Not to be political, but a question about insurance rates

[Joe-JDC]

I don't know how most of you are seeing your insurance rates change at renewal time, but I am simply appalled at my recent renewal rate for my 3 daily drivers, and my home insurance.  It has risen from $2415.10 for my home and cars/truck in 2020 to $8428.10 due the first of August.  The same vehicles, same insurance, and I have price compared and still have the best rates of all the major insurers.  I have no accidents, tickets, or claims on the record for either me or my wife.  Being on SS and retirement income, this is a major hit for a senior citizen.  This is over $700.00 a month just for insurance and a 340% increase in 4 years.  The insurance industry if out of control.  My Hagerty insurance on two classic cars for replacement value has not changed but a few dollars in 5 years.  How are you folks seeing your insurance renewal prices?  Just wondering why this is so blatantly unreasonable to me. Sorry Jay if this is off limits, just delete it.   Joe-JDC

[kraut61]

  Joe, I also am from Texas (east TX) and have seen this similary in my area. I recently had changed from Germania due to increased rates. I went with State Farm and was dropped one week later after making a claim because a deer flew through the passenger side windshield and ended up in the back seat of Wife's 2018 Expedition. Wasn't her fault because the deer was hit and deflected from being hit by a different driver. Additionally, SF uses a third party to do home inspections, they came by unannounced and nobody was at home so they couldn't do the inspection in a timely manner and made the note of their trip that "there were ferocious dogs " in the yard....funny, this was their reason for dropping homowners (bundled policy). I did get a decent rate quote and am currently with Farmers.
  I have never been dedicated to any insurance company and have changed several over the years, I'm 63. When I had moved local agents/companies over the years I have never had any of them to contact me afterward and ask " whats up or how can we help".
  I am almost to the point of dropping homerowners completely. FYI, on homeowners raise the deductable as high that will allow especially if you own your home.
                    KARL

[jayb]

Joe, I've seen the same thing with my home insurance, up to about $7500 a year for the house and the shop.  Used to be $2800 5 years ago.  According to my agent the insurance companies are losing their butts right now from all the weather issues, and claims arising from that.  He claims that the insurance companies working in Minnesota where I am have lost money for 3 years running, and are looking for reasons to drop home customers with any issues.  Before I could get them to insure me this year I had to spend $2200 on fireproof cabinets for storing race gas and paint, and also get six 10 pound fire extinguishers installed at various places in my shop, that have to be re-tagged each year just like a commercial property. 

I have Auto Owners for my home and shop insurance, but still have State Farm for auto.  I've been with State Farm since 1974, and never had an accident, so I think that's why the rates have stayed low.  My agent for the home insurance, who is an old friend, tells me that Auto Owners is top notch in terms of paying claims, and that State Farm sucks for that, but I don't know if that's really true since I've never had to make a claim with them.

Anyway, insurance rates are definitely through the roof, and this year I seriously considered just bailing on the homeowners insurance.  I've only had one claim in 27 years at this address, and it was only for $16K.  The wife wouldn't have it though, so we are wasting money on insurance again this year...

[Joe-JDC]

Speaking of Homeowners insurance, my home tax base has risen over 40% in the same time period, and if I were not a SCDAV, I would not be able to live in the home I have paid the loan off over 23 years ago.  I see that the renewal is 1% of their appraised value, which is about 50K more than the County tax base appraisal.  My point is that there does not seem to be any regulation on how much the insurance industry can raise the rates because everyone must have insurance to register and renew their license plates.  TX requires an annual safety inspection on all vehicles, and that has been waived starting 1Jan25, but they are still going to increase the license fee the same amount for some project we do not have a say in.  I had State Farm insurance for nearly 40 years, but when the local agent retired, the rates went through the roof, and have continued to climb.  I found Safeco/Liberty through my credit union to be the best at this time.  Allstate, Farmers, USAA, SF, Geico, and Progressive were all much higher than Safeco for the exact same coverages.  Joe-JDC

[cjshaker]

Same issues here in Ohio. My homeowners went up over 10% this year alone, which is way less than most people have seen. When I complained, I got the same standard issue response of "more storms and claims" as the reasoning. Bull. The same is happening all over the country from what I see on various forums I frequent, so that answer is crap.

The simple fact is that everything, everywhere, has gotten more expensive. When it costs 3-4 times as much as a couple years ago to purchase simple stuff like plywood, lumber, parts, food, basically everything, then the costs of replacing, repairing, rebuilding etc is going to follow suit.

It all started with the Covid lockdowns, which any reasonable person should have seen as a catastrophic response. I know you don't want this to get political, but it is. Stupid is as stupid does.

[jmlay]

Had a couple of long conversation with my independent insurance rep a couple of months ag. Our home owners went up $2000 this year, with Safeco. He tried to find a better rate with other providers and well as rewriting my policy with safeco. The best option was to continue with the renewal. Apparently the state legislature has changed the minimum deductible to 2%. Rewriting my policy or moving to another provider would change my deductible to 2%. The good news is the minimum deductible is moving to 5%!!! I purchased my house for $300k in 2015. The housing market has gone crazy here in the DFW area. The tax man says my house is valued at over $600k. I just do t see it… At 5% my deductible will be north of $30k! In short we will be paying higher rates for overpriced homes, high deductibles with no insurance benefit unless the house burns to the ground…

[428kidd]

100 percent Doug. Every thing is linked. when stuff goes up by 40 percent look for the remainder to follow suit. Like things like they are continue down this path , don't consider making a change !

[gregaba]

I have never filed a homeowners claim.
My Homeowners cost was going up two hundred  dollars every 6 months.
I decided that it wasn't worth it and cancelled the homeowners insurance on both homes I own and my shop.
If everything burns down I will buy a nice tent from Walmart.
Greg

[mike7570]

Joe, our insurance has gone up just like yours, I’m well over $8,000 and our insurance company is requesting another 34% increase from the state insurance commissioner. I am also retired and on fixed income and my wife and I are debating canceling all but liability coverage or moving to another state.

[My427stang]

Let me tell you guys a story....

My daughter got in a wreck, 70K 2016 absolutely immaculate Jeep Wrangler Unlimited.  Deployed two airbags, but Jeep didn't look wrecked, bent bumper, plastic fender flare torn.  I arrived, cut the airbag out, and drove to bodyshop, not a squeak, rattle or issue driving.  All the cost was airbag stuff

Now, when dad and I had the garage and bodyshop, adjusters would nickel and dime you for used parts, repairing parts, you name it, drop the price to fix.  It was a pain, but understood, keep costs down, not an option today.  Quote was determined by a third party who never saw the car in person.  Body shop only took pictures for them from 4 corners

What happened here is they then added up LIST prices, for example, passenger side airbag was 2400.00 alone.  Then totalled the vehicle at an over 20K repair bill. 

As a legal and registered Nebraska auto repair business, I offered a discount quote, took the actual approved estimate and wrote up the same part numbers at retail prices, what any of us would pay at mopar.com, with sources, no shortcuts, same labor, same part numbers, same procedures. (that 2400-dollar airbag was 1600 retail, and my cost was 1100).  Even at retail, I ended up at 14K, which wouldn't have totaled the car.

Their heads exploded, so I gave them my reasons I wanted to save the car and showed the extensive service records, recent pictures, upgrades, etc, and even offered a military discount to drop it further, not to mention full (and expected) option to reinspect and save all parts and receipts.  (Remember, running driving car after the accident)

The bureaucracy would not allow it, so, with all my inputs on the car's quality and maintenance, they instead RAISED my payout by almost 4000 and paid me well for the now totaled Jeep.

As a recap
- LIST prices higher than retail lost the original local body shop the job
- Would not allow retail prices on the same quote from another business losing me as a repair shop
- Would not allow discounts, which just seems crazy
- PAID out ridiculously to the point I would have been silly to try to pursue. 

She got a new Grand Cherokee, I ended up buying the Jeep back, cheap, and now I will be in it cheap as a spare parts runner and I can fix with used and aftermarket parts, but with a salvage title because of unrealistic and non-negotiable costs.  As hail damage and other things happen, the scale of this is enormous, never mind homeowner insurance.  Raising prices for everyone's insurance, be very careful if you have anything but a very high dollar car and you drive it in for damage.  You may lose it, but you probably will get paid well

[oldiron.fe]

    it would be interesting to see a real audit of insurance companys-must have some numbers out in the world-- no way things are not changing-- i have seen comments that Fla/Cal may soon be unsurable due to weather storms/floods/building materials etc!    far too much construction in flood/ storm prone areas !!  along the missipp. river southern wi rivers several small towns have been moved over the years due to regular flooding-but were were built in places 100 + years ago with poor/ no planning re. flooding --- 10,000 years ago i would be living at the southern edge of the ice that covered every thing to the north-- in the 1940s when i was a kid we could ski/sled over plowed fields much of the winter--now not for 50+ years---with natural or man added? warming beware where things are being built--- it seems best insurance deals are best/good rated insurance companys that are regional that do not have a lot of coverage in cal. and southeast coastal coverage where effects of weather events are the worst and high property values---property value taxes and insurance has been a pain here too SE MN.   john   old iron

[482supersnake]

The plan is to price people out of their with tax and insurance increases so the large investment banks can buy the property up and rent it back to you.

Remember, you'll own nothing and be happy

[hbstang]

we use AAA for home and auto in southern cal,,car ins went up to 2450 for three cars,1 is liability only,so i upped the deductable to max and it brought it down to $2k.we are not in a flood or fire zone so home ins has double in last 6 years.still reasonable

[cleandan]

Let me tell you guys a story....

My daughter got in a wreck, 70K 2016 absolutely immaculate Jeep Wrangler Unlimited.  Deployed two airbags, but Jeep didn't look wrecked, bent bumper, plastic fender flare torn.  I arrived, cut the airbag out, and drove to bodyshop, not a squeak, rattle or issue driving.  All the cost was airbag stuff

Now, when dad and I had the garage and bodyshop, adjusters would nickel and dime you for used parts, repairing parts, you name it, drop the price to fix.  It was a pain, but understood, keep costs down, not an option today.  Quote was determined by a third party who never saw the car in person.  Body shop only took pictures for them from 4 corners

What happened here is they then added up LIST prices, for example, passenger side airbag was 2400.00 alone.  Then totalled the vehicle at an over 20K repair bill. 

As a legal and registered Nebraska auto repair business, I offered a discount quote, took the actual approved estimate and wrote up the same part numbers at retail prices, what any of us would pay at mopar.com, with sources, no shortcuts, same labor, same part numbers, same procedures. (that 2400-dollar airbag was 1600 retail, and my cost was 1100).  Even at retail, I ended up at 14K, which wouldn't have totaled the car.

Their heads exploded, so I gave them my reasons I wanted to save the car and showed the extensive service records, recent pictures, upgrades, etc, and even offered a military discount to drop it further, not to mention full (and expected) option to reinspect and save all parts and receipts.  (Remember, running driving car after the accident)

The bureaucracy would not allow it, so, with all my inputs on the car's quality and maintenance, they instead RAISED my payout by almost 4000 and paid me well for the now totaled Jeep.

As a recap
- LIST prices higher than retail lost the original local body shop the job
- Would not allow retail prices on the same quote from another business losing me as a repair shop
- Would not allow discounts, which just seems crazy
- PAID out ridiculously to the point I would have been silly to try to pursue. 

She got a new Grand Cherokee, I ended up buying the Jeep back, cheap, and now I will be in it cheap as a spare parts runner and I can fix with used and aftermarket parts, but with a salvage title because of unrealistic and non-negotiable costs.  As hail damage and other things happen, the scale of this is enormous, never mind homeowner insurance.  Raising prices for everyone's insurance, be very careful if you have anything but a very high dollar car and you drive it in for damage.  You may lose it, but you probably will get paid well

This is the new normal in the auto repair industry.
An incident occurs and the vehicle is damaged, but not much....often still being safe and driveable without repairs.
The insurance company takes a cursory look and declares the vehicles a total loss....often times to the detriment of the vehicle owner.
Most people have little to no mechanical abilites or understanding concerning the ways of mechanical things so they take the loss appraisal at face value and proceed with the total loss claim.
At which point an otherwise viable vehicle is removed from the road and often a new vehicle is purchased as the replacement.

Because this makes very little mechanical and financial sense....specifically because the repairs required are not extensive or critical, I have come to believe there is a concerted effort to simply remove any older vehicles from the road, and claiming a "total loss" by insurance is but one method for doing just that.
Its just a theory based on direct experiences I have had dealing with lightly damaged vehicles being written off as a "total loss" by the insurance company.

[badcatt]

I was rear ended and pushed in to the back of a pickup in my 2015 Ford Focus(in 2018) the first estimate by an adjuster from my insurance co was for If I recall $9700. I thought that was low and had it sent to a shop not far from me. They did a inspection and estimated it at $11,000ish. The insurance co for the guy that hit me though that was high and ordered them to partly dismantle the car for a better estimate. That came in at closer to $14,000. At the time almost full retail value of the car. Note, none of my air bags deployed.