Anybody have experience using-----

[james]

Anyone have any experience using the gear vender overdrive products either good or bad? And yes, they are expensive. Also, what about alternative products you might recommend? Thak You! https://www.gearvendors.com/hrford3s.html

[Drew Pojedinec]

I have one in my 63.5 galaxie behind a 447ci fe, roller c6, etc. very nice to have. Makes my 4.30 gears usable.

[Falcon67]

They are used by Drag Week racers a lot - love to have one on the tail of the C4 in the Falcon.  4.56 spool with 28" tires not much of a highway cruiser LOL.

Hell of a warranty: "The Gear Vendors comes with a 2 year unlimited mileage, unlimited horsepower, unlimited abuse warranty plus a 30 day money back guarantee so you know you will be happy about everything from how it installs, performs, and drives."

[falcongeorge]

They are used by Drag Week racers a lot - love to have one on the tail of the C4 in the Falcon.  4.56 spool with 28" tires not much of a highway cruiser LOL.

Hell of a warranty: "The Gear Vendors comes with a 2 year unlimited mileage, unlimited horsepower, unlimited abuse warranty plus a 30 day money back guarantee so you know you will be happy about everything from how it installs, performs, and drives."

How about an aod? One of my project cars is a '67 falcon with a Cleveland, that's what I am doing.
FWIW, I also have a brand x driver with a 700r4 and 4.56s, I HATE the 1/2 spread, but the 4.56s and od are PERFECT on the hwy, I run just a hair over 2800 @ 72 mph.

[FrozenMerc]

I have never used a GearVendors, the cost seemed prohibitive.  A new one will run you $3K to 3.5K depending on application, and you will likely be into it for over $4K after installation (new driveshaft, floor mods, etc.)

I put a Broader built AOD behind the 352 in my '62 Merc Monterey.  Adapted the Cruis-O bellhousing to the AOD case.  All in cost of about $2.5K, and it works wonderfully. 

https://www.broaderperformance.com/

If you have a 3 or 4 speed manual, take a look at an Advance Adaptors Road Ranger Gear Splitter.  I have one installed between the 6.9 IDI and T-19 4 Speed in my '85 F-350.  This is also a wonderful product (a bit noisy in high range), that works really well even with the 4.56:1 rear axle ratio.  They work with just about any Ford 3 or 4 speed manual.  All in Cost of about $2.8K, and I paid someone to do all the work, which included floor mods, new carpet, new clutch, and a shortened driveshaft.  Much cheaper if you do it yourself,

https://www.advanceadapters.com/categories/complete-units/91/

[FrozenMerc]

I have never used a GearVendors, the cost always seemed prohibitive.  A new one will run you $3K to 3.5K depending on application, and you will likely be into it for over $4K after installation (new driveshaft, floor mods, etc.)

I put a Broader built AOD behind the 352 in my '62 Merc Monterey.  Adapted the Cruis-O bellhousing to the AOD case.  All in cost of about $2.5K, and it works wonderfully. 3.6:1 Rear gear and it cruises very happily at 2200 RPMs and 70 mph.

https://www.broaderperformance.com/

If you have a 3 or 4 speed manual, take a look at an Advance Adaptors Road Ranger Gear Splitter.  I have one installed between the 6.9 IDI and T-19 4 Speed in my '85 F-350.  This is also a wonderful product (a bit noisy in high range), that works really well even with the 4.56:1 rear axle ratio.  They work with just about any Ford 3 or 4 speed manual.  All in Cost of about $2.8K, and I paid someone to do all the work, which included floor mods, new carpet, new clutch, and a shortened driveshaft.  Much cheaper if you do it yourself,

https://www.advanceadapters.com/categories/complete-units/91/

[cjshaker]

Like Chris mentioned, tons of abuse with near zero problems during Drag Week by LOTS of guys, and lots of years. We're talking 1000-2000+ horsepower cars! Several guys on here like them and use them. Jay uses them on his Drag Week cars. I bought one last year but haven't installed it yet. I'll be putting it in next year to make my 4:30 geared Mach more highway friendly. Driveshaft will have to be shortened, but several guys say they haven't had to modify the tunnel, or just slightly if it is required (mostly by a little hammer work). Quality is first rate, they come with everything needed, including speedo cable extension and new trans mount. At least mine did.

[TJ]

Can anyone explain to me how the shifting (especially down shifting) works.  I'd like to have one behind the 4 speed manual in my F250 but I'm wondering how I'd go from OD 4th gear to regular 4th gear.   When I come to a hill with my camper hitched, I don't want to just jam it into regular 4th and break something.  Do I clutch and then press the gear vendor shift button as if I was shifting the stick?  Maybe give it a little gas to balance rpm with ground speed?

[Heo]

It is a two speed planetary gear. shifting is
with a hydraulic activated brake band
like a kind of a two speed auto

[RustyCrankshaft]

GearVendors are very nice. Ran them on several hot rod cars and a TON of 60's, 70's, 80's and early 90's trucks. REALLY like them in a truck with a manual because you can easily split gears (you can in an auto but splitting is sorta clunky I think and mostly not needed in a car) and it makes towing a lot nicer.

They're pretty tuff units. A planetary and cone clutch are pretty strong and also simple. I've run over 950hp thru basically stock Bravo One outdrives (not recommended) in boats and they use a cone clutch and take some serious abuse. Haven't seen a lot of GV failures, and the ones I have were mostly caused by the owner. Not checking oil, not changing oil, etc.

[BruceS]

Drew, does the C6 and GV combination on your '63 Galaxie require any tunnel mods?  Thinking about that or the Broader AOD to FE conversion. 

[Drew Pojedinec]

Bruce,
right were the flange for the the output shaft/gv meets, it fits, but could use a lil clearance.  It isn't much but to keep the best driveline angles it needs to move up 1/4-1/2 an inch.
I hit it with a hammer a few times and jacked up the sheet metal a lil there.
I believe it's under the back seat, so appearance isn't a huge deal.  I'd just put down carpet, but would have liked to have really made the area much higher.

I did the math on AOD capable of surviving 600hp and slicks vs a c6 +GV.
I did NOT buy my GV at retail, I took a salvage unit and rebuilt it.
Even at retail The C6/GV won out.....
Your math might look differently, but when you figure all the work to get an AOD to survive, plus that fact that I used nothing but stock parts in my c6, plus convertor cost, etc, the c6 makes more and more sense.
There is no part for my setup that I can't just order out of a catalog.
My math also counts me building everything, so there is that.

Either way, looking back, I wouldn't do anything differently.
If you do a 63.5 Galaxie with c6/gv the driveshaft will end up in the 45.25-45.5 inch range.  I used a 4inch aluminum, no complaints.

[BruceS]

Drew thanks for the insight and opinion.  Bruce

[Tommy-T]

Just a humorous side note...

I was at a car show with my blown 427 Mustang when the guy from Gear Vendors came out to sell me one of his overdrives.

I told him that I had been a Volvo technician for a very long time and his unit looks just like a Laycock overdrive that the Sweeds had been using since the '60's.

He got a good chuckle from that. "You nailed it" he said. He said his dad started the business using the Volvo units, and when Volvo went to 5 speed transmissions in the late '80's he bought as much remaining stock as he could. As service parts dried up Gear Vendors started making and upgrading parts as necessary.

I'll say this about the Laycock overdrive in the stock configuration. In 35+ years of working on Volvo's, I have never seen one fail. The solenoids sometimes fail (a rare occurrence) but the actual unit never. When the cars get over 200K miles on them and the OD's start acting "quirky", just drain the ATF out of them and put 30 weight oil in. Then you'll be good for another 100K.

Sooo...when you bolt up your new Gear Vendors overdrive to your 900 horsepower hot rod...it could have come from behind a 100 horsepower Volvo B20.

[Heo]

As i live in Sweden i have a good supply of Volvo overdrives so
Often you get them for free if you take the whole car.
I have a few of them so i was thinking i must try to fit one
to the Galaxie and See how long it will survive
There is the D type that's the 100 hp B 18/B20 type, i think
that one i will kill instantly
They went to Jtype in the 70s and P on the turbos in the 80s.
I believe the GV is a P  with a bigger output shaft, they are rated
what??2000 hp.  I think a regular P cant be that much weaker that
it will not survive 4-500 hp and lbs/ft

It was fun to bypass the wiring so you could use the overdrive
in all gears but that reduced their life big time probably due to
to low oilpressure with to low rpm on the inputshaft so the clutch slipped.
 But hey you bought or got another Amazon for next to nothing took the tranny sold some parts
and came out with more money

[Drew Pojedinec]

Yup, the P type is the kind to use.
I run ATI SuperF in mine, works fine, I really don't pay attention to it.  Sometimes I try to remember and check the fluid.
Seems if I fill it properly it leaks out a fuzz until it finds it's happy place and just stays there.

[Heo]

Drew you dont happen to know the difference of a J from a P there is so
much different information on that subject so some of it must be wrong
From just two extra teflon seals to complete different inards

And sorry TJ it is a conical clutch not a band was to tired last night

[AlanCasida]

I have three of them in different vehicles. I bought all mine used on Ebay. They ranged from $750-$1300. All work fine. If you are not opposed to used units, they come up every so often on Ebay or if you like scrounging in salvage yards look in 80s era RVs. A lot of them were used there. As mentioned, the "P" type units are a lot better and can be easily recognized by the large GM turbo 400 type speedometer gear in the tailshaft housing.

[AlanCasida]

Can anyone explain to me how the shifting (especially down shifting) works.  I'd like to have one behind the 4 speed manual in my F250 but I'm wondering how I'd go from OD 4th gear to regular 4th gear.   When I come to a hill with my camper hitched, I don't want to just jam it into regular 4th and break something.  Do I clutch and then press the gear vendor shift button as if I was shifting the stick?  Maybe give it a little gas to balance rpm with ground speed?

I have one behind the T19 four speed in my '67 F250. They recommend you push the clutch in about halfway when shifting in/out of overdrive. You can shift without using the clutch but it bangs really hard. I have an Eaton two-speed switch mounted on my shifter handle and I just press/pull it as I push the clutch in. I takes a little practice to get a nice smooth transition but you'll get the hang of it real quick.   

[falcongeorge]

I did the math on AOD capable of surviving 600hp and slicks vs a c6 +GV.
I did NOT buy my GV at retail, I took a salvage unit and rebuilt it.
Even at retail The C6/GV won out.....
Your math might look differently, but when you figure all the work to get an AOD to survive, plus that fact that I used nothing but stock parts in my c6, plus convertor cost, etc, the c6 makes more and more sense.

My comment was specifically directed towards falcon67, his combo is no where NEAR 600hp, in fact, it’s virtually the same as mine. At that power level, an aod with the epoxy mod and a Bauman kit, in conjunction with a non-lockup converter is perfectly adequate. Running the non-lockup converter negates any need To replace the two piece input shaft at that power level, so for falcon67’s application, the cost of the aod is more or less the same as the cost of the C-6 WITHOUT the GV. So yes, my math comes out a little different than yours. And yes, I build my own trans too, and I am building a C-6 for my blown FE combo, and no, it’s not stock, it’s costing me considerably more than what the aod to go behind my 480hp Cleveland is costing me. Horses for courses.

[Drew Pojedinec]

I wasn't responding to you in particular George, just the universe as a whole
Nor disputing your findings at all, sorry if ya took it that, wasn't meant to be that way.

I was doing this I dunno, 6 years ago?  Seemed like for my specific situation at the time, my findings were accurate.  Progress rolls on, and folks should do their own research for their own setup.
For me, building an indestructible full roller c6 was a $500 deal.

[falcongeorge]

I wasn't responding to you in particular George, just the universe as a whole
Nor disputing your findings at all, sorry if ya took it that, wasn't meant to be that way.

I was doing this I dunno, 6 years ago?  Seemed like for my specific situation at the time, my findings were accurate.  Progress rolls on, and folks should do their own research for their own setup.
For me, building an indestructible full roller c6 was a $500 deal.

I’m also doing a full roller C-6 ( machining the parts to accept the Torrington bearings myself) with a Turbo-action valve body for my blown fe combo, it’s still costing more than the AOD. My comment was directed at falcon67 because my 351c/aod combo is so similar to his, even to the point of going in a ‘67 Falcon. The real question for falcon67’s situation is how much he already has in the C-4, and whether it’s worth buying a new converter and so on just to get the OD.

[66FAIRLANE]

Here is a link to my install if interested. By the way, I like it a lot.

http://fepower.net/simplemachinesforum/index.php?topic=169.0

[TJ]

Can anyone explain to me how the shifting (especially down shifting) works.  I'd like to have one behind the 4 speed manual in my F250 but I'm wondering how I'd go from OD 4th gear to regular 4th gear.   When I come to a hill with my camper hitched, I don't want to just jam it into regular 4th and break something.  Do I clutch and then press the gear vendor shift button as if I was shifting the stick?  Maybe give it a little gas to balance rpm with ground speed?

I have one behind the T19 four speed in my '67 F250. They recommend you push the clutch in about halfway when shifting in/out of overdrive. You can shift without using the clutch but it bangs really hard. I have an Eaton two-speed switch mounted on my shifter handle and I just press/pull it as I push the clutch in. I takes a little practice to get a nice smooth transition but you'll get the hang of it real quick.

Cool.  Thanks for the info.  That's the detail I wanted to know.  Also liked the pic.

[NIsaacs]

Anyone have any experience using the gear vender overdrive products either good or bad? And yes, they are expensive. Also, what about alternative products you might recommend? Thak You! https://www.gearvendors.com/hrford3s.html

What will your application be?

[james]

My application would be for a 427 stroked to 482 with 370 gears in a 1964 ford falcon with c6 3 speed manual valve body. Also on my other car would it be worth it if I used 350 gears with the jon kaase boss 460 blocked stroked to 572 with c6 manual valve body? Thanks!

[falcongeorge]

I have three of them in different vehicles. I bought all mine used on Ebay. They ranged from $750-$1300. All work fine. If you are not opposed to used units, they come up every so often on Ebay or if you like scrounging in salvage yards look in 80s era RVs. A lot of them were used there. As mentioned, the "P" type units are a lot better and can be easily recognized by the large GM turbo 400 type speedometer gear in the tailshaft housing.

That's interesting, with price tag for a new one, I never really considered them viable, I never realized you could pick them up used in the 1k range.
For me, I have little to no interest in doing the drag week thing (I have a small child, spending a week going off and playing with cars is just not in the cards) and I am retired, so I don't have to commute, even in my truck, I rarely use the od, and it has 4.56s, for the majority of the driving I do, steep gearing is fine, but it you can get a GV for around a grand, that does make it more interesting.

[cammerfe]

About a zillion years ago I bought a basket case '59 Austin Healey 100-6 with a three litre engine and a Laycock de Normanville OD-equipped trans.

The transmission was laying across the seats in the car and the front suspension was all in pieces. I put the front back together and had the trans gone through. When I got it running, I discovered that at about 90-95 MPH it would spontaneously shift out of OD and the engine revs would jump by the difference in the final drive and the OD ratio. It never hurt anything, but it WAS disconcerting so I learned to keep the car at just below the 'jump' point. I sold it fifty years ago, and last I knew the new owner still had it. I'll have to ask him if it still has that characteristic.

KS

[Drew Pojedinec]

George, i forget how much, but I think I bought my first GV for $300. 
Mind you I had nothing to put it in and it sat in my shop for 8 years, but still.....

[Falcon67]

I agree its some about cost.  Personally, I could do fine with a mid 90s AOD and a few upgrade parts because I don't intend to make 1xxx HP ever.  600 would be about the limit my budget could produce and that's plenty.  My home built roller C4 has seen a lot of use up to 500 HP with no issues, so I'm sure I could build up a AOD easily for much less than a GV unit. 

[falcongeorge]

George, i forget how much, but I think I bought my first GV for $300. 
Mind you I had nothing to put it in and it sat in my shop for 8 years, but still.....

Man, I think if I found one for $300, I'd buy it " just in case " too! Helluva deal!

[falcongeorge]

I agree its some about cost.  Personally, I could do fine with a mid 90s AOD and a few upgrade parts because I don't intend to make 1xxx HP ever.  600 would be about the limit my budget could produce and that's plenty.  My home built roller C4 has seen a lot of use up to 500 HP with no issues, so I'm sure I could build up a AOD easily for much less than a GV unit.

Yes, for me, I am starting from ground zero, so the AOD makes sense. I do have a C-4, but it's a '67 core, so you would want to do the input shaft upgrade anyway, just for converter selection, by the time you do that, it makes more sense to start with a  $100 aod core.

[66FAIRLANE]

You think its expensive over there. Try landing one in Australia!

For me it was about being bulletproof. While power handling capability is well above what I need I wanted something I would never have to worry about. My C6 was fresh, strong & fitted both mechanically & aesthetically (shifter with console etc). I also intend to keep the car for a long time. I do wish however I had bought the short option & dropped the trans to fit it.

Had I been starting from scratch I may have gone a different path.

[Falcon67]

Yes, for me, I am starting from ground zero, so the AOD makes sense. I do have a C-4, but it's a '67 core, so you would want to do the input shaft upgrade anyway, just for converter selection, by the time you do that, it makes more sense to start with a  $100 aod core.

Agree.  My problem here is last time I asked the local yard wanted $250 for a junker AOD, say what?  Dang people.  I have one 67 core somewhere that I would consider a "driver" trans.  All the stuff we really beat on is 70 up.  I do have a C4 with the "351M/400/429/460 bell" stashed away too.  That one was a freebie LOL.  So was the virgin bore 400 block.  Oh, now just a minute here....