Author Topic: Centrifugal supercharger for the FE...  (Read 19396 times)

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falcon428

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Centrifugal supercharger for the FE...
« on: August 03, 2013, 11:58:07 PM »
Now I'm taking a look into Centrifugal supercharger for my drag car.  Have seen guys using gear driven units.  Looking for someone that builds the gear driven mounts that would work on an FE.  I am going to contact the Supercharger Store and see if they make one.  Seems they are big on ProChargers stuff.  If anyone knows of any leads or places to contact it would be greatly appreciated.

I'm looking to make around 1200hp with the supercharger. Plan on going EFI as well, need to start researching my stand alone choices there as well. 

The interweb is a great thing to an extent, but it sure can make a person over think everything... LOL!!

I know your busy Jay and you had given me a few details on your supercharged setup on the mustang (that was back when I was contemplating going with a turbo setup) but if you get a chance could you refresh me on some of the details of your setup? 

Thank you!

Rodney
'65 Mercury Comet w/ Pond Alum. 427, C6
'61 Ford Starliner w/ 352, C6
'68 Falcon w/ ProCharged FE, Lenco 5sp
'67 Country Sedan SW
'62 Falcon awaiting turbocoupe motor & tranny
'40 Ford Tudor Sedan all original

BruceS

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Re: Centrifugal supercharger for the FE...
« Reply #1 on: August 04, 2013, 08:50:08 AM »
Try Magnuson Products LLC: www.magnacharger.com.  It looks like most of their applications are for late model cars, but they will likely have done an FE...

Good luck and keep us posted!

Bruce
66 Fairlane 500, 347-4V SB stroker, C4
63 Galaxie 500 fastback, 482 SO 4V, Cruise-O-Matic

jayb

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Re: Centrifugal supercharger for the FE...
« Reply #2 on: August 04, 2013, 09:15:56 AM »
My setup used a Vortech V7 Ysi supercharger.  I bought the BBC kit from Superchargers Online and adapted it to the FE.  I made 1200 HP with that setup on my 500" supercharged engine, but I needed a big air to water intercooler filled with ice to do it.  I had originally settled on the Vortech unit because it was small enough to fit under the hood of my Mach 1.

In order to get the boost up to 17 psi I also had to go to a toothed belt drive.  The 10 rib belt that you get with the Vortech kit started slipping at around 10-11 pounds of boost, and wouldn't go any higher. 

When I got the setup in the car I had cooling problems due to the position of the air to water intercooler box.  I had put it right in front of the engine, but in that position it blocked a substantial portion of the radiator, and the car just wouldn't stay cool, even just idling.  Lesson learned there was to put the intercooler box in some other location, the interior or the trunk, whatever.  I didn't want to cut my Mach 1 up to do that, so I just eliminated the intercooler and ran straight from the supercharger into the carb hat, and added a "Boost Cooler" methanol sprayer system to try to keep the inlet temps down.  That ended up working pretty well, and I wouldn't hesitate to do that again.

If I had to do it all over again I would reconsider a Procharger setup.  I rejected them initially because of the fit issues under the hood of my Mach 1, but looking at their specs it would have been a lot easier to make the power I wanted with a Procharger.  If there was some way to make it fit, I think it would be a better solution than the Vortech.

Here's some pics of my setup.  I started off with a carb box enclosure, as shown below:



This turned out to be such a pain getting to the carb to make any adjustments or changes that I bailed on it fairly quickly.  It also did not make great power, around 850 HP if I recall correctly.  Next I went to the carb hat, as shown below:



I also switched to a solid roller cam in this iteration.  This got me to 930 HP on the dyno, but with the 10 rib belt the boost was limited.  Next I went to the toothed belt drive, as shown in the photo below.  I had integrated the induction system with the shaker hood scoop, so that air came in through the scoop, went to the supercharger, and then came out and went to the carb hat which was also integrated into the air cleaner assembly.  On the dyno this setup proved to be very restrictive and cost at least 200 horsepower.  I ended up running the supercharger inlet open on the dyno to make just over 1200 HP.



Here's a picture showing the engine originally installed in the car, with the intercooler.  You can see how that box blocks a good portion of the radiator.



In the end, to make the engine fit and work in the car I had to ditch the intercooler and suck air from outside the inner fenderwell.  This certainly cost some big power, and in the car I don't think the engine was even making 1000 HP.  The car ran a best of 9.35 at 151 before I took the supercharged engine out and went back to naturally aspirated.

Hope that helps, and good luck with your project - Jay
Jay Brown
- 1969 Mach 1, Drag Week 2005 Winner NA/BB, 511" FE (10.60s @ 129); Drag Week 2007 Runner-Up PA/BB, 490" Supercharged FE (9.35 @ 151)
- 1964 Ford Galaxie, Drag Week 2009 Winner Modified NA (9.50s @ 143), 585" SOHC
- 1969 Shelby Clone, Drag Week 2015 Winner Modified NA (Average 8.98 @ 149), 585" SOHC

   

falcon428

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Re: Centrifugal supercharger for the FE...
« Reply #3 on: August 04, 2013, 05:43:05 PM »
Jay,

Thanks for your time and the pics.  I am looking into the ProCharger as a few other people have recommended them also.  Haven't found anyone that list a kit for an FE.  How difficult was it to adapt the BBC to work with the FE?  I'm also looking into gear driven setups as well.

I am looking at going EFI instead of blow thru.  I have the Edelbrock Victor FE EFI intake and was thinking of using the Wilson throttle body elbow.  Then have to look at FAST EZ-EFI or other controllers.

So many decisions to make.... Makes me wonder why I want to get away from a good ole naturally aspirated with a tried and true Holley like carb.  LOL :-).  Guess its just one of those ideas I can't get out of my mind.  That and I like to think outside of the box, hence building the 68 Falcon. 

'65 Mercury Comet w/ Pond Alum. 427, C6
'61 Ford Starliner w/ 352, C6
'68 Falcon w/ ProCharged FE, Lenco 5sp
'67 Country Sedan SW
'62 Falcon awaiting turbocoupe motor & tranny
'40 Ford Tudor Sedan all original

jayb

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Re: Centrifugal supercharger for the FE...
« Reply #4 on: August 04, 2013, 10:14:01 PM »
I like your idea of EFI; I wouldn't go back to the carb setup if I built another supercharged engine.  EFI would be the best way to go.

I had to machine some donut spacers for the pulleys to make the BBC kit work, and also a big aluminum chunky-looking bracket to bolt the plate that holds the supercharger to the FE.  That was the biggest challenge, but it was not really that tough.  Just took some time and effort, that's all.

To me, the fun in this hobby is trying new things and taking on new challenges.  Go for the supercharger setup with EFI; you won't regret it.
Jay Brown
- 1969 Mach 1, Drag Week 2005 Winner NA/BB, 511" FE (10.60s @ 129); Drag Week 2007 Runner-Up PA/BB, 490" Supercharged FE (9.35 @ 151)
- 1964 Ford Galaxie, Drag Week 2009 Winner Modified NA (9.50s @ 143), 585" SOHC
- 1969 Shelby Clone, Drag Week 2015 Winner Modified NA (Average 8.98 @ 149), 585" SOHC

   

cammerfe

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Re: Centrifugal supercharger for the FE...
« Reply #5 on: August 04, 2013, 11:56:21 PM »
I put a Paxton blower on my '54 Customline/312 combo and then went with a Paxton again on my '65 1/2 Mustang. But when I got my first turbo set-up, on a Mustang in the early '80s, I was completely hooked and would not even consider going back to a mechanically-driven lay-out again. I'm planning to go with two turbos on the four litre engine in my Land Speed car when I move up from E/F CC to EB/F CC with the (too slow!) completion of the engine that's now on the stand. I DO agree with you regarding EFI.

But that's just me---any kind of a forced-induction system is mega-fun!

KS

falcon428

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Re: Centrifugal supercharger for the FE...
« Reply #6 on: August 05, 2013, 08:08:44 PM »
I originally was thinking of turbos, but everyone keeps telling me that turbos make it much more difficult to run index or brackets.  Then I went back to looking into N/A, but that little demon in my head keeps telling me I want forced induction.  So my thinking is that a supercharger would be more consistent than turbo due to the fact that the spooling of a supercharger is directly related to crank (RPM) speed. 

Am I thinking correctly here?  I have been in love with forced induction since I bought my '87 Turbo coupe.  Have dreamed of doing a FE ever since. 

Also planning on running a Liberty clutch less 5 speed, there again I'm reading where that brings issues of belt wear due to unloading of power on supercharger, but with the Liberty Extreme clutch less I wouldn't think there would be much unloading of power.  As they have a split slider setup? 

Damn so much to wade thru, especially since I don't like to spend too much money twice... LOL!!  Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks!!

Rodney
'65 Mercury Comet w/ Pond Alum. 427, C6
'61 Ford Starliner w/ 352, C6
'68 Falcon w/ ProCharged FE, Lenco 5sp
'67 Country Sedan SW
'62 Falcon awaiting turbocoupe motor & tranny
'40 Ford Tudor Sedan all original

jayb

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Re: Centrifugal supercharger for the FE...
« Reply #7 on: August 05, 2013, 09:29:50 PM »
I agree that if you are going to bracket race the car the supercharger would be much more consistent than the turbos.  On the dyno you can get wildly varying results from run to run because of spooling the turbos differently before loading the engine.  The supercharger results are always consistent.  Should be the same situation for a bracket car.
Jay Brown
- 1969 Mach 1, Drag Week 2005 Winner NA/BB, 511" FE (10.60s @ 129); Drag Week 2007 Runner-Up PA/BB, 490" Supercharged FE (9.35 @ 151)
- 1964 Ford Galaxie, Drag Week 2009 Winner Modified NA (9.50s @ 143), 585" SOHC
- 1969 Shelby Clone, Drag Week 2015 Winner Modified NA (Average 8.98 @ 149), 585" SOHC