Author Topic: Will an FE fit?  (Read 5220 times)

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Dan859

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Will an FE fit?
« on: October 07, 2024, 09:46:27 AM »
Hi Everyone,
I've read that an FE will fit into an 80's Fairmont.  Will it also fit either the 83-88 Tbirds, or the 89-97 version.  I like the Tbird body styles better, and if the engine will fit, I'd rather go that route.  Also, are there aftermarket wiring harnesses to adapt the harness to the FE engine.  Thanks in advance for your help.
Take care,
Dan

CaptCobrajet

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Re: Will an FE fit?
« Reply #1 on: October 07, 2024, 10:07:35 AM »
83-88 Bird is no problem.  I always thought an 87-88 Turbo Coupe with an alum FE would be a neat street car. 
Blair Patrick

blykins

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Re: Will an FE fit?
« Reply #2 on: October 07, 2024, 12:26:29 PM »
I believe that you can put an FE in any Fox Body.
Brent Lykins
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Urgefor

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Re: Will an FE fit?
« Reply #3 on: October 07, 2024, 01:04:45 PM »
Also, are there aftermarket wiring harnesses to adapt the harness to the FE engine.  Thanks in advance for your help.

Unless you have made a number of modifications, wiring will consist of coolant temp sensor, ignition coil and oil pressure sensor.

If the alternator is considered to be part of the engine, that would need to be taken into account as well.

If you haven't already, consider a 3G alternator swap for the FE.

Rory428

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Re: Will an FE fit?
« Reply #4 on: October 07, 2024, 07:29:33 PM »
I have owned my 78 Fairmont since 1986, and raced it with 427/428 FE engines from 1988 thru 2016 or 17, both with a C6 and a Jerico 4 speed. I believe that the 83-86 Thunderbird engine compartment is identical to the Fairmont or FOX Mustang. When I was building my Fairmont, there was no such thing as commercially available aftermarket tubular front K members, so we modified the factory K member. We made our own custom motor mounts, modified a factory FE 4x4 rear sump oil pan, to work with the steering rack, mechanical clutch linkage, and over the years, had 3 different sets of custom fabricated headers, one set made by fellow forum member Tom Posthuma. As for wiring, I retained the factory alternator, and used all the factory wiring from the original engine (my car was a factory 4 cylinder car) with the FE. Although I am currently running a 347 SB Ford engine, with a G Force 4 speed, and a tubular K member, with factory lower control arms with the coil springs in the original location. Not sure how the height of the engine to hood clearance compares from Fairmont to Thunderbird, but my stock flat hood would have closed with a lower height intake manifold, and Len Schneider used to race his Super Stock 84 Thunderbird with a 428 CJ when he first started racing it around 1984 , and it fit underneath the stock hood, although he has been running 351Cs shortly afterwards. The FE has much more working room under the hood of the FOX than my previous 68-69 Fairlanes and 69-70 Mustangs, although the wide, angled lower control arms do make routing header tubes challanging, at least with the factory K member.
1978 Fairmont,FE 427 with 428 crank, 4 speed Jerico best of 9.972@132.54MPH 1.29 60 foot
1985 Mustang HB 331 SB Ford, 4 speed Jerico, best of 10.29@128 MPH 1.40 60 foot.
1974 F350 race car hauler 390 NP435 4 speed
1959 Ford Meteor 2 dr sedan. 428 Cobra Jet, 4 speed Toploader. 12.54@ 108 MPH

MeanGene

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Re: Will an FE fit?
« Reply #5 on: October 07, 2024, 10:35:18 PM »
After my ex-gf crunched my 88 LSC, I seriously considered a making it a Hot Rod Lincoln. Man, that was a sweet driving car

Stangman

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Re: Will an FE fit?
« Reply #6 on: October 08, 2024, 09:27:10 AM »
I had a really nice 81 T bird with hideaway lights always wanted to make that a nice street car. It came with the 255 v8 so it would have been a piece of cake. Sold that car for a 64 Lemans.

fomocoloco

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Re: Will an FE fit?
« Reply #7 on: October 09, 2024, 06:59:02 AM »
I am working on an 88 bird now. had a health issue that set me back a year but motor is done and running. BP helped me put together a 427 stroker .just got a 6r80 transmission a couple of weeks ago. also got the adaptor and quick 6 controller about a week ago so here we go. car is a combination of parts from the original bird and a turbo coupe parts car. 8.8 4.10 gears c clip eliminators Detroit locker. 5 lug front and rear. i think i have gathered enough time that i can concentrate on finishing it up. i hope so. should be fun.

jim oberg
9 65-72  f100 sb trucks 6 428's 1 460 2 521 strokers
1 66 f100 lb ranger
3 67-75 f350
numerous parts vehicles and parts

Dan859

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Re: Will an FE fit?
« Reply #8 on: October 10, 2024, 09:33:28 AM »
I'd like to thank everyone for their replies.  It looks to be a doable project, so I guess the next step is to find a car  :).  I did find some line drawings and measurements for the FE, 351W, and the OHC engines.  The OHC is the widest of them all, but the carbureted engines are taller; might need a hood scoop.  It looks like the biggest issue is the K frame.  I'll need to check with the aftermarket manufacturers, but it doesn't look like there's a big difference in the motor mounts between the FE and the 429 blocks. 
Anyone else with experience in a swap like this, please feel free to chip in.  Thanks.

fomocoloco

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Re: Will an FE fit?
« Reply #9 on: November 06, 2024, 09:20:44 PM »
i just finished getting the FE block coupled with the adaptor and 6R80 transmission mocked up in my 88 T Bird. got the front motor mounts fabbed up with a part of A foxbody motor mount AND A F100  FE pickup motor mount & a piece of square tubing. worked slick. i took some pictures but not sure i can master the technology to put them on here. the transmission fits the transmission tunnel with no problem anywhere. no hammering or any of that s**t. i am very surprised. got a transmission mount on the way from ebay to fashion up a new transmission mount from the 6r80 to the fox body chasis. its going to look like it was born in there. i'm making progress.

jim
9 65-72  f100 sb trucks 6 428's 1 460 2 521 strokers
1 66 f100 lb ranger
3 67-75 f350
numerous parts vehicles and parts

410bruce

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Re: Will an FE fit?
« Reply #10 on: November 23, 2024, 08:01:17 AM »
The valve cover to power brake booster may be an issue.

fomocoloco

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Re: Will an FE fit?
« Reply #11 on: November 24, 2024, 06:23:49 AM »
i changed mine over to manual brakes. currently redoing the brake lines. swapped in the rear a from 88 turbo coupe parts car and the brake lines from same. used 1993 mustang cobra master cylinder and the manual brake adaptor from LMR. 6R80 transmission fits the tunnel well but no kit for the front motor mounts or transmission mount from vendors. Stifflers support is helping me with adapting their crossmember for the 6R80 for the bird in exchange for some pictures when done. super support. project is coming together. also the frame rail kit for a mustang will have to be modified  as the design and placement of the frame rails on a tbird is different than a mustang. it is all doable. a little heavier than a fairmont but will still be fast enough for me. i bought a 77 lincoln versailles but that required to much modification to the front suspension for me. nice car with best brakes i ever drove with the hydroboost and 4 wheel disc brakes but i abandoned that idea.

jim
9 65-72  f100 sb trucks 6 428's 1 460 2 521 strokers
1 66 f100 lb ranger
3 67-75 f350
numerous parts vehicles and parts

Rory428

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Re: Will an FE fit?
« Reply #12 on: November 24, 2024, 12:30:06 PM »
Since my 78 Fairmont started life as a stripper model, it came from the factory with manual steering and brakes, so I never had to worry about a power brake booster. Concerning factory FOX body transmission crossmembers, the early cars (78 thru 80 or 81) had mounting brackets on the unibody that were considerably narrower than the later (82 onward) cars. All the early cars were single exhaust, the later cars used a "double hump" trans crossmember , to clear the dual head pipes. These double hump crossmembers have longer end tubes, that will not fit between mounting brackets on the earlier cars, but are easily modified. I have a custom made,square tube crossmember in my 78 drag car, but I have used factory double hump crossmembers on my other 78, and a 80 Fairmont, and I just removed the rubber bushings from the end tubes, and cut the tubes down so they would fit the early car narrower brackets. I reinstalled the rubber bushings, and cut the inner tube so that it would also fit the narrower brackets. Since my FE swap in the Fairmont was all custom made from scratch, my engine was lower and further back than the more common 429/460 swap kits, and my trans mount was further rearward than the factory transmission crossmember would work with.
1978 Fairmont,FE 427 with 428 crank, 4 speed Jerico best of 9.972@132.54MPH 1.29 60 foot
1985 Mustang HB 331 SB Ford, 4 speed Jerico, best of 10.29@128 MPH 1.40 60 foot.
1974 F350 race car hauler 390 NP435 4 speed
1959 Ford Meteor 2 dr sedan. 428 Cobra Jet, 4 speed Toploader. 12.54@ 108 MPH

fomocoloco

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Re: Will an FE fit?
« Reply #13 on: November 25, 2024, 06:48:49 AM »
Stifflers is fixing me up by giving me some different ends for their crossmember with more adjustment. the mustang crossmember and brackets place the transmission 1 1/2 inches toward the left side. their brackets for a ford pickup with a 6r80 install has different brackets. combing one of those brackets with the adjustable brackets from the mustang will allow me to center the transmission in the tunnel with some robust new parts, my only issue now is headers, i bolted a pair of heads to the block that i used to fab up the motor mounts and the driver side head number 8 cylinder is closer than i would like to the column even though it is centered in the tunnel equal  on both sides and positioned to give me an inch clearance to the radiator. not sure whether to try see if custom headers can be fashioned or make some different solid motor mounts to offset the motor a half inch to an inch to the passenger side. maybe the center dump style header may fit like the design of the FT exhaust manifold. i have a local mechanic who can and has built several sets of custom headers but im not sure he can make some work at the current configuration. I know I cant. thee tbird and mustang floor pans are different. not all foxbodies  are alike. but i like the bird.

jim
« Last Edit: November 25, 2024, 03:46:55 PM by fomocoloco »
9 65-72  f100 sb trucks 6 428's 1 460 2 521 strokers
1 66 f100 lb ranger
3 67-75 f350
numerous parts vehicles and parts

Rory428

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Re: Will an FE fit?
« Reply #14 on: November 25, 2024, 08:48:39 AM »
From the factory, even the 302 is offset to the passenger side by a noticeable amount, and when we swapped the FE into my Fairmont almost 40 years ago, we also had the engine offset to the passenger side. Too bad that I am too "computer illiterate" to post photos on this site, as I have several photos of the headers that I used on my Fairmont, which still had the factory K member al the time it had the FE in it, as when we were building the car, aftermarket K members were years away from being available. The first set of headers, which I got from Len Schneider when he switched from a FE to a 351C in his 83/84 Thunderbird Super Stock car, fell about many years ago, but I do have several photos of them, as well as the custom made set that TomP built for me , probably about 20 years ago. I still have those headers, even though the collectors , which were used from the Schnieder headers, are about as thin as an aluminum Coke can. I also bought a set of FE FOX headers several years ago, from another Super Stock racer, who was running a 428 CJ in his 93 Mustang SS/GT car, with a 4 speed. He is still racing his Mustang, but with a small block Ford. IF I ever put a FE back in the Fairmont, I will likely try those headers. If you are on some of the FE Facebook groups, I can post photos to Facebook, but I have never been able to figure out how to put photos from my cell phone to either of the FE websites.
1978 Fairmont,FE 427 with 428 crank, 4 speed Jerico best of 9.972@132.54MPH 1.29 60 foot
1985 Mustang HB 331 SB Ford, 4 speed Jerico, best of 10.29@128 MPH 1.40 60 foot.
1974 F350 race car hauler 390 NP435 4 speed
1959 Ford Meteor 2 dr sedan. 428 Cobra Jet, 4 speed Toploader. 12.54@ 108 MPH