[Joe-JDC]

You mentioned the KC II heads, so I just wanted to make sure you realize they are CNC ported.  He will build the heads however you desire.  Barry can supply his Survival heads with CNC porting, also.  There are not a lot of folks left who can hand port the FE heads to be competitive with the CNC pricing or flow numbers.  Joe-JDC

[BigBlockFE]

I know they are ported, I said that in my previous threads, any good machine shop can port  heads, I would rather have a machine do it, Keith's 482 comes with the stage 2 head, I want to know what that engine will do with the felony heads, same port...im building an engine now and I love the Head options that I have to choose from...

[Barry_R]

I have a rather obvious bias.  But I also have data.  I have not done a 482 "mule" to try a bunch of variations, but I have done enough engines to show up the trends.  Use the dyno numbers as guidance.  My dyno installation is different than others and the values may not be the same.  Different does not mean "wrong" - it means different.  I have an older DTS 8800 dyno, run through mufflers (nice area), and run the mechanical water pump with a belt in place, shop air for inlet and room ventilation, and no airflow cone on the carb.

The off the shelf Edelbrock head is likely to be 30 or so HP less than the "as cast" Survival head in the same application.

A slightly modified Edelbrock head (like our Stage X - valves, valve job, bowl work) will reduce the power peak difference, but will still be a small amount weaker - maybe 10 HP less.  The Survival head will make more torque and have a greater advantage "off peak" requiring a couple degrees less timing.

A more highly modified Edelbrock with porting will exceed the Survival head in its "as cast" condition.  Our CNC ported Edelbrock flows around 324-329 cfm and will get up around 600HP in applications where the "as cast" Survival head goes around 570ish.  I have had a couple pump gas 600HP 482 engines with the as cast head but they were solid roller and/or Dominator carb pieces.  I've tried to hit 600 with hydraulic roller cams and 4150 carbs lately but instead seem to have gotten even more torque, a flatter curve, and the same 570ish power numbers.

Doing a full port effort on the Survival head will approach 370 cfm (CNC or otherwise) and puts you into a different zone as far as power potential for a traditional medium riser configuration that can still use normal bolt on rockers and no welding.  But the cost also move up there as well.

And the downside is that I am out of castings and will be for quite a while.  So if your intent is to get something running in the short term you will need to go to an alternative - like the modified Edelbrock.

[blykins]

I suppose I've had my hands on about every head out there....CNC Pond, Edelbrock, CNC Edelbrock, hand-ported Edelbrock, BBM, Barry's as-cast heads, and Barry's CNC heads. 

I will be dyno'ing a 482 on Friday with BBM as-cast heads, but it probably won't be indicative of a "performance" engine as it's for a towing application.   

With that being said, from what I've seen so far, Barry's heads would be one of my top picks if given the option.   I didn't get a chance to flow the as-cast head like I wanted, but his CNC head went 370 on the SF600 down here, had great velocity and a quiet port.  I just did a 511 with his CNC heads, out of the box Blue Thunder 1x4 MR, and a mild-ish hydraulic roller and cracked 616 hp and 671 lb-ft of torque. 

If Survivial is out of heads and won't have any, then my next choice would be a CNC Pond head.  The Pond head probably has some of the highest performing exhaust ports that I've seen and will flow around 340-350 on the intake side.  These will only work on a big bore engine though, so the 390/428 crowd is out.

A 482 with Pond heads, hydraulic roller, and Performer RPM intake should be around the 570-580 hp mark on the dyno I use.   

[Drew Pojedinec]

Focusing on just air flow and hp made is cool, but I think it misses a few of the details that make these newer heads so much better.

The new wave of cylinder head designs like Barry R's FElony heads have much more engineered into them.  The combustion chamber is much better, the burn will happen quicker and require less timing, the burn will be more efficient as well.  Their flow into and out of the ports should also be smoother, and have a higher velocity at the same amount of flow.  I would suspect that if an Edelbrock head with 300cfm of flow vs a FElony head with 300cfm of flow, I'd rather street drive the FElony head, as I suspect it'd be a better performer at just about any throttle position.

Not trying to knock Edelbrock, but since BBM, Barry R, et el came out with these new heads, I feel Edelbrock is falling more into the "stock replacement with more power potential" category.

*Of course this is theoretical based on what I understand of air flow in engines, I have no direct experience with the parts in question*

[BigBlockFE]

Great info, its nice to see so many new options, the track is the real dyno, numbers are just numbers, 550-600hp is all the same to me to a point...I use the dyno for tuning anyway...how long are you put of the heads for Barry...