Has anyone run a Crower 284F or 278FDP in a 428 or bigger?

[My427stang]

The last two on this list

http://www.crower.com/index.php/camshafts.html?cat=918

Crower describes 278FDP as being more wild, but the specs don't seem to match that.

Also backwards, they claim the milder 284 cam needs a lot more spring (100 lbs more on their site) than the 278.  So they contradict each other.

I am thinking that there may be some typos on the site

Has anyone ran either of these cams? wondering how they do for a street strip kind of build

[bn69stang]

No i have nt , what is all the info on the build ? , what are you wanting to do withn this build ? .. Bud

[My427stang]

If I told you, you'd tell me to put less cam in it

Going solids on my 445 powered 4x4 F100, looking to try something significantly different.  The cam I'd recommend would be a 282S, but I have never followed the beaten path with this truck

10:1 445, ported D2 iron heads flowing 277 from .500 on up, ported RPM intake, headers, took out a 270H that I retarded 4 degrees to feed it a little higher in the RPM range, and it ran great, but want something more and want to experiment a bit

The reason I asked is that these are very different than what most people run, old school is probably a good name for it, but the dyno programs seem to like them if you advance the heck out of them, so I was going to try one of them on a really early intake centerline 

However, after thinking a bit more these cams are out of the running based on lift.  When you subtract lash they just don't have enough lift for a big set of heads, they just bump where my heads start working hard and then they are on the way back down.

I may just go with a bullet custom grind

[JamesonRacing]

I put a 282S in the 480" FE in my 66 F250.  I know it's not the one you're considering, but the cam is reasonable at idle, strong mid-range, seems to be done past 5k.  I didn't get more aggressive as I use the truck to pull my race trailer, so torque was what I was looking for.

[turbohunter]

Didn't you just finish that truck?

[KMcCullah]

If I told you, you'd tell me to put less cam in it

Going solids on my 445 powered 4x4 F100, looking to try something significantly different.  The cam I'd recommend would be a 282S, but I have never followed the beaten path with this truck

10:1 445, ported D2 iron heads flowing 277 from .500 on up, ported RPM intake, headers, took out a 270H that I retarded 4 degrees to feed it a little higher in the RPM range, and it ran great, but want something more and want to experiment a bit

The reason I asked is that these are very different than what most people run, old school is probably a good name for it, but the dyno programs seem to like them if you advance the heck out of them, so I was going to try one of them on a really early intake centerline 

However, after thinking a bit more these cams are out of the running based on lift.  When you subtract lash they just don't have enough lift for a big set of heads, they just bump where my heads start working hard and then they are on the way back down.

I may just go with a bullet custom grind

Hey Ross- How about a hydraulic roller? You may need different springs though. http://www.oregoncamshaft.com/Hydraulic-Rol-Cam-Specs.html
There's a few on the bottom of the list that look good to me. This is the direction I'm gonna head with my build. But with a 4.375 crank.

[TorinoBP88]

No way a (280) 245* at 0.050 can is going to pull form 1200 RPM, but the (260) 228* cam says pull from 2500. THis is backwards,

 I say don't read their specs, go with your gut.  Personally I would do the 228* cam, but that's WAY smaller then you want. :-)

I would consider the 278* as its the smaller of the two, but since you love to push it,

Go ahead and get the 280F cam.  The wider 114 separation might even let you install a EFI throttle body/EFI "carb" one day.

[My427stang]

Well, I missed these replies, sorry about that

I ended up going with a custom single pattern Bullet from Brent.  I actually wanted to do something real unique for an experiment, but ended up going with something relatively standard

Its a Bullet lobe, same lobe intake and exhaust, pretty close to a 282S lobe.  However, I spread the centers to 112 but I am going to install it at 104 or 106, depending on what it looks like when I degree it.  My game plan is to degree it less lash and see how it compares to the 270H at the valve for IVC then degree accordingly, that one had worked out pretty well.

The added lift should help the good heads, and even at 112, it has a bit more overlap than the 270H.  When combined with the earlier ICL, I am hoping I will gain along the whole curve.  We'll see

So the real question is why?  Well, I had the strangest noise, a little valve tick at the oddest times, turns out one lifter had a crack across the base, straight across like splitting a piece of wood.  It was polished like it was running that way and hadn't eaten the cam, but the heel of the cam had a wider wear mark than the other lobes.  I had never seen a lifter crack across the lobe, and these maybe had 10K on them at the most.

My hunch is that the wide mark on the heel was due to the lifter losing its shape and sitting lower on the lobe, I honestly think a new lifter would probably do it, but even after measuring lobe taper, I couldn't get myself to trust it. (Better way to say it is I didnt want to have to take it apart again LOL)

So I am going from 270H .519/.519  110 LSA on 110 ICL, to approx 282/upper 230's/.550-ish after lash 112 LSA on 106 or 104.

Also going from stock  1.73 hyd rockers with aftermarket shafts and Doug Garifos end stands to a full Erson adjustable needle bearing set

All in all hoping for a little boost without killing the bottom end of the curve, we'll see

[jayb]

Got any photos of that cracked lifter Ross?  I've never seen that before...

[My427stang]

I can't get a good shot of it, but if you draw an imaginary line from 10:00 to 4:00 you can see the straight line shadow

That shadow is a small crack, in addition the lifter is just slightly concave, not like its worn, but like it folded in slightly, which makes the little bit of a wear circle as you can also see

[jayb]

That is really a weird failure.  Almost like a shock failure, rather than stress or wear...

[machoneman]

Never saw one like that either. I wonder.....if you pull apart the lifter and measure the thickness of the cam-side face. It almost looks like it caved or cratered in, meaning the metal isn't very thick and/or heated treated correctly. Btw, have no idea what the thickness s/b but a check of other  lifters from another supplier (not the others in the engine now) would give a comparison. JMO.   

[cjshaker]

I have seen that happen before. I figured it happened from valve float and some hard contact between the cam and lifter. The engine had been ran hard and had experienced valve float a couple of times. Not sure if that's what happened here (I know Ross NEVER runs his engines hard ), but that was my best guess on the other engine.

[My427stang]

So here is the history of this cam and lifters.  Bought in the early 90s, I was in my 20s.  Stabbed it in a good stock rebuild and ran the truck like a 25 year old runs a truck.  Really good maintenance, but run hard.

I had run it with stock style springs and would rarely float the valves, but as the springs got more tired, I'd hit that point now and again. 

I bet that banging those pieces, but having very low spring pressure, allowed it to live, then putting it back together with quite a bit more spring pressure in the 445, started giving up the ghost.  Ironically, if you look around that area, the engine seemed to be trying to nicely wear in the new lifter surface, but there is no way it could have, eventually it would have failed.

When I assembled it though, all looked good, my guess is I just couldn't see the crack until the added spring pressure moved it around a bit.

I like solids better anyway

[machoneman]

Hold the phone! I guess we should have all asked more questions.

Do I now understand these are actually old lifters, with lots of hard miles, run on two different cams?