Metallic mud- oh crap! Will I have an oiling issue? 427 solid roller cam.

[fairlaniac]

Coming home from the Ford Nationals at Carlisle I began to hear a faint, unidentifiable noise which quickly turned into sounding like a broken rocker dancing around under the valve cover. That happened last year so I know the sound. I ran the car longer than I should have but oh well... Today I start looking. No broken rockers but #8 intake rocker has a little extra clearance. I pull the Harland Sharp equipped rocker shaft assembly. Nothing on the wheel. So I drop my lighted bore scope in the push rod hole but the light is too bright to make out anything.

So I pull the oil filter, cut it open for inspection. My magnet is clean as shown. Then I swipe it through a couple of pleats and you can see the collection of ferrous bits. Not good, I then pull the oil drain plug and it has a stalactite on it of metallic mud.

That's all the further I feel like going today. I guess the Fairlane is done for most of the summer 

I'm wondering if I lost a roller lifter? It sounded like the valve train as in lighter parts. No serious hammering. Regardless, it's damage. As a mechanical engineer I can't help but go through scenarios and figure out what happened. I'm wondering if putting the Tremec TKX in and driving the highway at 2200 RPM if I'm not slinging enough oil up to the solid rollers lifters? It's a '66 solid lifter 427 block. I'm picturing a frozen up roller wheel ground flat and my Bullet cam ground down. Oh well, after June is over I'll have time to rebuild. Ugh!

http://www.fairlanet.com/images/shavings2.jpg
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[Jb427]

Well that sucks

When I first was looking at buying engine parts I found a guy that had a 427 short block forsale he was drag racing it in an early mustang he was running a roller cam in it and he had some thing done to spray or get more oil down there I can't remember what it was but i think he had pipes running in the valley that put extra oil on the lifters. I didn't end up buying the bottom end it was 14-1 comp radical thing it did have a ton of very early go fast parts on it.

I may still have the photos I will look and see it I can find them.

[blykins]

Unless it's something like a Victor intake, you can usually fish the lifter pair out through various orifices in the intake manifold.  Easy to inspect that way.  I'd pull the lifter pair on the rocker that you thought was loose and check it out. 

Normally, you don't see many non-pressure-fed solid roller lifters going longer than several thousand miles, so it's possible, but you could easily rule it out.

[fairlaniac]

Unless it's something like a Victor intake, you can usually fish the lifter pair out through various orifices in the intake manifold.  Easy to inspect that way.  I'd pull the lifter pair on the rocker that you thought was loose and check it out. 

Normally, you don't see many non-pressure-fed solid roller lifters going longer than several thousand miles, so it's possible, but you could easily rule it out.

I have an Edelbrock RPM intake. I'll give it a shot on trying to fish out. The smallest opening is between the #7 & #8 push rod holes. I'll have to think out this approach. Any special picks, magnets, tools to help remove the lifter pair?

Thanks!

[Jb427]

Sorry Fairlaniac dose not seem like I have the photos anymore
that guy also had oil lines that went into the centre of the cross bolts   

[blykins]

Unless it's something like a Victor intake, you can usually fish the lifter pair out through various orifices in the intake manifold.  Easy to inspect that way.  I'd pull the lifter pair on the rocker that you thought was loose and check it out. 

Normally, you don't see many non-pressure-fed solid roller lifters going longer than several thousand miles, so it's possible, but you could easily rule it out.

I have an Edelbrock RPM intake. I'll give it a shot on trying to fish out. The smallest opening is between the #7 & #8 push rod holes. I'll have to think out this approach. Any special picks, magnets, tools to help remove the lifter pair?

Thanks!

I've done it on a Performer RPM.  A telescoping magnet will get it done.  You can also pull the distributor and pass the lifter pair down the lifter valley with a magnet and pull it out the distributor hole.  Many ways to do it. 

Putting it back in is a little tougher, but a pair of magnets will get it. 

[TurboChris]

I'm wondering if putting the Tremec TKX in and driving the highway at 2200 RPM if I'm not slinging enough oil up to the solid rollers lifters? It's a '66 solid lifter 427 block. I'm picturing a frozen up roller wheel ground flat and my Bullet cam ground down.

As one who is currently in the middle of my tkx swap... I certainly hope this is not the case. Good luck with what you find out!

[My427stang]

War story, back in the early 2000s, I had a group of Rat Chevy customers and they were eating non-oiled pin rollers at 2-3000 street miles.  I called Comp and they said every 75 passes they should be rebuilt (75 x 1/4 mile) 

Now, a BBC offset loads the lifter, a BBC is not an FE, but I would not be surprised if a non-oiled pin failed.

Hopefully you didn't hurt too much, but if you can't get oil to them with your block, I'd likely pull the intake and swap/rebuild all 8 pairs.

If you did lose one and took out the cam, I'd likely do a solid flat with tool steel lifters.  long run I'd call it safer for a long hauler

[machoneman]

Think I'd still pull the entire engine down. Too much debris for my liking.

[Barry_R]

Small flashlight(s) with flexible stalks are a necessity.

You can usually bring the roller pair up using some welding wire with a "hook" bent into the end to snag the tie bar.

Once out of the bore, use a couple magnets to walk the pair forward to the distributor hole.

If it crushed out the needles, the debris you're seeing could be the sides of the lifter body alongside the axle.

If that's the case, the lifter will be nearly impossible to remove as the sides spread - and the cam will be toast.

Let's hope that is not the case....

[Stangman]

I don’t think the low rpm on the hwy did it in. Even at 2200 rpm oil is really blowing around inside the motor. Hate to hear this with the solid rollers. I only have 3000 miles on my car in 8 years 2700 were with a flat tapped solid. How many miles are on the lifters?

[Jb427]

This is why I wish I had gone with one of jays intake adaptors and tunnelwedge type top would not be a big deal to pop the top off lift the valley cover have a check and away you go

[fairlaniac]

I don’t think the low rpm on the hwy did it in. Even at 2200 rpm oil is really blowing around inside the motor. Hate to hear this with the solid rollers. I only have 3000 miles on my car in 8 years 2700 were with a flat tapped solid. How many miles are on the lifters?

Joe, I have about 500 miles on the roller lifters, Lunati 72903. I'm a believer in operator error over mechanical failure much of the time. Not sure what I did but I put it on myself.

[Barry_R]

I have had solid rollers last for many years on the street.

My opinion FWIW is that the "killer" of roller lifters in inadequate valvetrain control and excessive lash.

[fairlaniac]

I have had solid rollers last for many years on the street.

My opinion FWIW is that the "killer" of roller lifters in inadequate valvetrain control and excessive lash.

Barry, on a .026 hot lash, is there a cold equivalent? I ran mine a .022 cold.