FE and FT Factory Displacements

[jayb]

I am reviewing a book in the process of being written by a well known automotive writer.  He has asked me to review parts of the book for accuracy.  One of the questions that has come up is regarding all the displacements available from the FE and FT engine during its production run.  The author says the FE has been available in the following displacements: 

332, 352, 360, 361, 390, 406, 410, 427, and 428

I was going to correct him on the 361, which I thought was only a truck engine, but then online I found a reference to the 361 being put into an early Edsel.  Anybody know if this is correct?

For the FT engine he is saying that over the years, displacements have been available as follows:

330, 359, 360, 389, and 391

I have never heard of a 359 or 360 FT, I thought that the 361 was the only one available.  I also thought that the 330" version was actually referred to as the 331.  And I have never heard of a 389 FT.  Can anyone with solid knowledge of this clarify the displacement list?

By the way, I am classifying the FT engines as the ones with the larger crank snout and the larger distributor hole in the block.  The FE engines would not have these features.  Thanks in advance for any help on this - Jay

[machoneman]

http://www.edsel.com/pages/edsel58.htm#Engines

361 here. The writer should/could contact the webmaster at this site for more details if need be.

[CaptCobrajet]

The 361 Edsel is not an FE or FT.  The 330,359,361,389, and 391 are FT.  The 332, 352,360,390,406,410,427,428 are FE.  A 330 FT truck engine is a totally different animal from the 332 FE.  Some get confused on that.  I think 359/361 and 389/391 were the same dems, but compression ratios and MD or HD designations for medium or heavy duty apps were the reasons they are shown as being different engines.  When I worked in an auto parts store in the '80s all of those FTs were still very common.  The mom and pop store I worked at serviced two railroad lines and they still had many FT powered heavy and medium duty trucks.  The paper catalogs of the day made clear the differences......ah the good ole days of paper catalogs and parts men that new something!

[Royce]

As far as I know the 361 Edsel is an FE 4.05 x 3.5 used in the small Edsel (Ranger Pacer). Keep in mind the big Edsels (Corsair Citation) used MEL engines  410 cu in

[thatdarncat]

FT engines can be a bit confusing. I think a better way of categorizing them is by which type of vehicle they were intended for, which is how Ford did it. FE engines were used in the F100 to F350 series light duty trucks, FT engines were used in all the series above that, which includes medium and heavy duty trucks, some examples being the F600, B500, N500, and many more. I point that out because the 330 was made in both a 330 M/D ( medium duty ) and 330 H/D ( heavy duty ), the 330 M/D shares FE crank snout dimension and some of the front dress items, and I think maybe distributor size. Many of the other FT engines could be configured different ways depending on the type of vehicle they were going in or fleet order customer ( like U-Haul, UPS, etc. ). Here are a couple FT engine illustrations from the Ford Truck Parts book, along with displacements, just for info purposes. You'll notice Ford showed both a "High Mount Fan" and "Standard Mount Fan" types.   

[jayb]

http://www.edsel.com/pages/edsel58.htm#Engines

361 here. The writer should/could contact the webmaster at this site for more details if need be.

Interesting, on the web site you linked they call this engine the E-400 but it is 361 cubic inches.  It is also angle cut on the deck at 100 degrees, probably like a MEL.  I don't see any reference to another 361 cubic inch engine, so I must assume that Blair is correct and that the 361 Edsel engine is not an FE.

[thatdarncat]

http://www.edsel.com/pages/edsel58.htm#Engines

361 here. The writer should/could contact the webmaster at this site for more details if need be.

Interesting, on the web site you linked they call this engine the E-400 but it is 361 cubic inches.  It is also angle cut on the deck at 100 degrees, probably like a MEL.  I don't see any reference to another 361 cubic inch engine, so I must assume that Blair is correct and that the 361 Edsel engine is not an FE.

Actually I think Royce is correct, I think the Edsel site has their info transposed - if you read the description under the E475 410 MEL engine they list that as 90 degree block and chamber in the head, which we know is wrong. Also, Edsel names the engines with the Torque number, hence the reason they call the 361 the E400.

[jayb]

I see - thanks!

[BigBlueIron]

Also a 360MD, standard 360FE crank dimensions.

[Royce]

Jay I am shocked and appalled!! You doubt my knowledge on Edsels !  My EMC engine is an Edsel!!

361 was first 4.05 bore FE.  As Kevin states number on the valve covers is torque not cu in ..

[wsu0702]

Page 7 in this article (PDF) talks about the 361 FE and the fact that it wasn't only used in the small Edsels.  Also somewhere else in this article it also indicates that the 361FE was the very first FE engine offered to the public when the Edsel's were launched in Sept of 1957.  The 332 & 352 Fords came out a month later.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ork816aldcwtawx/FE%20comprehensive%20history.pdf?dl=0

image free hosting

[wsu0702]

I found some more 361 FE info in my files.  This is actually where I read that it was the first FE engine to hit the market (not the PDF article). 

image url upload

[wsu0702]

I am reviewing a book in the process of being written by a well known automotive writer.  He has asked me to review parts of the book for accuracy.  One of the questions that has come up is regarding all the displacements available from the FE and FT engine during its production run.  The author says the FE has been available in the following displacements: 

332, 352, 360, 361, 390, 406, 410, 427, and 428

I was going to correct him on the 361, which I thought was only a truck engine, but then online I found a reference to the 361 being put into an early Edsel.  Anybody know if this is correct?

For the FT engine he is saying that over the years, displacements have been available as follows:

330, 359, 360, 389, and 391

I have never heard of a 359 or 360 FT, I thought that the 361 was the only one available.  I also thought that the 330" version was actually referred to as the 331.  And I have never heard of a 389 FT.  Can anyone with solid knowledge of this clarify the displacement list?

By the way, I am classifying the FT engines as the ones with the larger crank snout and the larger distributor hole in the block.  The FE engines would not have these features.  Thanks in advance for any help on this - Jay

There was no 360 FT that must be a mistake/typo. 

The 359 and 389 were indeed FT engines in the late '70's and IIRC each one was used for only one model year.  They are special configurations that Ford created in order to win big fleet contracts (U-Haul, etc.).  The 359 is the same bore/stroke as the 360 & 361 and the 389 is the same bore/stroke as the 390 & 391.  Ford just gave them a one CI lower size designation to differentiate them from the other engines.

In addition to the 330MD and 330HD mentioned above the 330 FT was also available in the "330XD" configuration for the 1979 U-Haul trucks.  It is widely published that the '78 model year was the last year for FT production but the U-Haul 330 XD's were produced well into 1979.

FT blocks are also different from FE blocks in that they all have an NPT hole in the passenger side skirt just above the pan rail near the #2 main.  It was used as an oil return port from the air compressor on the bigger trucks equipped with air brakes.  Pic attached. 

I'll see if I can dig up some more documentation to add to what Kevin already provided on these oddball FT engines.

[CaptCobrajet]

I had the 361 MEL on my mind.....I was looking at a crankshaft sitting in my back room for a 361 that was definitely not an FE, lol.   I'd guarantee Royce's knowledge of the 58-60 Ford shenanigans is more accurate than mine when it comes to MELs and anything else they borrowed from the FE line.  I stand (sit actually) corrected!

With that said, the 361 in that era was not the same as the 361 FT.  So, I guess Ford made three different "361" engines....

[120mm]

There was no 360 FT that must be a mistake/typo. 

"The 360 cubic inch FE was only used in pickups and other light-duty trucks. There was also an FT version for medium-heavy duty use."

http://www.curbsideclassic.com/automotive-histories/automotive-history-the-ford-fe-series-v8/

Here is a picture of a non-existent 360 FT in my Dad's old N500. It has the 360 sticker on the air cleaner. Perhaps it's a different series engine altogether?