Author Topic: 3rd MSD pick-up bad in as many years...  (Read 13666 times)

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Barry_R

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Re: 3rd MSD pick-up bad in as many years...
« Reply #30 on: June 09, 2017, 08:34:55 PM »
Boy I remember them days...
Ya got one of them big yellow coils too? 
And some Hush Thrush header mufflers hanging from your headers by dog chains?

I gotta go and fill up my Gabriel HiJackers & flip the air cleaner lid...its Friday night!

FElony

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Re: 3rd MSD pick-up bad in as many years...
« Reply #31 on: June 09, 2017, 08:38:10 PM »
A lot of the Procomp stuff isn't even usable from the start, so not comparable. The amount of MSD stuff out there is staggering, and like most things, we hear about the issues more than the non-issues, but it does bare watching if a trend is starting.

The real problem with PC parts is that the thousands of people running them successfully never want to speak up because they fear ridicule from others. So, I think they qualify more for that issue/non-issue thing than MSD. Ya wanna bet that some of the same or similar job shops in China make parts for both? Ya wanna bet that's the problem with the modules?

FElony

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Re: 3rd MSD pick-up bad in as many years...
« Reply #32 on: June 09, 2017, 08:47:54 PM »
Boy I remember them days...
Ya got one of them big yellow coils too? 
And some Hush Thrush header mufflers hanging from your headers by dog chains?

I gotta go and fill up my Gabriel HiJackers & flip the air cleaner lid...its Friday night!

Yep, Accel coil and dual point and "race" breaker points. Holley blue pump and DP. Gabriel Hi-Jackers, Ansen Ground Grabbers. Never an issue with any of that. No air cleaner lid, though. Blue anodized velocity stack; best working solution.

People are too lazy to maintain points. Plus, they fear being ostracized from their social circles if caught with a feeler gauge on their key chain. But not me, because I fear nothing. Or, because I have no social circle.

thatdarncat

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Re: 3rd MSD pick-up bad in as many years...
« Reply #33 on: June 09, 2017, 11:03:11 PM »
There has also been a thread about MSD quality going on the Moparts forum ( I lurk there occasionally to catch Mopar Billy's Dragweek stories ), nothing really that helps Doug's issue, but apparently the quality issue, Chinese parts, and what is and isn't made in the USA is coming up enough that MSD has put out a press release. I will note that this info from MSD was posted in 2010, so may or may not be out of date. I copied and pasted the reply from MSD below. If you want to go to the full thread on Moparts here's the link:

 http://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/2294043/all/msd-quality.html


-------------------------------------------

Racers, we would like to set the record straight on a few of these ‘built off-shore’ claims. This is one of those subjects that could go on and on, but we’ll try to keep it short and sweet and to the point.

MSD was developed and born in El Paso 40 years ago. We have grown to encompass over 150,000 square feet of space to design, test, manufacture, and support our components. We have engine dynos, chassis dynos, CNC equipment, an EDM machine to cut molds, wave solder machines, surface mount pick and place equipment, and more tools and capabilities to aid us in MANUFACTURING the best ignition components available. We are comprised of just under 300 employees – with the average seniority of 12 years! No other manufacturer can even come close to that kind of commitment from its employees.

Every 7-Series, 8-Series, Pro Mag and most 6-Series Ignitions are designed, built, tested, and supported in the USA. We say ‘most’ on our 6-Series because there are two models that do incorporate a half populated PCB from overseas. In El Paso, we populate the rest of the raw and power components, assemble it, test, burn it in and package it.

Yes, some coils, such as the Blaster 2, are made overseas. One reason is there are no oil filled canister style coil manufacturers in the United States. All MSD coils are made to our specifications and thoroughly tested. Also, the coils for the Pro Mag 12s and 44s, the HVC line of coils and our multiple spark LS coils are all made in the United States.

One area that we offer caution, especially when purchasing used or through the internet, is with Distributors. MSD designed the Pro-Billet distributor and now you are seeing complete copies of our distributors coming from overseas. Even name-brand competitors are selling distributors that are copied from the original MSD design – some even with our part numbers! The distributor issue has become a predicament for MSD as we still get the tech calls, the upset customers, and even some returns of these off-shore duplicate distributors.

We could go on with other products in our line such as the 8.5mm Super Conductor, APS Starters, Crank Triggers (all made in the USA), but want to keep it short. It is important to mention our budget based line, Street Fire. This is line offers several distributors, easily identified with cast housings, as a budget based brand. The distributors are produced in China, however it took over a year to get a product that we were confident in. We put them under a different brand to clearly set the two designs apart. For the record, there is also a Street Fire CD ignition and spark plug wires as well – both made in the USA.

Face it, anything having to do with electronics is a tough business to be in with hundreds of raw material components, and it’s nearly impossible to build a product out of 100% USA components. You can be assured that if you do have an MSD coil that is made in China or in the United States, we will stand by its performance and provide you with the same support as any other MSD products.

We’ll see you at the races -

Russell Stephens
President
MSD Ignition
El Paso, TX
« Last Edit: June 09, 2017, 11:06:20 PM by thatdarncat »
Kevin Rolph

1967 Cougar Drag Car ( under constuction )
1966 7 litre Galaxie
1966 Country Squire 390
1966 Cyclone GT 390
1968 Torino GT 390
1972 Gran Torino wagon
1978 Lincoln Mk V

FElony

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Re: 3rd MSD pick-up bad in as many years...
« Reply #34 on: June 10, 2017, 10:27:26 AM »
Well, as you said, that proclamation is seven years old, so who knows. However, it also brings up the possibility that someone is producing counterfeit ignition modules. Maybe Doug got a couple? It would be good to contact MSD about this and see what they say. They seem to have had a good attitude towards fixing out-of-warranty boxes, so maybe he can send his failed parts in and see what they do.

fryedaddy

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Re: 3rd MSD pick-up bad in as many years...
« Reply #35 on: June 10, 2017, 11:12:29 AM »
Well, as you said, that proclamation is seven years old, so who knows. However, it also brings up the possibility that someone is producing counterfeit ignition modules. Maybe Doug got a couple? It would be good to contact MSD about this and see what they say. They seem to have had a good attitude towards fixing out-of-warranty boxes, so maybe he can send his failed parts in and see what they do.
i heard from a reliable source that the msd boxes are counterfeited  so beware where you buy yours at.
1966 comet caliente 428 4 speed owned since 1983                                                 1973 f250 ranger xlt 360 4 speed papaw bought new

cjshaker

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Re: 3rd MSD pick-up bad in as many years...
« Reply #36 on: June 10, 2017, 11:25:02 AM »
I watched that video a few times.... something is funky there. I did the same test with mine and it worked. I'd be curious to hear one of the MSD tech guys explain that one. Makes me wonder about that wire running to your box though. Have you checked the continuity of it? Are the plugs on each end in good shape? I'm sure MSD has tens of thousands of those little plugs in service, but they sure look cheesy to me. Like a bad connection waiting to happen.

I agree that it's weird, and it might be hard to believe if it weren't for the video. All the connections are checked, double checked and even replaced last year, including the box. But I think you're right, I need to speak with MSD and see if they have an answer for me about it. I have a feeling that they're just going to say I have a bad connection or some other issue with my wiring. But I assure you, my wiring is 100% solid with good connections.



A lot of the Procomp stuff isn't even usable from the start, so not comparable. The amount of MSD stuff out there is staggering, and like most things, we hear about the issues more than the non-issues, but it does bare watching if a trend is starting.

Kevin, I agree that there are TONS of MSD products out there working fine and with no issues. That's why I have to believe, at least for now, that this is just a fluke.

The last time this happened, it was heat related, which is why it took me so long to track it down. Every time the car cooled down for a while, it started fine. I could drive it for miles, then suddenly I could feel a miss. Then, total shut-down. I'd drag the car home, which gave it time to cool off, then it would start and run fine. Repeat and repeat again, until it finally gave up for good one day in the parking lot at work.

I've also considered the fact that the last 2 times it's happened, it was while the car was parked at work...and that maybe I just need to avoid work ;D
Doug Smith


'69 R-code Mach 1, 427 MR, 2x4, Jerico, 4.30 Locker
'70 F-350 390
'55 Ford Customline 2dr
'37 Ford Coupe

Heo

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Re: 3rd MSD pick-up bad in as many years...
« Reply #37 on: June 10, 2017, 02:13:45 PM »
Its a sign...retire



The defenition of a Gentleman, is a man that can play the accordion.But dont do it

FERoadster

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Re: 3rd MSD pick-up bad in as many years...
« Reply #38 on: June 10, 2017, 05:57:36 PM »
This just for looks but the one I'm using on my 427 Stroker.
 It's the one on the right. No worries about module failures with these things.
Just not too sure about cars driving next to me and interference in their electronics.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2017, 06:09:54 PM by FERoadster »

BattlestarGalactic

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Re: 3rd MSD pick-up bad in as many years...
« Reply #39 on: June 13, 2017, 07:51:16 AM »
Did you check continuity on the old pickup?  I'm betting the heat is just getting to the cheap plastic body, expanding and breaking a wire.  Nothing much more to them.

Had a friend loose a pickup when unloading his race car.  Ran fine at home, got out of trailer, Nope.  Jumped the white wire and sparked.  I asked if he had an extra pickup?  Nope.  He ran to Summit(hour away), told him to get TWO!!!

Thus all the reason I still leave the points in the black car.  With having to move the blower to get the cap off, I don't want to deal with it.  Besides cheapo condenser dying on me, the points last a decent time and likely not leave me stranded on the side of the road(I hope).
Larry

Falcon67

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Re: 3rd MSD pick-up bad in as many years...
« Reply #40 on: June 13, 2017, 09:13:26 AM »
Well, as you said, that proclamation is seven years old, so who knows. However, it also brings up the possibility that someone is producing counterfeit ignition modules. Maybe Doug got a couple? It would be good to contact MSD about this and see what they say. They seem to have had a good attitude towards fixing out-of-warranty boxes, so maybe he can send his failed parts in and see what they do.

Also, that was before MSD was purchased by Holley.  Buy outs require money and the people backing the buy out expect a return to pay down the debt.  I can tell you from experience, how that gets done can be a huge source of contention inside a company that has a history of doing things a certain way, and now has suits  in the conference room that just flew in to tell them "here are your cost projections and here's where you need to be, get there."  Unsaid but understood is the part about we have people that can get the numbers there if you can't.

cjshaker

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Re: 3rd MSD pick-up bad in as many years...
« Reply #41 on: June 13, 2017, 11:17:03 PM »
Did you check continuity on the old pickup?  I'm betting the heat is just getting to the cheap plastic body, expanding and breaking a wire.  Nothing much more to them.

Thus all the reason I still leave the points in the black car.  With having to move the blower to get the cap off, I don't want to deal with it.  Besides cheapo condenser dying on me, the points last a decent time and likely not leave me stranded on the side of the road(I hope).

Larry, the previous one that intermittently kept failing, kept fooling me that way. It always checked fine, but that was after the car had sat and cooled for a while. On it's final failure, after I trailered it home, it checked open...BINGO! I haven't checked this one yet, but I will, and suspect it may check ok, but I know it's bad from it starting immediately after dropping the spare distributor in. Not only will I have a spare distributor with me from now on, I'll have another spare pick-up to throw in if needed. It's a little sad I need to think that way. I've actually considered making up a points distributor just for driving and cruising and using the MSD just for track use. It's easy to swap them out, and I can mark them both with proper timing settings for easy drop-in. If it happens again.....


Also, that was before MSD was purchased by Holley.  Buy outs require money and the people backing the buy out expect a return to pay down the debt.  I can tell you from experience, how that gets done can be a huge source of contention inside a company that has a history of doing things a certain way, and now has suits  in the conference room that just flew in to tell them "here are your cost projections and here's where you need to be, get there."  Unsaid but understood is the part about we have people that can get the numbers there if you can't.

Bingo, Chris. In a nutshell, nothing good comes from buy-outs, despite the promises.
Doug Smith


'69 R-code Mach 1, 427 MR, 2x4, Jerico, 4.30 Locker
'70 F-350 390
'55 Ford Customline 2dr
'37 Ford Coupe