Author Topic: Forum member Joe Craine at Engine Masters with Y-Block  (Read 9469 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

machoneman

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3859
    • View Profile
Re: Forum member Joe Craine at Engine Masters with Y-Block
« Reply #15 on: October 04, 2018, 11:48:21 AM »
I forgot that Chris as yes, why no T-ram, even today, IS a big mystery!
Bob Maag

FElony

  • Guest
Re: Forum member Joe Craine at Engine Masters with Y-Block
« Reply #16 on: October 04, 2018, 12:04:11 PM »
I forgot that Chris as yes, why no T-ram, even today, IS a big mystery!

I know some people are using the Price adaptor to put the 289 piece on a Windsor, adding extra cost. But then, the runners are too small. There needs to be a dedicated ram for the popular 408-454 stroker crowd. Definitely a missing link. Weiand needs to be persuaded.

cammerfe

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1676
    • View Profile
Re: Forum member Joe Craine at Engine Masters with Y-Block
« Reply #17 on: October 04, 2018, 12:06:42 PM »
Looking at the pictures of Joe's engine, the only improvement I can imagine would be if he had a pair of original T-Bird rocker covers on it!

KS

FElony

  • Guest
Re: Forum member Joe Craine at Engine Masters with Y-Block
« Reply #18 on: October 04, 2018, 12:11:00 PM »
Moroso has made (or had their name slapped on) oil filters since the late 60's or early 70's.
I don't recall ever seeing a Moroso oil filter. Is there a reason for this choice compared to the others?

I have had a mental block against Moroso because of their heavily pro-Chevy agenda dating back. So, I'm going to use that as an excuse for this oil filter thing. Yeah, that works.  ::)

FElony

  • Guest
Re: Forum member Joe Craine at Engine Masters with Y-Block
« Reply #19 on: October 04, 2018, 12:16:50 PM »
Looking at the pictures of Joe's engine, the only improvement I can imagine would be if he had a pair of original T-Bird rocker covers on it!

KS

I have a nice set of originals. Also a turned 312 crank and a tach drive distributor off an E or F engine, I think. Great parts for the Y-Block engine I don't own. Go figure.

e philpott

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1004
    • View Profile
Re: Forum member Joe Craine at Engine Masters with Y-Block
« Reply #20 on: October 04, 2018, 02:12:41 PM »
I like Joe's engine better than the Kaase , not knocking the MEL or Kaase but realistically it's a 6 figure engine if your lucky enough for Jon to even consider on building you one  , Joes effort is a real Y Block piece with just a major  massaging
« Last Edit: October 05, 2018, 04:53:22 PM by e philpott »

gt350hr

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 941
    • View Profile
Re: Forum member Joe Craine at Engine Masters with Y-Block
« Reply #21 on: October 04, 2018, 03:55:21 PM »
Interesting head mods, for sure.

In today's world, I guess it wouldn't be hard to design and build an all new head and intake (or use an adaptor like Jay's for available intakes).

Imagine:

-A SBF head with smaller Tunnel Port heads than the originals.
-A FE head (ala' Jay's plans) with raised HR type intakes and straightened out (or replaced 100%) and raised exhaust ports.
-a BBF with LS-7 (sorry!) intake ports.


Many possibilities here with new heads for 455 Buicks, Nailhead Buicks, BB Olds, etc. Maybe a great head for an old 500 CID Caddy too!

P.S. I'm aware that replacement aluminum heads are available for many engines, GM's included. Most are fairly close to OEM heads and not radical.

    The idea for that modified head came from a pair of small block Ford heads cast in '67 that I found at Holman Moody's in Charlotte when i was there in '77. I was digging around in an area where cast iron heads were stacked and noticed the "protruding" combustion chamber and wanted to see why it was done. It was apparent that Ford built a "cheater" head with very tall and high placed ports that when bolted on the engine looked "stock". The head was used in conjunction with a 9.2 deck "stretched" 302 style block with an XE casting number nicknamed the 377 block. A friend of mine ended up buying the heads that day and I took one to Dyno Don's shop in Orange when Jon worked for Dyno so we could flow test the head. Jon remembered the concept and incorporated it into that Engine Masters entry. His creativity is incredible.
  The original deign can "probably" be linked to Al Buckmaster of Ford's Scientific engine development group. He's the man behind most of Ford's performance heads ( except the tunnel ports )
    Randy

Joe-JDC

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1576
  • Truth stands on its own merit.
    • View Profile
Re: Forum member Joe Craine at Engine Masters with Y-Block
« Reply #22 on: October 05, 2018, 08:48:35 PM »
Hi, folks, just got back home from the Engine Masters Challenge, and checking in.  It was a very interesting challenge for sure.  They lost 5 out of 7 of the Vintage entries due to detonation.  I moved my timing back to 26* because the first two engines destroyed themselves, and I lost 30 hp and 30 lbft torque from the timing change.  We had a solid 595hp at home, and that would have won the Vintage class if I could have kept my timing at 29.5* with higher octane fuel.  The Sunoco fuel was 100 octane, and we did not get that information until a few days before the competition.  We were running 13:1 compression, and it was not compatible with the 100 octane fuel.  I was tied with Jon after two pulls on the dyno, but Jon then went to tuning and adding timing to his engine to break the tie.  He was able to increase his timing just enough to get the points needed, and by tweaking his carbs and timing, he won fair.  I should have not tried to increase my timing more than one degree, but it is always easy to second guess yourself.  The little 292/375 Y was definitely a strong performer, and with 110 VP, it would have been the winner.  You talk about the headers on Jon's engine, but we actually dyno tested his EMC headers  from the winning engine back in 2015, and my FPAs made more torque and horsepower.  Now I will have to decide if I want to build another entry for next year.  LOL.  They will definitely change the rules so that the winning engine cannot come back the following year.    Joe-JDC
Joe-JDC '70GT-500

Joe-JDC

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1576
  • Truth stands on its own merit.
    • View Profile
Re: Forum member Joe Craine at Engine Masters with Y-Block
« Reply #23 on: October 05, 2018, 09:03:42 PM »
Looking at the pictures of Joe's engine, the only improvement I can imagine would be if he had a pair of original T-Bird rocker covers on it!

KS
I have the Thunderbird valve covers, but I just could not cut them to install the crankcase evacuation breathers.  The Edelbrock covers do not have any particular significance to me, so they were sacrificed for the cause.  Joe-JDC
Joe-JDC '70GT-500

turbohunter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2515
    • View Profile
Re: Forum member Joe Craine at Engine Masters with Y-Block
« Reply #24 on: October 05, 2018, 09:37:04 PM »
Tip of the hat Mr. Craine.
Much respect.
Marc
'61 F100 292Y
'66 Mustang Injected 428
'66 Q code Country Squire wagon


Stangman

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1843
    • View Profile
Re: Forum member Joe Craine at Engine Masters with Y-Block
« Reply #25 on: October 05, 2018, 10:06:38 PM »
Nice showing Joe, keeping Ford relavant is what we need

428 GALAXIE

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 160
    • View Profile
Re: Forum member Joe Craine at Engine Masters with Y-Block
« Reply #26 on: October 06, 2018, 05:13:27 AM »
Have to say very nice.Hats off.
Mikko

thatdarncat

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1933
    • View Profile
Re: Forum member Joe Craine at Engine Masters with Y-Block
« Reply #27 on: October 06, 2018, 05:27:22 AM »
Great job Joe, and thanks for sharing the experience with us.
Kevin Rolph

1967 Cougar Drag Car ( under constuction )
1966 7 litre Galaxie
1966 Country Squire 390
1966 Cyclone GT 390
1968 Torino GT 390
1972 Gran Torino wagon
1978 Lincoln Mk V

Barry_R

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1987
    • View Profile
    • Survival Motorsports
Re: Forum member Joe Craine at Engine Masters with Y-Block
« Reply #28 on: October 06, 2018, 05:47:36 AM »
Congrats for a strong effort!

It was great seeing you again, and the entry was absolutely top shelf.

Royce

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 792
    • View Profile
Re: Forum member Joe Craine at Engine Masters with Y-Block
« Reply #29 on: October 06, 2018, 10:56:37 AM »
I would like to give a tip of the cap to my 2 Y block competitors Ted and Joe who placed 2nd and 3rd..Ted was plowing new ground with a 403 inch Y block.. It is a real feat to get a 4.3 inch stroke into engine architecture that is closer to a small block than a big block. As so often happens in racing, when you plow new ground you are bound to hit some stones. Ted was unlucky as he was the first up on the dyno and had to deal with the new fuel. Sunoco 250 GT was the fuel that was provided in 2017. Nobody had any detonation problems. The same fuel this year destroyed 5 engines...  Unfortunately the Sunoco rep was nowhere to be seen. Joe had the best looking tidiest engine in the contest, plus it was a real contender.. He was on track for the best Y block score ever and potentially a win till he was bitten by the detonation bug.

I was again teamed with Jon Kaase as we fielded basically the same engine as 2018 with a few modifications. It is the same 473 inch MEL short block and the highly modified heads . The tunnel ram was reworked with a new plenum and twin dominators, and it was running a cam that made some more top end horsepower.  We had planned to run a cam that scored better, but Comp did not finish the custom cam in time,  so we ran what we had.. We finished about 100 points lower than last year, sacrificing low and mid range to gain top end horsepower.. The way EMC scores, low end is very important to making a good score.. We did want to make an 800 horsepower number but came up just short with 798.6.
Our engine avoided the detonation carnage. Being the 5th engine to run we had seen some failures.. Jon backed the tune way down till we got 3 solid runs in, then started creeping up on the timing and fuel curve..The MEL is running about a point less compression than the others, plus it is essentially an O ringed head so gasket failure is unlikely. We ended up with a middle of the road tune, as Jon did not want to push the envelope.. after all, when the contest is over I get the engine back and he did not want to have to rebuild it again  lol

A lot of people think since Jon is a big time builder that he can throw a lot of money and hired labor at these entries. With the MEL that is not the case at all.. He did all the labor himself, and the parts are nothing special. $600 crank $400 set of rods  Diamond pistons, off the shelf valves and springs, mid level roller lifters. bullet proof valvetrain custom made using a T&D FE street setup. Stock timing chain and oil pump, crank trigger firing though a stock distributor.. A well used Weiand tunnel ram. The Dominators are custom pieces but they were built for another boat project.  Actually the twin 750s we ran last year were probably better performers.
The secret sauce is what comes from the creative mind of Jon Kaase..To turn a low rpm torque motor with no performance reputation into a race motor is an extraordinary feat..  The creativity and machining skill that went into the heads is mind boggling. One needs to lay eyes on them to understand what he did and how he did it..We have been invited to be at the PRI show at the JE booth with the engine on display, so if any of you are attending, stop by for a look see
Finally I can't say enough about Jon Kaase the man and engine builder.. Obviously he is creative and skilled.. What most people don't know is he has the killer instinct for winning.. yet he is humble, never brags, respects others, always is willing to chat and answer questions, wants other people to succeed.  It has been a pleasure and honor to partner with him.
« Last Edit: October 06, 2018, 01:34:58 PM by Royce »
1955 Thunderbird Competition Coupe Altered Chassis "War Bird" 383 Lincoln Y block 520 hp
1955 Thunderbird 292 275 hp Y Block
1956 Ford Victoria 292 Y block

1957 Mercury 2dr Wagon "Battle Wagon" drag car 
1957 Thunderbird Glass body Tube Chassis drag car 333 cu in 500 hp Ford Y block
1961 Starliner 390/375 clone
1965 GT40 tribute w/FE
1966 Falcon Pro Touring project
Kaase Boss 547. 840 HP 698 Torque  pump gas
1992 BMW V-12 5.0
2001 Lincoln 5.4 4 cam
2000 Jaguar XK8 (Ford V8)