Author Topic: Calling All Close Ratio Toploader Galaxie Owners  (Read 2493 times)

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frnkeore

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Re: Calling All Close Ratio Toploader Galaxie Owners
« Reply #15 on: October 22, 2020, 01:48:57 PM »
Personally, I would go with their diaphragm clutch and try to get a solid hub, clutch disk. I cannot tell you how many spring hubs I have either broken (springs not hub) or collapsed the springs on. Once the spring loosen, they chatter.
« Last Edit: October 22, 2020, 06:41:57 PM by frnkeore »
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Tom Gahman

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Re: Calling All Close Ratio Toploader Galaxie Owners
« Reply #16 on: October 22, 2020, 05:56:25 PM »
I would check with Brent Lykins on a clutch.
The Ram long style I purchased from him works fine.
I've used a close ratio for decades in my 390 Galaxie but I will be doing the wr conversion.

Diogenes

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Re: Calling All Close Ratio Toploader Galaxie Owners
« Reply #17 on: October 23, 2020, 01:12:59 AM »
I would check with Brent Lykins on a clutch.
The Ram long style I purchased from him works fine.
I've used a close ratio for decades in my 390 Galaxie but I will be doing the wr conversion.

What are your experiences? Year, gear ratio, etc. Why does the WR conversion call to you?
1966 Galaxie 500 390 C6 Traction-Lock 9in.
1985 Toyota Celica Supra
71 Montego MX wagon 351C Toploader Detroit Locker Cyclone competition gauge/dash bucket seats/console
89 Texas DPS Police Mustang
71 Torino GT 351C 4V AT
68 Cougar 351W Toploader Traction-Lock 8in.
89 Dodge Omni modified 2.5 turbo from hell

Diogenes

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Re: Calling All Close Ratio Toploader Galaxie Owners
« Reply #18 on: October 23, 2020, 01:34:16 AM »
As far as clutches go I am leaning toward the Ram 98988 clutch and pressure plate kit for my big in/out toploader application.
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/ram-98988?rrec=true

I guess as a cruiser, which my car is, I find $625 for a clutch kit waaaaaaay over the top. I presume you do some racing?

First generation Cougars--love those cars....
1966 Galaxie 500 390 C6 Traction-Lock 9in.
1985 Toyota Celica Supra
71 Montego MX wagon 351C Toploader Detroit Locker Cyclone competition gauge/dash bucket seats/console
89 Texas DPS Police Mustang
71 Torino GT 351C 4V AT
68 Cougar 351W Toploader Traction-Lock 8in.
89 Dodge Omni modified 2.5 turbo from hell

blykins

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Re: Calling All Close Ratio Toploader Galaxie Owners
« Reply #19 on: October 23, 2020, 05:21:20 AM »
I generally recommend wide ratio transmissions. 

As for the clutch kit, a 98988 is a Powergrip HD, with a sintered iron (both sides) disc.  If you don't need a clutch kit for 650 hp, then I wouldn't buy one.  There are many other choices. 

Solid hub discs are generally not optimal for a street car as they transmit a lot more NVH.  The only solid disc clutches I recommend are the twin disc clutches and they are only solid because there's no room for extra goodies.  They are also noisier, but they are also organic, which helps with some of the driveability.   A great deal of your solid hub discs are paired with some rather hairy friction materials and they will give you an on/off engagement, which is not good. 

I also try to pair factory style applications with Long style pressure plates.   Most people think that Long style plates are always harder on the clutch leg, but that's not the case now.  In the 60's/70's, the clutch plan was to put a disc with a pressure plate that had a ton of clamping force.   Now days, we balance the pressure plate clamping force with different materials.   In a lot of scenarios, the Long style pressure plates actually have less clamping force than some of the diaphragm plates out there.   The RAM HDX/Powergrip/Powergrip HD are 2200 lbs I believe. 

Obviously, the clutch kit will also depend on your flywheel.  Your aftermarket flywheels from Ford Racing, McLeod, and RAM will all have 11" and 12" patterns on them.   Factory flywheels will depend on which engine the flywheel came off of.   


Brent Lykins
Lykins Motorsports
Custom FE Street, Drag Race, Road Race, and Pulling Truck Engines
Custom Roller & Flat Tappet Camshafts
www.lykinsmotorsports.com
brent@lykinsmotorsports.com
www.customfordcams.com
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19cougar68

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Re: Calling All Close Ratio Toploader Galaxie Owners
« Reply #20 on: October 23, 2020, 07:20:41 AM »
Ram has the Powergrip and the Powergrip HD series.  The HD series is for the higher 650 HP rating and I think would be a little "harsher" for street usage.  Here is the link for the HD series Powergrip.  It seems strange to me that it is cheaper than the lower HP rated plain Powergrip series.
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/ram-98988hd

The on I selected is the Powergrip series rated at 550 HP which I think would have more street-able manners. Unfortunately I am not done with my project so I have no first hand knowledge of the clutch operational characteristics, just selected this one after watching the Ram clutch video.  Here is the link again to the one I selected:
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/ram-98988?rrec=true

Here is the link to the Ram video about clutch selection
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/ram-98988?rrec=true

Tom Gahman

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Re: Calling All Close Ratio Toploader Galaxie Owners
« Reply #21 on: October 23, 2020, 07:28:35 AM »
My 64 galaxie weighs 3970 with me in it.I call it an entry level street/strip wannabe drag racer.
With the cr the 390 liked 4:71 rear gear best for the quarter mile.(13.0 something @107)
With a wr I can change the rear gear to say 4.3, have a better starting line ratio and it will mph better at the top end.
Hope this helps

blykins

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Re: Calling All Close Ratio Toploader Galaxie Owners
« Reply #22 on: October 23, 2020, 07:40:08 AM »
Ram has the Powergrip and the Powergrip HD series.  The HD series is for the higher 650 HP rating and I think would be a little "harsher" for street usage.  Here is the link for the HD series Powergrip.  It seems strange to me that it is cheaper than the lower HP rated plain Powergrip series.
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/ram-98988hd

The on I selected is the Powergrip series rated at 550 HP which I think would have more street-able manners. Unfortunately I am not done with my project so I have no first hand knowledge of the clutch operational characteristics, just selected this one after watching the Ram clutch video.  Here is the link again to the one I selected:
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/ram-98988?rrec=true

Here is the link to the Ram video about clutch selection
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/ram-98988?rrec=true

I have never heard anyone complain about any of the RAM products chattering and I have first hand experience with the HD series clutches on the street.  However, the disclaimer I give my customers is that they *could* chatter, but that's the risk you take with a single disc clutch that will support that kind of horsepower. 

Maybe we can get towd56 to chime in on how much stronger his wagon feels with the wide ratio swap. 

In addition, his 4600 lb wagon launching at 5500 on slicks went through a Powergrip and a Powergrip HD as well.  Slicks and heavy weight is hard on any clutch.  Seems to be doing ok with a McLeod RXT twin disc though. 
Brent Lykins
Lykins Motorsports
Custom FE Street, Drag Race, Road Race, and Pulling Truck Engines
Custom Roller & Flat Tappet Camshafts
www.lykinsmotorsports.com
brent@lykinsmotorsports.com
www.customfordcams.com
502-759-1431
Instagram:  brentlykinsmotorsports

Gregwill16

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Re: Calling All Close Ratio Toploader Galaxie Owners
« Reply #23 on: October 23, 2020, 08:17:22 AM »
Martin for your engine that will be a good clutch setup. It comes down to what you do most with your car highway vs city. I would go with a 3.70 gear with your current tire or a 3.89 gear stepping up to a 275/60 rear tire.

Diogenes

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Re: Calling All Close Ratio Toploader Galaxie Owners
« Reply #24 on: October 23, 2020, 02:53:07 PM »
Certainly a lot to consider here, and a lot of good information. While a WR conversion would be nice, it is not in the budget, and budget considerations will have an impact on clutch selection. Of course value plays in the selection as well, since I want a clutch that will live for a while.

I've never had problems with any clutches I've had in the past, meaning I've never had to replace them due to being worn out. My Cougar was a 400-450 HP small block, but a fairly light car, my wagon was a mild Cleveland 2V, but a bit heavier at 3800lbs or so. The Galaxies is probably 400-450HP ballpark, but I'm guessing weighs 4000lbs or more. I was figuring a 3.89 with my tire would be the way to go, but I need to revisit MPH and RPM calculations.

The flywheel that came with my purchase appears to be an aftermarket steel piece, as I can find no part number and it is fully machined--no casting marks. I has paint pen marking with "184 Ford 360-390 T10", but that is all I see on it. It has a wear pattern for 11", and looks to only have a bolt pattern for an 11" clutch.

Perhaps its time to clean out the parts stash and free up some capital.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2020, 03:17:24 PM by Diogenes »
1966 Galaxie 500 390 C6 Traction-Lock 9in.
1985 Toyota Celica Supra
71 Montego MX wagon 351C Toploader Detroit Locker Cyclone competition gauge/dash bucket seats/console
89 Texas DPS Police Mustang
71 Torino GT 351C 4V AT
68 Cougar 351W Toploader Traction-Lock 8in.
89 Dodge Omni modified 2.5 turbo from hell

Hipopinto

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Re: Calling All Close Ratio Toploader Galaxie Owners
« Reply #25 on: October 23, 2020, 06:37:52 PM »
I have a 1966 with a wide ratio

It has 3.89 gears and I love the take off

I also have a gear vendors overdrive so it is kinda “cheating” but in 4th no OD it’s tolerable on the street

I would suggest with a CR to run no less than a 3.89 if not a 4.10

Good luck

Dave

blykins

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Re: Calling All Close Ratio Toploader Galaxie Owners
« Reply #26 on: October 23, 2020, 06:40:29 PM »
...My 9in. has a 3.25 gear (I believe, will confirm soon). ....

This is an important detail.  Know for fact what you have.  Your tire size is also wrong.  Unless someone put the wrong size tire on the car, it is taller than 26".  Tire size too makes a difference.


I've yet to pull the pig on the 9 to seal a leak, so ring gear will be identified before purchasing parts. the tire size is a 245/60 15, which online info states is 26.6"--rough measurement with a tape measure was 26". Purchasing a WR gear set from Kee is not in the budget at the moment.

This is the clutch kit I'm looking at, mainly because it won't bust out the budget. https://www.summitracing.com/parts/mcl-75148

You can also do a RAM 88988.  Save you a few bucks.
Brent Lykins
Lykins Motorsports
Custom FE Street, Drag Race, Road Race, and Pulling Truck Engines
Custom Roller & Flat Tappet Camshafts
www.lykinsmotorsports.com
brent@lykinsmotorsports.com
www.customfordcams.com
502-759-1431
Instagram:  brentlykinsmotorsports

Towd56

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Re: Calling All Close Ratio Toploader Galaxie Owners
« Reply #27 on: October 24, 2020, 06:43:02 AM »
My wagon destroyed both the regular power grip and the HD in short order. At the advice of Brent - I swapped it over to a twin disk McLeod. Which also required me to change the input shaft to a 26 spline so I wouldn’t have to run a hydraulic TOB. During the swap I converted trans to wide ratio. What a difference!!

All I can say is that with the wide ratio trans the car seems like I’ve added a 100 hp, is easier to drive, and so much more fun. At the strip with slicks it did much better. It weighs 4640 and has gone all this year with no signs of trouble.

The only down side I see to the twin disk is that it is a little more grabby in traffic. I found that this can be easily addressed if you just use a little higher rpm before you start releasing the clutch pedal.

Was overall very pleased with both the clutch and conversion to wide ratio.

frnkeore

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Re: Calling All Close Ratio Toploader Galaxie Owners
« Reply #28 on: October 24, 2020, 10:31:16 AM »
Is the  McLeod a diaphragm or Long and does it have a spring hub? Also, does it have a aluminum or steel cover?
Frank

blykins

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Re: Calling All Close Ratio Toploader Galaxie Owners
« Reply #29 on: October 24, 2020, 10:53:03 AM »
The McLeod and RAM both that were recommended are Long style, sprung hub, and have steel pressure plates. 
Brent Lykins
Lykins Motorsports
Custom FE Street, Drag Race, Road Race, and Pulling Truck Engines
Custom Roller & Flat Tappet Camshafts
www.lykinsmotorsports.com
brent@lykinsmotorsports.com
www.customfordcams.com
502-759-1431
Instagram:  brentlykinsmotorsports