ignition confusion???

[fe66comet]

OK if I am using a Ford TFI system and want to use a MSD billet distributor, MSD 6al box and a fast crank trigger. How does this all fit in with a computer controlled ignition like the Ford PCM? I have everything but the crank trigger and pcm right now and I want to make sure it will all work together before proceeding. Thanks.......Jon

[jmlay]

From MSD's directions it looks like it is plug & play with their harness:

http://www.msdignition.com/WorkArea/DownloadAsset.aspx?id=15032386416

[My427stang]

Why would you run a crank trigger and a TFI?    I think you are complicating a good system.

The TFI along with the ECM will adjust injector and ignition timing, if you take the ignition trigger out of the distributor, you'll have to reprogram the Ford ECM to do something it isn't designed to do. That is if you can, I am not sure that it will be happy.

Now if you lose the crank trigger and let the TFI do both injector and ignition, you can buy ready made harnesses to hook up the CD ignition.  I run an Accel Annihilator and had to wire it myself, but the MSD is convenient.

If you really want the crank trigger, then lose the TFI and run a FAST or equiv Speed Density box and let it control the injectors and the timing and lose the MAF.

[fe66comet]

The distributed I have is a MSD billet for my 445. There is no TFI distributor available for the FE anyhow so I need a way to trigger the PCM. The most I could do is trash the distributor and put a pertronix in there but I have a 6al box anyhow so it would be a step backwards. I was thinking of using a Fast crank trigger and use that for the PCM timing. Otherwise I am not sure how I could trigger the system with no ignition module? So let me see if I got this right? The pip is like a camshaft angle sensor with one trigger that is mounted in the distributor. So basically it would be a  hall effect with all but one tab removed in my billet distributor. Then I would have a crank position sensor with eight triggers mounted on the crankshaft. That would take care of my PIP signal in the distributor and my crank position sensor. Then I would use a remote TFI module mounted on the firewall to control it all with the MSD box connected to the trigger coming from the TFI for the coil connected to the MSD trigger input. Then the box would be wired as normal. Does this sound right or am I missing the boat? Can I loose the crank trigger then just use my distributor to trigger the remote TFI? I was looking on summit and they show a TFI comparable crank trigger for Mustangs so I thought it was a necessary part of the system? The remote TFI box they used on Ford trucks I thought would work so I could get around the distributor issues.

[My427stang]

I run a Mallory TFI in my Mustang, they do make them.

However, you may be able to do what you want, but you are asking an OEM computer to do things its not designed to.  I really think at this point a FAST speed density would be much simpler and work just as well.

Although the PIP as you say has one "signature" it also had 7 standard triggers.  As far as wiring an input off of the crank trigger, I suspect it could be done, but you'd have to look and see if they use the same type of signal and the computer could understand it being crank speed vice cam speed.

To me, a good FAST system would be be much more cost and setup effective

[fe66comet]

My main reason for going with the sn95 system is it supports emissions controls. Whatever I do it needs to be compliant up to 1996 model year. The system used in the Mustang was used until 1998 in Ford trucks. I did some research and the trigger is magnetic in the TIF system, which is the same as my pro billet MSD distributor. I found a company that has a high performance heat sink to remote mount a aftermarket or OEM module . The kit is 55 dollars with a heat sink and harness. Not bad for a complete kit minus the module, I would probably get a Accel or something along those lines. I am still not positive about the trigger in my distributor being correctly timed but I was assuming that the system required a crank and camshaft angle sensor. After reading up some more in a manual I had laying around the system is just timed by a magnetic trigger from the distributor, I would think it would produce eight pulses per revolution like my MSD does but both the signals are both magnetic. The remote module will greatly simplify things and comes with OEM style connectors. I am going to have to give MSD a call and make sure the signals will work with each other?

[fe66comet]

Apparently I am going to have to build my own distributor, I called every imaginable company that makes conversion kits and triggers and only the stock hall effect triggers work. I ordered a distributor for a 91 Ford Bronco with a remote module and I am going to strip it for parts to covert my MSD Pro Billet. I tried to find info on someone who does such a conversion but could not find any leads, Pertronix said they could maybe do it but open my wallet and don't close it was my basic quote LOL.

[My427stang]

I run a Mallory TFI distributor sourced through Massflow.  I considered the remote module, but just can't find a reason to, it hasn't given me a lick of trouble.  FYI I just run a NAPA TFI module as well, I have a spare, but unless you have ground problems or ridiculous heat issues, they just don't really fail.

I think the trucks only had issues when idling for long duration running a PTO or equiv, where underhood heat was out of control.

[fe66comet]

So the Mallory FE will work, I was told the signal was wrong. Cool maybe I will go that route to save work. I was concerned about heat due to a serious lack of engine space and was thinking of mounting my module and MSD 6AL box in a fan ducted box for cooling and protection from water.

[My427stang]

Mine is a real Mallory TFI, uses Ford TFI internals.  Module and pickup, heck even the shutter wheel is genuine Ford in a Mallory body

I dont have a good picture of it and I am not home, but here is one of the shutter wheel



Maybe call Mallory directly, it's a no-kidding TFI distributor, not one that "works"

[fe66comet]

All fits nice and neat, I'll have to check them out. Thanks for the heads up.

[fe66comet]

I called Mallory and they said they only have a TFI for a 302 or 351. Do you have a contact number or something for the place you got yours from?

[My427stang]

I bought a Massflo kit that a guy couldn't get running, I got it real cheap and built what I wanted from there

Maybe call Massflo directly.  I don't think he sells individual pieces but you never know

http://www.promracing.com/massfloefi

[fe66comet]

I decided to go ahead and build my own distributor out of the MSD Pro Billet base and shaft I had and cut a replacement 95 Ford 351 Bronco distributor up for the top half. All I have to do now is get the shaft turned and surface welded to smooth the surface up. It actually turned out nice, I'll post some pics when it is done.

[My427stang]

Sounds good