Author Topic: High torque starter for 406  (Read 11453 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

JimNolan

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 350
  • 63 Galaxie XL 410ci / 57 Fairlane 500 390ci
    • View Profile
Re: High torque starter for 406
« Reply #15 on: August 10, 2014, 05:52:50 PM »
Allright Guys, thanks for all the responses. I was at my wits end with all these starters. Last May I replaced the battery because it was old and I was going to Carlisle. I had to loosen the Alternator and move it out of the way so I could get the battery in easily. I forgot to tighten the alternator up again. I have been driving this car at least 3K miles with the alternator belt just sitting in the pulley groves. Don't ask me how it went this long, I have no idea. There wasn't anything wrong with the old starter to begin with. The battery when that low started the engine fine but didn't have the current to start it when it was hot. Once I got the battery charged it worked just fine. Now I've got a new battery, cables, solenoid and a new powermaster 3131 starter. It cranks over like a new car at any time, hot or cold.
We all know that heat on the starter puts a strain on the battery. What made me to rush to judgment that I had starter problems was the fact I had a new battery. There's no way in God's green earth I would have thought I could have drove that car that long before the battery went down to begin with. 

jayb

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7437
    • View Profile
    • FE Power
Re: High torque starter for 406
« Reply #16 on: August 10, 2014, 06:03:41 PM »
Wow.  The simplest fix is the best  :)
Jay Brown
- 1969 Mach 1, Drag Week 2005 Winner NA/BB, 511" FE (10.60s @ 129); Drag Week 2007 Runner-Up PA/BB, 490" Supercharged FE (9.35 @ 151)
- 1964 Ford Galaxie, Drag Week 2009 Winner Modified NA (9.50s @ 143), 585" SOHC
- 1969 Shelby Clone, Drag Week 2015 Winner Modified NA (Average 8.98 @ 149), 585" SOHC

   

cjshaker

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4474
    • View Profile
Re: High torque starter for 406
« Reply #17 on: August 10, 2014, 06:14:13 PM »
I've thought about this common problem several times over the years, and honestly I don't know why I've never had a problem. The only times I ever had an issue with hard hot starts is when I would run too much initial timing. I would just back off the initial and change the curve and total to match and problem gone.

I'm getting some miles on the car right now to work out any bugs in prep for a couple of longer jaunts coming up. You know my engine, 500 hp all iron 427, fresh rebuild, mechanical advance in a cramped Mustang engine bay. It has a marginally good battery at the moment, temps get to 195* cruising slow around town, drops immediately to 180*-185* when back up to speed, NO need for a heater once the headers start cooking the floorboards ::). I just now got back from purposely running the car about 30 miles in 90* temperatures and stopped a couple of times for a few minutes to check out some local sights. After sitting for about 5 minutes, the temp climbs to about 210*. Every time it doesn't hesitate to turn over. That's with reproduction battery and starter wires which I think are marginal. I could say that the cam bleeds off some fairly significant compression at start, which it does, but my old cam was much milder and had the same compression, with the same results.

I don't know. It baffles me.

Maybe a heat "shield" would help with the heat saturation and allow it to still get air for cooling, but there usually isn't much room for one.
Doug Smith


'69 R-code Mach 1, 427 MR, 2x4, Jerico, 4.30 Locker
'70 F-350 390
'55 Ford Customline 2dr
'37 Ford Coupe

cjshaker

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4474
    • View Profile
Re: High torque starter for 406
« Reply #18 on: August 10, 2014, 06:16:49 PM »
On second thought, maybe it's just your alternator belt...LMAO!

Don't feel bad. Do you know how many times I've left the breaker bar on the crank while running valves, then went to start it? ::) ::)
Doug Smith


'69 R-code Mach 1, 427 MR, 2x4, Jerico, 4.30 Locker
'70 F-350 390
'55 Ford Customline 2dr
'37 Ford Coupe

My427stang

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3966
    • View Profile
Re: High torque starter for 406
« Reply #19 on: August 10, 2014, 09:12:27 PM »
On second thought, maybe it's just your alternator belt...LMAO!

Don't feel bad. Do you know how many times I've left the breaker bar on the crank while running valves, then went to start it? ::) ::)

Next time, put your keys in the drawer you keep the breaker bar in :)

---------------------------------
Ross
Bullock's Power Service, LLC
- 70 Fastback Mustang, 489 cid FE, Victor, SEFI, Erson SFT cam, TKO-600 5 speed, 4.11 9 inch.
- 71 F100 shortbed 4x4, 461 cid FE, headers, Victor Pro-flo EFI, Comp Custom HFT cam, 3.50 9 inch

mlcraven

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 205
    • View Profile
Re: High torque starter for 406
« Reply #20 on: August 12, 2014, 12:38:05 PM »
On second thought, maybe it's just your alternator belt...LMAO!

Don't feel bad. Do you know how many times I've left the breaker bar on the crank while running valves, then went to start it? ::) ::)
Good opportunity to practise your French, I'm sure. My air force friends are big believers in something they call "tool control"
Michael

Heo

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3322
    • View Profile
Re: High torque starter for 406
« Reply #21 on: August 12, 2014, 05:33:31 PM »
Yes when i worked for the swedish airforce we had cutouts in foam rubber
for each tool and if a tool was missing the airplane stayed on the ground
till the tool was found



The defenition of a Gentleman, is a man that can play the accordion.But dont do it

Lenz

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 578
    • View Profile
Re: High torque starter for 406
« Reply #22 on: August 12, 2014, 06:10:33 PM »
On second thought, maybe it's just your alternator belt...LMAO!

Don't feel bad. Do you know how many times I've left the breaker bar on the crank while running valves, then went to start it? ::) ::)
Plus 1.  It truly is amazing how fortunate you can get in spinning off and dropping the crank snout bolt complete with box end 15/16" without hurting a thing at fire-up.  So much for complete focus, yes? ;D.  Well, at least the valves were set right..........
Len Zielinski
'64 Galaxie 500 445 Toploader
'69 F100 300 stick

cjshaker

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4474
    • View Profile
Re: High torque starter for 406
« Reply #23 on: August 12, 2014, 08:32:08 PM »
Next time, put your keys in the drawer you keep the breaker bar in :)

Ross, that's a good idea....if I can remember next time :)

Plus 1.  It truly is amazing how fortunate you can get in spinning off and dropping the crank snout bolt complete with box end 15/16" without hurting a thing at fire-up.  So much for complete focus, yes? ;D.  Well, at least the valves were set right..........

Lenz, I've always been fortunate enough to never hit the radiator, or anything else for that matter. I'm glad I'm not the only one!

Yes when i worked for the swedish airforce we had cutouts in foam rubber
for each tool and if a tool was missing the airplane stayed on the ground
till the tool was found

Yeah, a missing tool during some airplane maintenance would NOT be a good thing :o  I'm sure more than one guy got their butt chewed out over that rule.
Doug Smith


'69 R-code Mach 1, 427 MR, 2x4, Jerico, 4.30 Locker
'70 F-350 390
'55 Ford Customline 2dr
'37 Ford Coupe

66FAIRLANE

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 565
  • Andy
    • View Profile
Re: High torque starter for 406
« Reply #24 on: August 13, 2014, 02:00:06 AM »
On second thought, maybe it's just your alternator belt...LMAO!

Don't feel bad. Do you know how many times I've left the breaker bar on the crank while running valves, then went to start it? ::) ::)

Next time, put your keys in the drawer you keep the breaker bar in :)

Ahh good idea. Gunna use this one as I have done it a couple of times myself. Lucky my breaker bar is an old torque wrench with a ratchet mechanism. At work if I bought something at lunch for home and have to put it in the fridge I put my keys in there with it so I can't leave without it. Same principal I guess.