Author Topic: pitting in cylinder bore on 390 stroker  (Read 1570 times)

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brra1961

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pitting in cylinder bore on 390 stroker
« on: June 10, 2023, 11:08:21 AM »
would anybody run a 4.08 bore  with rust pitting on the bottom 3" inside the cylinder that extends half way around the cylinder mostly on non thrust side. with 4.250  crank the rings will be riding over the pits

frnkeore

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Re: pitting in cylinder bore on 390 stroker
« Reply #1 on: June 10, 2023, 12:03:01 PM »
I would have to see a close up picture, after it was honed.
Frank

'60 Ford Starliner
Austin Healey Replica with 427 & 8.5 Cert

Joe-JDC

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Re: pitting in cylinder bore on 390 stroker
« Reply #2 on: June 10, 2023, 12:09:03 PM »
Was the pitting from water sitting in the cylinder?  If not, then the pitting might have migrated from outside the cylinder, and that will need a sleeve.  A sonic test would be wise to see if the cylinder will clean up at   +.040" or +.050, or even +.060.  One cylinder sleeve would not be a problem if it is done correctly.  Joe-JDC
Joe-JDC '70GT-500

brra1961

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Re: pitting in cylinder bore on 390 stroker
« Reply #3 on: June 10, 2023, 12:22:38 PM »
thanks joe,  not my block but the owner says it was pitting from rust, the picture he sent me looked like it will not machine out if bored another .020   its at .030 now freshly machined and he says the machinist told him its not a problem. I would attach photo if I could figure out how but i'm a computer moron

brra1961

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Re: pitting in cylinder bore on 390 stroker
« Reply #4 on: June 10, 2023, 12:24:59 PM »
its a D4TE block that the owner feels is thick walled so no sonic has been done yet

winr1

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Re: pitting in cylinder bore on 390 stroker
« Reply #5 on: June 10, 2023, 03:45:04 PM »
I have run a lot worse ..... how deep are the pits and can you post the pic ??

I have a 352 that all the top rings were broken, 5 of the second rings were broken, over 300.000 miles on the mill

I needed to move the truck around so rebuilt it with cast rings and new inserts until I had time to build a new mill

8 cylinders had the top ridge so deep, a ridge reamer hit ridge edge, has to use a rat tail file to cut the ridge to use the reamer

5 of the cylinders had a ridge as well, cut them out with the ridge reamer, block is probably .040 over and oval.. lol

Honed with ball hone and water, put back together and it ran so well I am still driving it 25 years later and over 40,000 miles

The main and rod journals are stock, the inserts were down to copper and steel, the journals looked like they were polished with a rough file

30 pounds oil at idle hot, 60 pounds running ( I put a thick washer in the original oil pump to bump up the pressure )


Ricky.

machyoung

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Re: pitting in cylinder bore on 390 stroker
« Reply #6 on: June 11, 2023, 09:03:50 AM »
I'm mostly a moron at posting pics as well.

Joe-JDC

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Re: pitting in cylinder bore on 390 stroker
« Reply #7 on: June 11, 2023, 11:57:01 AM »
If you still have doubts, sleeve that bore and remove any worry.   Joe-JDC
Joe-JDC '70GT-500

frnkeore

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Re: pitting in cylinder bore on 390 stroker
« Reply #8 on: June 11, 2023, 12:58:46 PM »
That's way more pitting than I'd like to see and would sleeve it as Joe says.
Frank

'60 Ford Starliner
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bsprowl

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Re: pitting in cylinder bore on 390 stroker
« Reply #9 on: June 11, 2023, 09:01:28 PM »
Looks to me like it is rusted below where the rings travel.  If so, its not a problem.

Joe-JDC

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Re: pitting in cylinder bore on 390 stroker
« Reply #10 on: June 11, 2023, 09:17:49 PM »
A 4.250" stroke will move the rings down further and may be an issue.  Joe-JDC
Joe-JDC '70GT-500

pbf777

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Re: pitting in cylinder bore on 390 stroker
« Reply #11 on: June 12, 2023, 10:42:13 AM »
...................... its at .030 now freshly machined and he says the machinist told him its not a problem.

     Lets' preface this response with the reminder that the world is a less than perfect place; Ford Motor Company never had nor presented the idea that one should be "rebuilding" this engine (rather their plan was/is that you should be buying a new vehicle!  ::)); and so here we are, with a block that shall we say in away is showing it's age.   :)

     The presents of the pitting is less than ideal but in all reality, particularly being located so low in the cylinder, I wouldn't think that it actually is going to cause any great problem.  And I have definitely seen worse, both in sum of and position of, in service functioning without creating any alarm.   ;)

     The other consideration is that it appears that the block has already received the other machining operations of the adjacent cylinders, deck and the perhaps even main bearing bores; all of which, dimensionally, may be effected with the sleeving operation, so then what?  And also realize that this process does not present a cylinder block of the same integrity as without, so although sleeving a cylinder bore is a common practice, generally with "acceptable"* results, the thought that one can 'just' sleeve any block and 'always' reap an acceptable outcome is not always so!   :o

     So, this as actually better defined as a "salvage" operation in the re-machining of critical surfaces in an old cast iron block, expecting "perfection" might just be found to be expecting more than what one often actually reaps.    :)

     Scott.

Barry_R

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Re: pitting in cylinder bore on 390 stroker
« Reply #12 on: June 12, 2023, 10:43:15 AM »
Where is that relative to the bottom of the water jacket?
If it were backed up to solid iron I'd probably grit my teeth and run it.
But if there is water on the other side - those pits look awfully deep....

brra1961

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Re: pitting in cylinder bore on 390 stroker
« Reply #13 on: June 12, 2023, 09:25:51 PM »
Thanks Barry , yes theres water on the other side , the pitting extends 3" up the cyl. from the bottom, the water sat in the bores for some time the pistons had to be pounded out with a hammer the block has been decked and line honed all other cylinders are free of pitting I have not inspected this block in person yet, it is a 3 hour drive from me but i'm thinking of driving down with my trusty ebay sonic tester , good 390 blocks are becoming hard to find in so. cal.

jayb

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Re: pitting in cylinder bore on 390 stroker
« Reply #14 on: June 12, 2023, 09:56:51 PM »
My advice would be to sleeve it.  Should be no issue with one sleeve in the block - Jay
Jay Brown
- 1969 Mach 1, Drag Week 2005 Winner NA/BB, 511" FE (10.60s @ 129); Drag Week 2007 Runner-Up PA/BB, 490" Supercharged FE (9.35 @ 151)
- 1964 Ford Galaxie, Drag Week 2009 Winner Modified NA (9.50s @ 143), 585" SOHC
- 1969 Shelby Clone, Drag Week 2015 Winner Modified NA (Average 8.98 @ 149), 585" SOHC