Survival heads vs Edelbrock heads modified..

[bn69stang]

Would it be money wisely spent to purchase the survival heads , and go for some modern enhancements , or modify stock edelbrock heads ? . Has anyone made this change , or in the process of either ?.. Bud

[fe66comet]

I spent a lot of money to get my Edelbrock heads to the same level as the Felony. I have yet to do the race 350 CFM CNC port job but in the end I will find myself at the same place.

[bn69stang]

Yeah im thinking just go with the felony heads at this point , it s probably better in the long run and sell the eds and get some money back and put it towards a stroker kit from Barry as well .. Thanks Jon for the advice . Bud

[Joe-JDC]

The RPM heads stock flow in the 260-270cfm range at most camshaft lifts, and the Survival head flows 280ish as cast, and with deburring, 300cfm @ .700" with a 2.200 intake valve.  A CNC ported Stage II head from Keith Craft flows 335-338cfm for $2500.00 complete with a 2.190 intake valve and H-Roller springs.  Not trying to start a war, just some facts.  A full port and polish will cost about $600-800 on either head.  I have hand ported both, and when fully ported they both will flow 335-340cfm with excellent results.  There is more with larger valves, but the block will determine which head is preferable.  For anything less than 4.165" I would suggest the Edelbrocks, but price and availability, and other services needed would be my deciding factor.  If you need other things from Barry, then use him, I do, and would.  Joe-JDC

[bn69stang]

Thanks for the info Joe , and my current bore is 4.17 and my other block that is going to be stroked to 463 inchs would be 4.165 inch bore . And i dont want to spend more money than necessary , but i want the best bang for my dollar .. Bud

[Barry_R]

Joe
Do you have port/runner volumes on the KC Stage II heads.
There is some value in that....

[Joe-JDC]

I still have a set here that I can check.  Will let you know.  I like your heads--especially the exhausts and chamber shape, just wish it were a tad smaller in diameter.  I still like the smaller chamber for the small bores.  JMO, but now with several options, it all comes down to service, quality, integrity, and lastly, cost.  You still get my business whenever possible.  I will have to say it is easier to get 310cfm from your head than the Edelbrocks, and for a full on porting, your head will be a few cfm ahead, also.   Joe-JDC 

[Barry_R]

Curious to hear what they come up with.  CFM by itself is definitely not the entire story.  I can tell you that the CNC program we have run through a few pair of my castings will go 369 cfm at reasonable/achievable race valve lifts - that's a fair amount more than I can get out of unwelded Edelbrock castings.

I have been pretty quiet lately on the forums because I've focused on getting shop work - where we are way behind - moving out the door. 

[sumfoo1]

Barry, do you still use your own head's even on the wildest builds or do you go to a dove high rise or something?


I'm just wondering.

[bn69stang]

So am i in the ballpark in say ng that going from a 72 cc chamber to a 76 cc chamber i would loose about a 1/2 point in compression on a 4.17 inch bore ? ..Bud

[Barry_R]

I currently use my heads on most stuff - but not all.  On a street oriented build between 500 and 600 horsepower they are working very well for us as cast with a good valve job and a bowl blend.  The lowest powered 445 with them so far made 497HP, and the highest powered engine so far (not counting the CNC ported version on my EMC engine) was a 527 at 624 horsepower.

The CNC ported version made 711 HP at the Engine Masters Challenge - more to come on that at a later time.

The Blue Thunder heads are better for a true race engine - using the eight fasteners for T&D rockers, and taking advantage of the raised exhaust port.  The BT medium riser has a very large cast port that is most appropriate only in large displacement engines - where it works pretty well.  The Blue Thunder high riser heads are the basis for our highest horsepower race builds.  We've only been a bit over 800HP with then here, but at least one customer has the same heads at over 900...

[Joe-JDC]

CC'd a KCII intake port today, and it came in at 195.6ccs, flows 338/238 @ .750" with a 2.190/1.745" valve without an exhaust pipe extention.  Flowed on 4.250" bore fixture @ 28".   Joe-JDC

[HolmanMoodyStroppeVet]

I think we should discuss your goal, and intended use too. Are you racing in a class, or bracket racing maybe, street cruising?

I think the Survival head is wonderful for many builds, and have urged guys to use them for many projects for several reasons, the better chamber,ports and quality is nice.  The ED head may need welding if you try to change some features, you can get the raw heads and make it a race piece, if you need every advantage like a Super Stocker with real high compression, a tunnel and so on.

I also like that the Survival head is made in America, with certified Alcoa aluminum, heat treated right, and finish machined in Michigan where it all began. Barry has really helped the FE brethren a lot, so send him an call

[bn69stang]

I have a set of stock eds on my 434 inch 428 , but after reading Barry s book , And Jay s book and having a motor in in the 430 ish h p range , i am upgrading to a hyd roller and a bigger carb , and either modify ng my ed s or buying a set of Barry s heads . I intend on building a stroker of either 463 inchs or maybe  even a 482 with a block purchase and want a set of heads that will work on both .. Bud

[ScotiaFE]

The biggest gain with your stock Ed's will be a valve job.
Change out the stock Ed valves and go to a 2.1ish intake and use a 45* seat.