looking for advice on my starliner winter upgrades

[mkolden]

I bought my 61 starliner over a year ago.  It has a 390 tri power, c6, stock converter, and 3.00 gears.  I was not happy with the power I had around town. I played with timing and bought HPTrends tripower bible but was really limited not knowing what the cam, compression, ect.  I am building a 428 for it and would like some ideas.  I will be using the tripower and cast iron long tube headers just for the under the hood presentation.  My initial thoughts are port matched Edelbrock heads, roller hydraulic cam, and stock ford adjustable rockers teamed with a stall converter and taller gear. I would like to keep the car below 10.5:1 compression.  I would like suggestions on cam, stall rpm, rear gear combo.  Are the gains of Roller rockers worth the investment. Jays book mentioned using a holley 500 carb in the middle, some searches from the other forum talk about 500's as the outer carbs?  has anyone tried either of these combinations? 

[Drew Pojedinec]

if it was my car?

1. 4.10 rear gears.
2. more aggressive cam, run a search on the FE forum on 270s 282s and see which suits you better.
3. higher stall converter to go with cam

I also think you should find someone that knows how to tune an engine....  I *may* be totally wrong, but every 390 I've had can set you back in your seat, and/or blow through a set of tires.  If not there may be something wrong with the way it is running.  I have never had a 428, but I do not really see why I would need one if all I did was throw the car around on the streets.  I run out of street long before I run out of stupid.  I despise incarceration (hard mattress, honey bun/rc coke for lunch), as such unless I am headed to the track, a 390 should fit the bill.


good luck,
Drew

[MustangGT]

Not any help but you have a really beautiful car! 

[machoneman]

Cool car indeed. Think we need more info though as is this a local boulevard cruiser, a top end highway star, just a neat ride? See, we all have different opinions of what is streetable or a racer. I like the 4:10 gear idea too but if gas money is tight, maybe a 3:50-3:70 'ish gear would be better.  We do know you only want pump gas (good idea btw) so a 14:1 c/r and race gas is out.

But, how will you drive it and how much are you willing to put up with for stellar performance?

 

[mkolden]

I agree with drew that it was odd to be so sluggish, once my head was against the was i had reputable mechanical friends come check things out also and general consensus was that it had a junk cam.  the only reason I am using the 428 is because I have it.  as far as what kind of cruiser it will be an around town car making two 500 mile round trips to Minneapolis per summer.  so 3:70s would be my tops.
the best way to describe what I want is to be able to get off the light and blow away the kid in the camero with keystones and glasspacks that thinks he is all that, and get respect from the guys that ARE all that. 

[machoneman]

This 282 cam should fit your needs unless you want a really rough idle (see text for 272-282 and up cams)

http://www.jegs.com/i/Comp-Cams/249/33-244-4/10002/-1?parentProductId=

With a 3:70 'ish rear, your converter shouldn't stall very high, say 2,200-2,500. I'll let someone else comment on the tri-power set-up as I am not a fan. Cool looking and some have good luck with them but most (GTO, Chevy, Ford etc.) club members I know agree a single four barrel on a modern dual plane intake is far superior for hp, they don't leak gas and consistently perform the same way each time out.

See, I said I wasn't a fan 

[Kerry j]

I have a winter 61 Starliner project too; mine has a very tired 352, a 4 speed close ratio and 3.00 rear gears. I built a 416 (.030 over 390 with a 428 crank) for my 61 Liner, it has a cam similar to the 282S and about 9.5-1 compression, C3AE heads with CJ sized valves, long tube cast iron manifolds and it made right at 400 HP. The consensus is that the Tri Power and the heads are the cork and won't allow enough flow to max the cam. So, I have a set of C2SE heads and another Tri Power intake that are being ported right now to flow a lot better. I should have flow numbers on Friday. The heads should also raise the compression a few points, so I'm hoping I can make another 50 HP when I swap the heads and intake.

Here's a youtube of the 416 on the dyno: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lRg3Cc3BsYQ

My plan is to drop in the new 416, change the rear to 3.91 and replace the close ratio toploader with a wide ratio. I hope this makes my liner a little more peppy!

Without knowing what cam you have or what your heads and intake flow, it's hard to know what's going on. You could also have a timing problem. When I was running the 416 on the dyno, the timing was retarded by about 14 degrees and I didn't realize it because I had used an after market balancer and got the timing mark screwed up.

[ScotiaFE]

BBQ. I have one just like it.
The Starliner is looking very Kool.
One thing to keep in mind is highway rpm's.
My 390 with a 4 speed and 3.25 gears and 27 inch tall tires is at 3000 rpm on the highway.
I do most of my driving on highways at 75 + mph.
If you use a 3.70 and an auto you will be close to 3500 rpm steady on the highway at 75 mph.
Just something to consider.
The stock adjustables are fine. SS guys use them at extreme output.
There are a whole page of hyd rollers at Summit. How much cam do you want?
Typically a cam in the 230ish range at .050 lift is a good starting point for a street cam.
Of course you can go up from there and use tuning to dial in what you want.
The Tripower looks very reto kool. Will it pull past a RPM no, but then an RPM looks kinda plane Jane stock.
And I run a RPM on the Fairlane it really does look blaw. Works great though. Just no wow factor.
A good tune up with a shift kit on the C6 and a stall around 2200 to 2500.
Do not over look your dizzy. power and economy can be had with the right advance.
This sounds like a great car. I wish I had the money and room for a Big Gal.
Good luck and keep us posted.

[jayb]

I bought my 61 starliner over a year ago.  It has a 390 tri power, c6, stock converter, and 3.00 gears.  I was not happy with the power I had around town. I played with timing and bought HPTrends tripower bible but was really limited not knowing what the cam, compression, ect.  I am building a 428 for it and would like some ideas.  I will be using the tripower and cast iron long tube headers just for the under the hood presentation.  My initial thoughts are port matched Edelbrock heads, roller hydraulic cam, and stock ford adjustable rockers teamed with a stall converter and taller gear. I would like to keep the car below 10.5:1 compression.  I would like suggestions on cam, stall rpm, rear gear combo.  Are the gains of Roller rockers worth the investment. Jays book mentioned using a holley 500 carb in the middle, some searches from the other forum talk about 500's as the outer carbs?  has anyone tried either of these combinations? 

On the center carb change, I know of at least one guy who made his 500 HP with the tripower intake and the factory carbs, so I don't think that will be a requirement to make your horsepower goal.  I also don't think that your choice of cast iron headers will really hold you back at that power level.  To me the key for your combination will be picking the right cam.  I'd be paying close attention to getting a dynamic compression ratio of right about 8.5:1 with whatever cam you select, and your 10.5:1 static.  If you go with a hydraulic roller, you should be able to easily make your horsepower goals with reasonable lifts (around .600 or so).  You might consider the aftermarket rockers just as an insurance policy, although I've run .640 lift solids with the factory rockers before. 

I'd also go with a 3200-3500 stall converter and the deepest gears you think you can stomach on the street.  Or, better yet, put in some 4.30s or 4.56s and use a Gear Vendors overdrive.

JMO, of course