My 427 SOHC Build..... Finally the time has come!

[cobracammer]

OK thank you all for posting.  I am going to try a little of everything (one at a time).  I did test the battery already.  Its an optima red top and its on a "Battery tender" trickle charger.  I took it to the autoparts store and they say it holds a charge just fine.

Next, I am going to take a dremmel and grind down the "tab" on the tubular K member I have the starter grounded to.  The more I read the more I hear how any powdercoating can screw up a ground connection.  The thing with the tubular K members is that they have this "Super" coating on them.  Its got to be the thickest powder coating I have ever come across.... I guess that's good since the underside of the car gets a beating from the elements.  I am going to grind both sides of the tab down to bare metal and re bolt on the ground cable. (I believe the original ground location for the Saleen engine was the actual block itself, but it wont reach the Cammer block.)

Before I try the starter again (after the thorough powder coating removal), I am going to try and turn the engine (clockwise) with a breaker bar and socket.  Given the fact that this baby is literally shoehorned in the engine bay, I am not sure If I can even get to it (I definitely can not even see the balancer from the underside).  Possibly taking off a few skid plates and such may give me access).  I guess if I can not reach the balancer with the breaker bar, I could put the car in 1st gear and roll it forward down the driveway?  This would turn the engine.  I am guessing if its locked up it wont roll forward?....  that would be a last resort.

I keep reading that bad ground connections on a starter make the solenoid click (because they don't require that much current to operate), but the starter motor itself wont activate because it needs much more current.... and with a bad ground connection, you just get a click.  I really hope at this point its just the ground.

in other news, I already ordered a replacement stainless braided clutch supply line.  It looks like if I can loosen and retighten the fitting through the clutch fork window, I wont need to remove the transmission.  I don't think I can get much of a turn on the wrench, so it may be slow going.  After I get it removed, I can re-Teflon tape the fitting back onto the braided line, and then hopefully slowly snug it back down through the same fork window.  Keep you all posted

[Heo]

Bad ground to the engine can caused the burnt clutch suply line
the steel braided line worked as ground strap
I have seen speedo ,clutch,throtlle cables burnt up  caused by bad ground
One time i changed engine in a Mercedes Diesel i used the stock ground
strap stock ground point but the strap was thigtened at a slight different angle
Starter just clicked and clicked and smoke started to pour out under the dashboard
 The speedo cable melted itself to the wires for the brakelight so brakelight
was constantly on and i had no clue wath hapened until i saw the crispy
speedo cable under the car

[cobracammer]

HAHAHA  HEO!  Just as I was coming on to post that!  OK....  I did some reading.  I definitely have the ground screwed up!  The wire I grounded to the K member down by the starter was originally bolted to the Saleen Block!  It wont reach the cammer block, so I grounded it to the tubular K member.  Its just that!!!  I also read online that the starter does not have a ground wire as it grounds itself through the block....  since I did not attach the ground back to the block, but to the tubular K member, the starter is not grounded.... and the current found the ground by going through the engine.... across to the bell housing and to the stainless line since it touches the cars chassis! 

CRAP and Hooray all at the same time.  OK so I need to (somehow) take that ground wire I have bolted to the K member and get it bolted to the block .... fairly close to the starter location!

[drdano]

An external star lock washer will go through powder coating pretty easily.  :-)

[Heo]

The engine needs a good ground to the chassie
its often like this.
Ground strap from one of the starter bolts to
some bolt on the frame/unibody.
 .K members are sometimes rubber isolated from the unibody
I dont know if the Saleen is like that since i never
saw one IRL

[jayb]

If it is a ground issue, then you can just add a second cable, from the ground point on the K member up to a bolt on the block.

[Heo]

But are the k-member solid or rubber mounted to the unibody?

[cobracammer]

That K member has a super thick powder coat.  I have a whole loom of really thick battery cable from back when I put the battery in my 68 Fastback in the trunk.  I like what was stated before.  I will run a piece of this thick cable from a bolt on the starter straight across to the frame rail.  I will sand down the frame rail in that spot to ensure a good connection.

I am so happy that this basically solved both issues (in theory), but so upset at myself that it burned up the stainless braided clutch feed line.

If this fix works, then the last item is just to make a little bracket to bolt on to the gas pedal to work with the throttle cable I have being shipped.  After that, its time to re-connect the coil wire, and fire her up!!!!!!!!!!

[machoneman]

I still like the idea of adding a 2nd strap ala' the old OEM Ford 'basket weave' design (broad, flat and woven)  that went from the firewall to the back of the block or head. Can't hurt to have too much here!

http://www.allfordmustangs.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=88367&d=1263870337

[cjshaker]

Hopefully you told the header guy that it wasn't his fault?

[cobracammer]

Yes. Told the header guy not to worry as it was an issue i caused. In other news, i picked up a woven ground strap tonight. It was tight, but i removed the lower starter bolt and attached one end.  The other end i placed under my K member ground location.....  I removed the coil wire again and prepared to test again. I wanted to get it sorted out before replacing the clutch line again.  I hopped in, pushed the clutch pedal down..... And voila, starter turned the car over!  Slow for the first 1 second and then easier and easier ( i am guessing lubrication helped as it turned).

[WConley]

Jason -

By "tight" I hope you mean the workspace to install the ground strap was tight.  If the strap itself was tight to the block you WILL tear it in half the first time you romp on that engine.  The motor mounts allow the engine to move around more than most people expect.

Best of luck whacking the moles.

- Bill

[cobracammer]

Hi Bill,  yes, the workspace.  He built the headers around the starter.  As you can imagine, not much room in there.  Ground strap had plenty of extra, and the metal mesh of the strap is wrapped in a thick plastic coating to prevent it from creating an arc somewhere in the slack. 

My clutch supply line was shipped last night along with a 36" throttle cable.  Im going to tackle that this weekend

[cobracammer]

Went into the garage to let it turn over again ( double check my work sort of speak) and found that the electrical tape coating on the braided ground strap melted off.  Honestly sending an arc anywhere throught the car again scares the crap out of me. So I cut a piece of battery terminal wire (2 gauge) i think and put fittings on both ends. I realize this is overkill on thickness, but these wires are made to take this kind of voltage and since they are sheathed in rubber ( heat resistant) it will reduce my chances of anythink like this on the future. Keys are in the photo to show scale

[My427stang]

I think at this point you should probably rethink how you are running ground wires to make sure the most draw is addressed the easiest

I would connect the negative side of the battery directly to the block and ensure that the connection is clear of paint and its a good contact

Then I would ground the body to the engine and potentially the body to the neg post of the battery if the battery cable has an extra jumper wire off it (not required but if it's there)

The starter will take the most voltage, and them you can be sure it has the ground directly.

Also, no benefit in turning over an engine until you are ready to fire it, it just turns dry.  I'd say set some time aside and fix it, then fire it.