1966 Ford GT 40 Mk II LeMans Winner

[BruceS]

As most of you know Ford returns to compete at the 24 Hours of LeMans this year.  This is a well-done video discussing the car that won 50 years ago, its 485HP 427 FE, and some of Ford's competitors back in the day.  Btw the top speed achieved by the '66 Ford GT on the tree-lined Mulsanne straight was approx. 215 mph, about 40mph faster than the nearest finisher!  IMO these cars still look current today, as a testament to their classic design and performance.

http://www.racer.com/wec-le-mans/item/125127-video-how-the-66-le-mans-winning-gt40-stacked-up-against-its-rivals

Bruce

[cammerfe]

A J Foyt claimed to have hit 240+ on the Mulsanne.

KS

[thatdarncat]

Very cool video. As a point of clarification on the top speed issue, A.J. Foyt competed ( and won with co-driver Dan Gurney ) at LeMans in 1967 in a GT40 MK IV, a later variant, and further refined GT40, than the 1966 LeMans winning MKII. It's also interesting to note that the 1966 LeMans winning car ( chassis P1046 ) featured in the video led kind of a un-glorious life after the race. It was shipped back to Shelby American and used for transmission testing, then shipped to Holman & Moody and used for other various testing. It competed in at least one more race the next season at Daytona where it was crashed. Finally after being used in an advertising campaign by a shirt company it was sent to Holman & Moody where it was used as a parts car! From there it was purchased by a private owner in 1969, but converted by Holman & Moody into a street car. It's hard to believe today that a car that represented the millions Henry Ford II spent to finally win LeMans wouldn't have immediately gone on display in the Ford headquarters Rotunda!   

[BruceS]

Edit: Kevin, thanks for your comments and the info on what happened to the '66 winner.  At least the '67 winner is enshrined at The Henry Ford as it should be!

Ha! He probably did; as he and Dan Gurney won the '67 LeMans 24 with a Ford Mk. IV.  The Mk. IV combined all the lessons learned from the previous three seasons to make for an unbeatable package.  From what I've read about the '67 race, Foyt and Gurney's car took off at the start and set a pace that their competitors thought was impossible to sustain.  Turns out they could and won the race by 5 LAPS over the second place Ferrari.  The car can be seen today at the Henry Ford Museum in Dearborn. 

http://www.ultimatecarpage.com/car/3406/Ford-Mk-IV.html

Here's a question: I believe the Mk. IVs used an 8V TP 427 which I think was the hot setup for NASCAR at the time; can anyone verify that?

Thanks,
Bruce

[thatdarncat]

I was lucky enough to see the '67 LeMans winning GT40 MK IV J-5 in the fall of 2003 when I was at Pomona racing and the car was on display at the NHRA museum for the Ford 100th anniversary event after being at the Monterey Historics. Unfortunately the tail of the car was not open to allow a close inspection of the engine. Even with the tail up the large air pan the MK IV's used hides much of the intake. I too have heard the MK IV cars in '67 used the 427 Tunnel Port engine at LeMans, but I personally don't know, it's only second hand info. I may have to try and see if I can find some period photos taken at the race. There is a lot of conflicting information around on these cars, it's hard to know what is factual. Even people that claim to KNOW are often proven wrong. There is conflicting information as well on whether the LeMans winning J-5 still has it's original engine. There is about a 5 year period where the car was stored at Ford after some brief show duty following LeMans and when Ford donated it to the Henry Ford Museum where no documentation exists. I mention that because one picture I saw, which barely shows a corner of the intake appears to be a Medium Riser intake and not a Tunnel Port. It is known that Aluminum Tunnel Port heads were made. All the other GT-40 MK IV's I believe either have had their engines replaced or have been through multiple restorations. J-9 may have an original engine, but it was built as a Can-Am car with the 3 valve 427. The Shelby American World Registry of Cobra's & GT40's has a lot of good info on these cars, but not much detail on the engines in the MK IV's. 

[thatdarncat]

Here's a good video of the 1967 LeMans winning GT40 MK IV J-5 from just a few years ago, before it traveled to Europe for a 45th anniversary tour. If you watch at about the 3:30 minute mark when they show a close up of the engine and look at the intake runners they appear to be the squared off edges of a Medium Riser runner and not the rounded runners of a Tunnel Port intake. Ford engineer Mose Nowland in other videos insists that the engine in the car is the original untouched 427, but like I said, others who possibly had more direct involvement with the car say it isn't. And it was widely reported after the race that the original engine was pulled and dyno tested.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xc9iBgAfJrg

I'm still searching for a period close up of a 1967 GT40 Mk IV engine, nothing yet. But here's a nice photo from Feb 1967 ( 4 months before LeMans ) at the 24 hours of Daytona of GT40 Mk II P1047 of Dan Gurney & A.J. Foyt. Not close enough to see the intake though.   

[cjshaker]

I realize the mentality was different back then, but it's amazing that Ford, or anybody else for that matter, had zero interest in preserving those cars.

As much as we relish the FE's victory years at Lemans, to me anyway, it's even more amazing that they went back and kicked Ferrari's butt for 2 more years using the small block. That's what you call adding insult to injury!

[HolmanMoodyStroppeGang]

Stroppe was very proud to have 2 of the cars, and then other versions that would come in and out for testing at Riverside and elsewhere.  I think the essay above about the cars that returned to Holman Moody means Holman Moody Stroppe and few knew that for a long time.

There are a handful of books that were unaware of this and made a few mistakes so we try to fix that if we can. Stroppe had a big piece of the actual race teams.

We have a book of pictures of these cars in a special area.  Large false walls and screening was used to keep almost everybody out of this area.  At least 3 of our old team that worked on these cars are in this gang of ours, Bruce, Bobby and Dan. Jr has much of the history and so do I.  So when I do an essay about this part of the shop, it is based upon all of us sharing.

At this time, Gurney did his Dyno testing at HMS and then went on to build his own huge, legendary race car shop close by.  He was just an amazing all around racer, builder and businessman.

Some parts definitely survived and we use them for mementos

We have a set of heads, and also an intake off of 'The Mule'. I have this ultra rare intake and need to post some pictures some day. It is beautiful and on display for friends.

I have a lot of the Dyno Sheets too and there are other guys with a lot of history at HM South.

This program was very Top Secret and employees were also prevented from visiting the special areas ! 

I think this was a real fun post and thank you very much.  You know, when these cars came in and out, they did it on an open trailer sometimes, with tarps over the cars.  They had to because when people saw them a lot of chaos could happen. Pictures which we prohibited, some guys followed the trucks to ask a bunch of questions, and so on.

I know these cars inspired many many racers, and I hope that they continue to do so by planting a dream to build or drive a similar machine for a few of the new guys. Or old.

What I would say to Hot Rodders out there who build what they like, and drive what they build is this.  You can get a Pantera or a Kit Car, and add similar power, improve the brakes and end up driving a car as fast or faster than the legendary GT40s if you try hard enough. 

We have a large population of Hot Rodded Pantera's out here and this goal is what they chase.  Twin blown big inch SVO engines are common, on race gas, running the highways.  Loud and proud.  What is rare and FAST is adding an all aluminum FE.    DeTomaso and Ford did a handful back then, and since we prepped every Pantera sold in the US, we had 1 for a while.  That car was a BEAST.   

Today you could far surpass that Beast with an all alloy FE and the tricks we have to turn up the wick.

But if you have the budget, you have to check out the new GT40s.  We have some out here for the SHELBY shows and the FORD Knotts show. WOW,    what a machine.  The stuff that dreams are made of.

Seeing FORD back in action on the world stage is wonderful and it says something to us.

FORD doesn't start a program and set a goal to win a big race without a long line of really talented people poised and ready to win win win.  Ford is really good at quietly entering a big race pretty confident that they have a winning hand, absent, unforeseeable misfortune

My money is on FORD here because they are world class, and cutting edge

[BruceS]

Kevin and all, agree that in the video at 3:30 mins the intake looks like an 8V MR with baldy valve covers, not a TP.  Could be the MR gave more low / mid range torque than the TP to better suit the LeMans track or that's not the original engine configuration.  We would just have to have someone tell us who was there... In the video they claim the engine was not that sophisticated; but running WOT for hours in competition at the Daytona 500 or 24 hours at LeMans make our FEs pretty special in my book!

Bruce

[thatdarncat]

 "I think the essay above about the cars that returned to Holman Moody means Holman Moody Stroppe and few knew that for a long time."

Actually I don't know which facility GT40 MK II P1046 went to after the 1966 race, but it's well documented that the GT40's in HM care were prepared, repaired and stored at Holman Moody Charlotte, NC. as well. It may have spent time at both places and since the car was raced again in Feb. 1967 at Daytona, it's last race, it seems logical that it spent time at Charlotte, but I don't want to assume anything. I just wanted to be clear I'm not stating where the car was, just that it was in H-M possession from sources I referenced. It would be really cool Tom if you had some period photos or documents you could share that would shine some light on whether Ford ran the Tunnel Port heads & intake at LeMans in 1967. I think it's pretty clear from photos I've seen that the cars did run 2-4's in '67.

Here's a couple excellent Ford Motor Co. photos I found from 1967 detailing the engine compartment ( still can't see the intake though ) and the interior of the MK IV. You can clearly see the roll cage installed in the MK IV's after Ken Miles death in car J-2. The cage was not part of the original design.

[thatdarncat]

From what I have read the 1967 LeMans GT40 MK IV's used the 427 2-4v dual plane Tunnel Port intake. If you look closely at the black & white Ford Motor Co. engine compartment photo above and look at the what appear to be the intake manifold bolts they seem to stand above the valve cover rail. That is a characteristic of Tunnel Port intakes. The normal Medium Riser dual plane intake the bolts sit under the valve cover rail. Here are a couple intake photos from the MustangTek site. First the Tunnel Port:



And the Medium Riser:



I still won't call that conclusive for me, but it hints at the Tunnel Port.

For anyone not aware of the MustangTek I.D. site here's the link: http://mustangtek.com/index.html

[jayb]

Looks pretty conclusive to me.  No other FE intake has the bolts coming out that far...

[BruceS]

Yep, looks pretty close to a TP to me too   I love those FoMoCo photos, they show the state of the art in race car construction of the day, i.e. no carbon fiber, analog gages, and a riveted and bonded chassis. 

Bruce