Author Topic: I broke my toy in Detroit!!! Updated Jan 2020  (Read 14184 times)

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BattlestarGalactic

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Re: I broke my toy in Detroit!!!
« Reply #15 on: June 24, 2019, 10:45:42 AM »
^^Friend lost a 427 like that many moons ago.  Piston stayed at TDC, the rest hung on and didn't hurt a thing.
Larry

turbohunter

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Re: I broke my toy in Detroit!!!
« Reply #16 on: June 24, 2019, 10:57:48 AM »
Why is the ac belt loose?
Marc
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'66 Mustang Injected 428
'66 Q code Country Squire wagon


1968galaxie

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Re: I broke my toy in Detroit!!!
« Reply #17 on: June 24, 2019, 11:43:23 AM »
I looked at the 2 cylinder head pics.
It looks like all of the rocker arms are at the same position - like no valves are open.
I would expect to see open and closed valves.
Looks weird to me.

Good luck diagnosing issue.


GerryP

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Re: I broke my toy in Detroit!!!
« Reply #18 on: June 24, 2019, 11:58:45 AM »
Y'all really need to look at his video.  Valves move.  Engine cranks REAL hard like a dead battery.  But keep in mind that he wasn't able to rotate the engine from the dampener bolt, so it really is turning hard.

Bolted to Floor

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Re: I broke my toy in Detroit!!!
« Reply #19 on: June 24, 2019, 12:03:36 PM »
Thanks for the feedback guys. I wiped the dipstick on a clean paper towel three times and found a few small shavings.



Secured a Uhaul trailer and working on a truck, some are due back today.

I loosened the belts to make sure accessories weren't the problem.
John D -- 67 Mustang 390 5 speed

BruceS

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Re: I broke my toy in Detroit!!!
« Reply #20 on: June 24, 2019, 12:26:59 PM »
John, sorry to hear of your toy breaking. I'm sure you'll get it figured out, and it's a long tow home!
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63 Galaxie 500 fastback, 482 SO 4V, Cruise-O-Matic

Stangman

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Re: I broke my toy in Detroit!!!
« Reply #21 on: June 24, 2019, 03:45:28 PM »
Hey John sorry to hear about your problem. So no other vibrations except for 4-7 seconds worth. Have you had good oil pressure all along, what’s it been hot.

67428GT500

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Re: I broke my toy in Detroit!!!
« Reply #22 on: June 24, 2019, 05:33:26 PM »
I really feel for him and the loss of a new engine. I just had to pull mine three times. Thanks to a Chebby machinist.  So, I essentially started over again. I am disgusted and the fact He wouldn't pay for his mistake will likely land him in court. Charles Eller showed me why and what happened. If you can't understand
how to read a sonic report then perhaps you shouldn't be in the engine building business.  His mistake cost me almost 4K.

                                                                                    -Keith

winr1

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Re: I broke my toy in Detroit!!!
« Reply #23 on: June 24, 2019, 09:24:17 PM »
Around 1970, my Brothers 390 in his 67 Mustang suddenly locked up idling

He pulled the pan and replaced the inserts, locked up again idling

Pulled the mill and tore it down, after head scratching, I pulled the main inserts and torqued the main caps down

The front main had a crack that opened up when the cap was torqued down
..............................................................................

Possibly a stacked rod or main insert ??

Have seen a few buy cant remember if the mill was locked up completely ...


Best wishes on something not costly




Ricky.

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Re: I broke my toy in Detroit!!! Found the problem.
« Reply #24 on: June 30, 2019, 01:17:40 PM »
Well….. We finally made home on Friday, after stopping to see some sites along the way.



We passed on any food they sold….to many references to “Thanks for picking Uranus” and other off color comments!!

I got the pan off. I was really expecting to see a busted rod. Instead, the crank is broke!!! It has a new parting line on the throw between the 1st and 2nd mains closer to main #2, pistons 1 & 5. Both of those pistons have touched the crank in some manner and it looks like one of the rods may have touched the block. I couldn’t tell much looking at the throw for pistons 2 & 6.













 
I pulled that crank out of a 410 Mercury motor from a big 4 door land barge in Pick-A-Part around 1990, then moved it from house to house over the years with all of the other parts. In 2016, it got checked for cracks before it was turned under .010 for install. Now if I could understand why it broke like it did.

Is this a common location for a break?

What is the consensus for harvesting parts from the short block?

Now, I’m content to let it sit for a bit while I catch up on things around the house
John D -- 67 Mustang 390 5 speed

TomP

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Re: I broke my toy in Detroit!!!
« Reply #25 on: June 30, 2019, 02:16:14 PM »
Wow, that sucks. Never seen one broken there. Hope the block and rods are OK.

It looks like Uranus is a popular place. It looks like they pack fudge too.  ;D

Joe-JDC

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Re: I broke my toy in Detroit!!!
« Reply #26 on: June 30, 2019, 02:24:37 PM »
Well, that is an eye opener, and sorry for your troubles.  Personally, I would start fresh with a different block, double/triple check those rods, and find a new crankshaft and new pistons and rings, etc.  You will always have doubts if you do try to re-use that block.  Joe-JDC
Joe-JDC '70GT-500

67xr7cat

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Re: I broke my toy in Detroit!!!
« Reply #27 on: June 30, 2019, 05:08:03 PM »
hard to say for sure with it all together, but bet that crack started at the rod pin. Is common when the crank is ground that not enough radius is ground where the journal meets the side. Is why on performance bearings they have extra relief as cranks ground for performance use usually have a bigger radius for strength. Is also possible the #2 main cap is loose too, but I doubt it.

I'd have the block webbing checked real good for cracks and the rods checked for a bent condition. Good luck with it. Steve

67428GT500

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Re: I broke my toy in Detroit!!!
« Reply #28 on: June 30, 2019, 05:19:02 PM »
I am really sorry to see this. I had a cylinder split and had to pull it out twice with a fresh 16K paint job. I got about 390 miles on it.
It's aggravating and expensive just for a full tear down, inspection and to replace bearings and gaskets and rings.

I have a question, only because I ran into this with the reciprocating assembly.  I noted you have Eagle/Scat rods but you ran cat pistons?
Did you have the assembly balanced? if so, how well is the shop known in the FE community?
Most of my issues have boiled down to a presumptive machinist who is a brand X guy and arrogant at that. He actually offset bored the block backward by assuming brand X and ford had the same bank numbering.  I can't expound on how important it is to know your machinist, his knowledge and his limits.

I hope most of the assembly is salvageable and you can get back on the road and enjoy your vehicle soon.  P.S. Here I thought it was safe to bend over and pick up my wallet in Missouri. I guess it's like San Francisco. If you drop anything, kick it to a safe corner and back into said corner before picking it up! ;D ;D
                                                                            -Keith

67xr7cat

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Re: I broke my toy in Detroit!!!
« Reply #29 on: June 30, 2019, 07:04:26 PM »
I will say Keith you have one thing right and that is to know what a shops abilities are. As for the rest I never bought into he is a chevy guy and can only work on chevy's. Every engine has its own oddities to know about, but some things don't change much. If  you cannot look at a sonic map and off set bore something correctly that is the fault of the guy doing it. You look at the map not offset #2 to the left. Is like the doctor cutting off the wrong leg.

I can say this I grow up around Fords, worked in a machine shop that bleed ford blue, built street to race and everything in between. They even put a set of Cleveland Hi port heads on a SBC block and raced it in a dirt modified. Don't ask why...

Built a lot of Chevy's, Some BOP, Mopars, Flat head fords, and farm tractor engines from 1920. A good shop can do it all and has the sense to ask and find out when needed. Boring cylinders and balancing crankshafts does not require an FE guru. Just a guy that knows his stuff, has the right equipment, and is interested in doing quality work.

Not the OP, but to answer about the balance question that Eagle rod is a good 40 or so grams heavier on the big end so that is adding 80+ grams to the bob weight. Short answer is that is way too much to not get the crank balanced.