Making a 410 and other questions

[Bolted to Floor]

Hi Guys,
I need some help. What I have is a .060 390 that was pulled from a ¾ ton truck years ago. I had a low buck rebuild done about 8 years ago, it’s been sitting on the engine stand ever since. Read as never started.  The only thing I know about the cam is it’s there.  The D2TE heads are still on it. The hardened seats were already installed. I drilled the exhaust port for the Cobra Jet pattern.  Valves are still original size and no port work has been done. The pistons are 381P’s. According to a Google search, this piston is for the truck 390 with the 8. something compression and a 1.66 compression distance. What I want to do is install the crank I pulled out of a 410 I found at a pick a part in the early 90’s. I can’t say there was anything wrong with the rest of the engine; I just wasn’t smart enough to buy the whole thing. 
I did some measuring tonight. Using a dial indicator, I found top dead center. I used a dial caliper to measure down from the deck to the piston top. I did this on both end cylinders with a result of .140 to .150. I don’t know if this is the correct way to take the measurement, but I did find one you tube video that used the same method.  If my thought process is correct, swapping cranks would increase stroke by.200. The piston will rise .100 higher in the hole and but still be .040 to .050 down from the deck. Yes,No? For intakes, I have the cast iron T manifold from the truck motor and a low rise 2x4. Would a Performer RPM be a better choice, seemed to be the best all around manifold in Jay's book?
This will be going in a 67 Mustang Coupe with a TKO 600. I have the FPA headers already. The car will have power steering and AC.
Is this going to push me to a 10 to 1 or higher compression? My concerns are over heating due to compression and thin cylinder walls. What would be a good cam choice using hydraulic lifters and keep enough vacuum for power brakes? I’m good with a 6000 max RPM. It would be nice to keep expenses to a minimum for now; I have dreams of a more cubic inches and better heads several years down the road when I have more cubic dollars.
Thanks to the forums, I now know that there is a mismatch on the exhaust ports and the headers, which causes problems with keeping them sealed. Using the gaskets from FPA which match the headers, the exhaust port floor is about a 1/8” lower. There appears to be plenty of material left for a seal, but does the mismatch cause the gasket to be burned out? It seems like the exhaust gas would follow the roof of the port around and out of the cylinder.  Thanks for any help yall can offer.

As for how much HP and torque, I would like more than the low compression 390 would offer.

[My427stang]

I would expect you to be between 9.3 and 9.7 depending where the chambers come in and which gasket you use.  I don't know what the relief and dish size is, but those two numbers are for 4 cc and 8 cc, which I'd expect you'd land somewhere near.

I think your headers may be an issue, CJ bolt pattern headers have a higher exhaust port, and if you have the correct GT headers, they wont have a CJ bolt pattern.  May want to check on that.  FPA made both, and they don't interchange, GT flanges work with D2 heads.  It's the luck of the draw if they will leak or not, but it isn't right.  I have sealed C8s (same head design) using Hookers, but just barely

I'd probably run a 280H or XE274H from Comp, either will work great.  The T manifold will be a dog, any dual quad is cool, but I think if you are going on a budget, sell off the dual quad and buy an RPM and a 750, the combo will be a nice match

[Joe-jdc]

When you increase stroke, only half is up higher, so the piston would only come up .100" on the .200" stroke increase.  Joe-JDC.

[JimNolan]

You'll need to get everything balanced to use the 410 crank along with the flywheel and harmonic dampener. Since you have to do that, have your machinest deck the block about .010-.020 and the heads milled. Then you can use .020 steel shim gaskets. Depending on the cam you get you can bring the DCR down to a manageable level to run 87 octane gas with 10.5 CR. If you can keep the squish down below .050 you'll have a nice running engine. If you don't go too radical a cam you can still have 13 inches manifold vacuum at idle that will run a 8" dual diaphragm power brake booster. Just my take.

[Bolted to Floor]

Hey Guys,
Thanks for the advice and input.
I probable come across as cheap, which I am. But, I know you get what you pay for and quality cost money. Since my car is currently at the body shop undergoing a resurrection, I am looking at the motor upgrades in the most cost effective manner possible. A better motor can be done several years down the road. The car is a street cruiser, maybe a trip to the track. The TKO has the .64 fifth gear. Planning on a 3.50 gear and 245/45 17 tires.

I would expect you to be between 9.3 and 9.7 depending where the chambers come in and which gasket you use.  I don't know what the relief and dish size is, but those two numbers are for 4 cc and 8 cc, which I'd expect you'd land somewhere near.

I think your headers may be an issue, CJ bolt pattern headers have a higher exhaust port, and if you have the correct GT headers, they wont have a CJ bolt pattern.  May want to check on that.  FPA made both, and they don't interchange, GT flanges work with D2 heads.  It's the luck of the draw if they will leak or not, but it isn't right.  I have sealed C8s (same head design) using Hookers, but just barely

I'd probably run a 280H or XE274H from Comp, either will work great.  The T manifold will be a dog, any dual quad is cool, but I think if you are going on a budget, sell off the dual quad and buy an RPM and a 750, the combo will be a nice match

Ross, where can I find the idiots guide to help figure out the answers?
I was going to use the D2 heads since they were complete, but there ain’t enough space under the hood to be battling exhaust leaks. I have a bare set of C6AE-R’s that came with a motor I bought years ago. They‘ve been collecting dust ever since. Would they make a better choice? If so, an estimate for repairs vs a set of Edelbrocks will be in my future.
A new cam needs matching springs, right? A new timing chain and gears to advance or retard the cam? The RPM and a 750 (vacuum secondary or DP?) will be found somewhere. The dual quad will be shelved again for later days. 

When you increase stroke, only half is up higher, so the piston would only come up .100" on the .200" stroke increase.  Joe-JDC.

Joe, I did figured this out in the garage that night, but I scratched my head for a few minutes thinking it wouldn’t work, why have they said it will work, and then I saw the light!

You'll need to get everything balanced to use the 410 crank along with the flywheel and harmonic dampener. Since you have to do that, have your machinest deck the block about .010-.020 and the heads milled. Then you can use .020 steel shim gaskets. Depending on the cam you get you can bring the DCR down to a manageable level to run 87 octane gas with 10.5 CR. If you can keep the squish down below .050 you'll have a nice running engine. If you don't go too radical a cam you can still have 13 inches manifold vacuum at idle that will run a 8" dual diaphragm power brake booster. Just my take.

I was going to get a 428 flywheel and harmonic balancer to go with the crank. I will have to start checking on machine work and see what works out best. It’s time to go Googling for squish/quench to get a better understanding. Not much on decking block and heads or a 10.5 CR. It gets hot in Houston and I think it will be hard enough to keep the car cool without more compression. 

[glxi390]

Hey, I'm another guy that throws nickels around like manhole covers [I'm cheap]. I just finished doing what you're doing. Thirty over 390", 410 crank. I got mine balanced, didn't cost that much. Reasons were the difference in price and availability of the flywheel and balancer between the 390" and the 410"/428", knowing a balanced engine is a happier engine and the fact that any kind of vibration in a car I'm driving gets old real quick.

[My427stang]

You have what you need to check your headers.  Grab a ruler and/or the correct header gasket and compare them to the heads.  Using the vertical bolt holes on any of the ports, measure from the bottom bolt to the bottom to the port and the top bolt to the top of the port.  Then measure the headers to see where the sealing ring is on the flange (raised welded ring that pinches the gasket). 

The proper head / gasket / header combo will sandwich approx .200 - .250 of gasket material.  The wrong one will measure nice on top, bad on bottom, or vice versa

You could also take a header gasket that matches the headers (verify that it covers the entire sealing ring) and then put it on the head and look at how it matches the port, the wrong gasket/header combo will have an unsupported edge on the head

Not all C6AE-Rs, but many have a low roof and a high floor, which allows them to work with any header, D2s and C8s typically do not work with CJ FPAs or Hooker 6114s, but will work with GT FPAs.  So, it's important to measure what you have, in case you really have GT FPAs, then the D2s will work

[Bolted to Floor]

Its like you've been walking through my garage. I do have the Cobra Jet FPA's.  The bottom of the port is way low like you said on the D2's. The raised portion of the header flange has been ground almost smooth. Visually there is a raised flange, but not much more than catching a finger nail as you drag across it. This may work to my advantage. The other heads look to need too much work to make usuable. I think my money would be better spent on better heads a little later and deal with the exhaust leaks for now. Thanks for the help.

Here are some pics of what I found.





The rounded corners are the header ports, the squared lines and corners are the exhaust ports.