Author Topic: Blown Fuel 427 Wedges alive and cackling  (Read 3470 times)

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HolmanMoodyStroppeGang

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Blown Fuel 427 Wedges alive and cackling
« on: June 11, 2016, 11:02:29 PM »
Hello guys,

Just came in from the nitro event where a real nice 427 top oiler got some heat in her on Nitro.

Just wanted to share some pictures and info.

427 top oiler, early block.  Billet crank. Only 5.2 to 1 compression.  True wedge heads with the 427 stainless valves, no hard seats, cast iron stock guides clearanced due to extreme heat.

Soft copper head gaskets, no torque plate hone needed due to the cylinder pressure, stainless top ring and no water or filler in the block, and and...old school

Modern BBC journal VENOLIA forged aluminum rods, now, these are strong enough for a modern 500 CID fueler....gorgeous forgings

CRAGAR Med Riser blower intake for a 6-71,,rear pop off spring style burst relief

Gear drive behind a Micky T front cover with the side distributor mount,,,,,and a strong VERTEX magneto

Now check this one out....28 over on the blower.  For guys who don't know, that is a lot compared to say, a modern, NHRA Heritage fueler  .   Our rules make us run 18 over max.  Back when, 28 over, 31, 32,35, 38, even 41 over happened and the parts flew or the car flew

Wont reveal the MAG setting but you guys usually run more total advance on pump gas

This FE went over 200 MPH and get this,,,,the chassis is only 049 tubing !!    HAHAHAAAAA

Light !

Now firing this gal up was a hoot

As I have tried to share, as many here saw, a FE, blown, on fuel, a wedge, can flat pound the pavement and this one just did

A FE on fuel likes more fuel than a HEMI.  This is a big trick but the rules only allow 18 Gallons per minute......these old boys ran a lot more, to stay safe

And go fast, more like fly, guys figured out the GPM should at least be in the 20s.....
Now know this,,,I have pushed little fuelers over 243 MPH on 16 GPM......into to the 6-0s on around 16 Gal per min,,,,,,so imagine the potential here.

Fast  FORD guys back then knew a FORd made power so she wanted to be fed and fly.  One of the best ran a huge amount of fuel through his Nitro SOHC

Yes, the car is illegal for heritage, but we run anything we want at EAGLE FIELDS and this guy did run at Bakersfield, a bit, and Pomona, on a light load. It is great that across America many local tracks are run what ya brung to some extent...love it.  If you blow it, you own it ....kind of deal,,,,takes courage kind of?

Tonight's ear breaker was on around 75% nitro...and boy she sounded fierce, too fat, but stout.

This 427 was belching fuel out those low swept zoomies,,,and kickling up flames a giid 3 feet above the ends in random fashion.....just enough to see at dusk,,,very cool

And LOUD man,,,,,wake the dead loud

Another little fact guys forget, this car ran a single disc LONG/FORD clutch....yes sir, one heavy duty solid disc was the norm then,,,and it is in the car again. 

KUDOS to the gang..

We fired 4 blown fuelers at a party thing,,,,fun....

On other news, Baneys son was at this deal and the plan was for the awesome SHELBY blown fuel Super Snake to do a burnout tonight,,,,,,the date has changed but the engine runs great,,,,,make huge power and it is coming soon

Thanks

Tom and friends

PS- I have a spare blown wedge blower manifold if anybody has the itch.....haha   brand new too




fekbmax

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Re: Blown Fuel 427 Wedges alive and cackling
« Reply #1 on: June 11, 2016, 11:24:45 PM »
Makes me get the blower bugg again, ..uggh.
Keith.  KB MAX Racing.

HolmanMoodyStroppeGang

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Re: Blown Fuel 427 Wedges alive and cackling
« Reply #2 on: June 12, 2016, 08:31:58 AM »
I hear ya Kieth...IMHO....hilarious.   What is fun is the simple facts, to us.  If you get the hard parts, they all have value as a functioning piece and they live a long time. 

So if you build a blown FE and kill the block, the rest of the parts are still worth plenty and you just sell them some day.

The front cover and gear drive here, for example, 50 years old and ready for many more years of fun.  The huffer(blower), cheap piece.  I buy and sell the old blowers, my cost, for around 600 bucks.  No billet case and rotors needed is the point.  Besides,you want to stay period(old style, so you just strip a stock 6-71 and add the cool old 60s end plates)  These parts are easy to score, like the CRAGAR cover, Tri plate, and so on.

Look at the hat( The injector scoop or bug catcher).  It is a simple ENDERLE shower head hat.  A new one is in the 1,000 buck range to me.  I have the identical hat off of a Ford drag Team car we pushed to 227 MPH decades ago. Still made new for under a thou..once your done running the FE car, you sell the stuff and break even. Point is, we wish more guys would get back in to supercharged FE's. It is not that hard if you have friends and an old tune up book.

Now my hat is original from 66-7...it is so easy that I wish more guys had fun with blown Fe's.  This was hidden on purpose but to help guys think it through,,,,the fuel system on the old school Fe's is a simple as could be. Now to help share and have fun, this guy is easy to think through on the fuel system.  Think dual quads.

A current Heritage or Nostalgia blown fuel, blown Ally, or gas wedge or HEMI, always needs 16 nozzles for a range of reasons.  For a range of reasons, largely tune-ability and precision, we run 8 hat nozzles and 8 port nozzles.  There are tricks, many, earned over decades, but basically, each port nozzle adjusts the power and heat in each hole, since that nozzles sprays toward each intake valve. I have adjusted the size over 15 steps to get the flame patterns right. Upstairs, in the hat, or injector,, on top of the roots, you have 2 styles of fuel use.  Many just have 4 nozzles per side, pointed at the blowers rotors, wetting and cooling the blower pretty evenly to cool and seal the lobes...and rotor strips. 

What is trick is moving them around, forward and back, and sizing them, to compensate for the fuel distribution changes that occur when the car launches very hard.  Not the plan here, this car smoked the hides out of the hole...and has NO hat nozzle plate you notice.

This car has NO port nozzles either.   Now ponder that from the stand point of simplicity?  This tough Hombre had a Shower Head Hat.

For cats who forgot the old trick recall this.  All through the early 60s ENDERLE used 2 side mounted fittings on the left side of the bug catcher. 2 rubber hoses come from the barrel valve, hook to a 90 tapped into the side of the hat(bug catcher, injector), and the fittings have a brass tube that curves a gentle sweep to a soldered little nozzle with 4 holes in it.  Thus the name, shower head.  You run 2 of them, each has the holes sized to spray evenly down to the blowers rotors, and that is it.

!,500 horses pretty basically, for example, and no jets or nozzles or orifices to play with. You just move the other adjustments like the pill(bypass jet).

So think dual quads,,,you tune for power with 8 main jets, right?  Same deal in the mid 60s...you tuned with 2 little shower heads, that have 4 tiny holes each. 8 holes total, like dual quads,,,8 jets.  All even and easy. And teeny for fuel injection.

So basically it is simple to set up an FE for power to push a light car safely in to the 7's and even high 6's historically.

If you are not trying to run 550s and 560s, which we do all day long with 16 nozzles, a 3 disc clutch and a huge mag,much more static compression, great HEMI heads,etc,  you can revert back to the 60s stuff. 

As we shared on the old forum, and with emails to the many fine friends we made here and there, a 390 and a 406 wedge did a ton of good work in the Dragster classes early on.  Even stock FORD rods flew in some blown gas cars.

What is a key thing is how extra low the compression is set here.  The slugs are a whopping 300 down...or .300 below the deck, and bath tubbed a lot to boot.  Standard for the higher power old blown cars is 200 down and a flat top or slight dome.  5 to 1 is in the white gas, model T low range !  haha,,,,but trick here to run more blower boost, and be easier on the parts and allow more fuel in the hole to light

Some of the fastest and most reliable SOHCS that won back then, also ran lower than normal static(compression ratio) too.   7 to 1 was low then, many SOHCS on fuel competed there....others, 8 to 1, but others did great below 7-1,,,,more in the 6-1 range which is a cool tuning anecdote from the past.

Less base compression opens the door to using more blower speed, overdrive and fuel.

2 basic ways to build power on fuel, less blower and more static compression,,,,or less compression so you run more boost and send more fuel with it,,,

Also notice, for fun....stock valvetrain and oiling pieces too.

Stock truck oil pan here, stock oil pump,,,,and,,,uh hum,,,(running joke) a lowly (joke) standard Ford hex drive ?  Everybody ran the FORD drives reliably then. Won all the time with that little tested FORD tough part...      And the old FORD standard, not high volume oil pump sending straight visc 70 Weight to the oiling system.

Also, stock FORD adjustable rocker arms, and, no 'oil mods'...ie, no restrictions to the heads.  Stock rocker shafts, no end stands and if done in harmony, and this special grind cam is key, the old FE parts went 180-190-200 MPH reliably.     Good pushrods help of course...ISKY was early to this platform and a huge help then. So were the SMITH brothers, HOWARD and CROWER of course..     Also, the stock springs coaxing the rocker arms to stay home, no spacers and shims is the point.

If you are spinning her modern style, all is needed, but then, and now, if you stay in a safe RPM range and run boost, a bunch of original parts do fine. Simple point and not to offend a soul, honest.    No windage tray needed, standard crossbolts and Ford main caps is fine, and of course, FORD main bolts last forever.   FORD bolts holding the rocker shafts down too. No tin shields and stock FORD steel valve covers,,,,isn't that a pretty sight?  Now this car did end up running the old M/T cast covers later, they do make servicing her fast a bit easier, so some day we may find them a pair...cool

Point to the above is, back then, a lot of guys did more with less and ran a lot of FORD parts to save money and because a lot of stock FORD stuff is tough if not abused and in a happy state, balance wise. Load wise. Stress wise.

More soon guys, email me any time

A blown FE wedge is pretty straight forward and so is blown gas, even a blown pump gasser makes a bunch of power, easy.

And the cast FORD cranks did real well for a long time too...surprising how strong FE parts are if the whole engine is in sync and happy, or matched logically and tuned well. GO FORD

Thanks so much

PS; Jay, I sent you an essay that we all added to to say, LOVE YOUR PLANS TO MAKE HEADS AND BLOCKS !!  Let is know if we can be of any assistance and we look forward to running the stuff...you are awesome sir


Next,,,I have to share a book that we all worked on in 70-72. By our pal Ak Miller. We did the dyno work and many of the builds. Took pictures at HMS and so on. It is called, how to Supercharge a big block Ford.  Long out of print, but we did a lot of turbo FE's and blown FEs, with a Paxton and a Roots(4-71 or 6-71)

The lightly puffed FE's ran around town and were a very reliable platform that lived fine.

And a heavy door car can really haul when you force feed a FE on good gas.

And the good old iron FE heads made a ton of power without a lot of fuss and were very strong under tremendous cylinder pressures. No head studs needed too..
« Last Edit: June 12, 2016, 08:57:24 AM by HolmanMoodyStroppeGang »

4twennyAint

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Re: Blown Fuel 427 Wedges alive and cackling
« Reply #3 on: June 12, 2016, 11:52:52 AM »
Thanks for sharing all of this.  Totally awesome.
1969 Torino Cobra, SCJ 4.30, 4spd under restoration
1964 Fairlane, 428, 4spd, 4.10, 11.63@119 race trim
1966 Fairlane GTA, 482, C6, 3.50, 11.66@117 street trim

BH107

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Re: Blown Fuel 427 Wedges alive and cackling
« Reply #4 on: June 12, 2016, 09:28:31 PM »
I looked that car over at CHRR last year. It looks great, but it was interesting that it just had 68 390 heads...Thats gotta choke it down some even with the forced induction. Can't image all those trick internal parts and then skimping on 390 head castings.

machoneman

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Re: Blown Fuel 427 Wedges alive and cackling
« Reply #5 on: June 13, 2016, 06:20:45 AM »
Way cool!  ;D
Bob Maag

HolmanMoodyStroppeGang

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Re: Blown Fuel 427 Wedges alive and cackling
« Reply #6 on: June 13, 2016, 04:55:13 PM »
Right back at ya, nice Hot Rod you have there !

HolmanMoodyStroppeGang

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390 GT heads are fine because,,,she's force fed
« Reply #7 on: June 13, 2016, 05:19:06 PM »
Hello BH

On a normally aspirated FE, that head is fine stretched mildly past the OEM power level, and we were early to increase the valve sizes to the CJ , or larger valves, and then fully port them.

Here we have a different thing,,,,a lot of boost,   So it is like this, 2 things to bear in mind

1) An open plenum blower manifold delivers fuel and air, every 90 degrees to the cylinders, by, migrating the fuel/air charge down the firing order,,,1542   63   78      If you draw a plan and watch the distance the fuel/air travels, it goes 1 to its neighbore, 5, then all the way back to 4, back most of the way forward for 2, sideways to 6 and so on......7 and 8 often communicate due to fuel puddling on the floor of the intake

A goal is to maintain charge homogeneity,,,,,all engines like that, a fine, well mixed fuel air mix...

So how can we decrease fuel separation, and spped up the charge?  Reduce the port or valve size.  Kind of like a hose and a high pressure nozzle on the end.

The high pressure nozzle speeds up the flow to the point where the port stalls, and often, helps mix the fuel

Next thing is this,  NITRO, is unlike race gas(Except the new franken fuels) in that it bears or brings along it's own Oxygen.  So here, you have an intake valve that is smaller than a cammer, sure, it is not 2 1/4, it is 390 ish, 2 1/32 or 2 3/32 basically but guess what?

From about 1960, until today, the 354 and 392 Dodges, and the 417 Donovan, which is a better version of a 392 pushrod HEMI, flew, flat flew, with the famous 2 and 2 combo.

The heads used to win all of those races, in Funny car, and Dragster were DONOVAN stainless valves, for fuel use, and you sized the heads to have a 2 '' intake, and a 2 '' exhaust.   A 2'' intake valve, in an iron head, or a alloy one, later, went 200 MPH, then 210, 220, 230.  and beyond.   Shucks, we pushed a 392 with 354 heads and 2 by 2's, over 234 MPH 15 years ago at the reunion.

I recall 2 and 2's getting to around 239 MPH in the 1/4 so these heads have potential due to the blower, fuel, and use.

I understand how you feel.

We must note, to the SOHCS legendary status, and all of those records and wins,,,,,,by 1965-6, the cammers huge ports, huge intake valves, that were super light, and the SOHC cam genius, the FE started mowing the Dodge bows over, 1 by 1.  As we shared elsewhere,,,,,,wwhen a Dodge was close to hurting itself around 7000 to 7500 RPM, thise cammers would charge past them out the back door, winging it 8500 to 9000 all day long

You are definietly on to something though, one huge trick to get the modern Nostalgia engines down in to the 550s, and up to around 270 MPH,,,,,is abandoning the 2 by 2's.  20 years ago, we developed a 2 1/4, titanium, 5/16 stem intake package, with a 1.94 exhaust, flowed them again and again, ran them and quickly started beating a lot of guys,

These style heads, at only 397 CID, well,,,this is kind of secret,,,,but what the heck, you guys shoot for this number some day, and we'll all laugh.

I have helped spin a little 397,,,,,around 10,500 RPM

550 ish lift,,,,strong steel rollers, fat ISKY pushrods, stock style iron DONOVAN rocker arms,,,great springs,,,3 coils,,,titanium retainers, 10 deg locks, etc

Always fun

The 390 406 heads ran on fuel in the ealry 60s, in a Dragmaster or K88 style chassis,,,,a short rail, well over 200 on a good day

Nice question, lets go burn some FE's down on fuel soon

We seriously believe that we could get a 390, with billet caps probably, a good crank, big rods, etc, to 230 MPH with some work....

Many of us would love to hand that back to a few old 'magazine' guys that labelled a 390, well, not so fast..WRONG...HAHA.....Just do it up FORD Hi Po style,,,,

Kindly

T