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Messages - DWKgalaxie

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1
FE Technical Forum / Re: Another one bites the dust. Cam lobe
« on: January 09, 2023, 12:19:21 AM »
Hi Guys,  I thought I'd let you know that the valves in these heads are 11/32"and are under cut. What Manley used to call race flow. The pushrods I was using and will probably use the same kind, but obviously shorter with this roller cam are Manton 3 Series 11/32 x.120 wall and again I am using Performance Quotient aluminum adjustable roller rockers, 1.75 ratio. I don't know how I could get the valve train weight down any lower, and it shouldn't need to be in my mind since this is a street motor that will get occasional bracket race use and I will try to keep it below say 58-5900 since these things are so fragile. It's kinda frustrating that all of you seem to thinks that obviously I had the wrong springs on there from Pro Maxx. Fine. I took those off, because everyone here was saying that they were too strong for the flat tappet cam and that is probably what killed the lifter. Again fine that's in the past now. But the springs I ordered are close to the numbers that Brent said at first would be best for a billet core hydraulic roller cam and Morel hydraulic roller lifters. Now it seems that you guys are telling me that these new springs are all wrong and there is no way to shim them to get the spring pressures to numbers that suit some of you. Where do I buy these magic springs that you guys are talking about? That will have the correct numbers at the open and closed measurements. I thought going to a cam manufacturer that had been around for decades and getting their recommendation for lifters and springs for this application to be used between say 2400 to 5700 rpm was a good idea. They have been making them longer than me and most anyone that I have talked to. Yes they don't "specialize" in FE engines but they have been making parts for them for quite sometime I would think. I live in north Alabama and there aren't a bunch of machine shops close and I can guarantee none of them that are within 150 miles are well versed in FE motors. The closest FE guy is Blair Patrick, he's just 45 miles away but I've never seen any of you guys mention him, and I don't know anything about him. For the most part I have built my own stuff and I've made maybe 1000 passes on the track thru the years and only floated a valve once to the point of piston contact and at that it didn't do anything but bend a valve and ding the piston enough to replace it. And I routinely turned those motors 6500-7000. Once again, I appreciate all the input, but I REALLY don't want to send my heads off to have them built.
 
Just for the sake of asking, how would I check the valve spring pressure with them installed? I just bought a tool to use in a vise or I used it in my press. It is a BCS gauges that reads from 0-1000 psi. Can I just get some shims and put them under the spring and put all that in the press with the tool and measure at the given heights? If so, That's easy.

I don't mean to sound angry or pissy here. I'm just a bit frustrated at spending a LOT of money on this and each time I order something I have to wait forever. And then when I get as close as I can find to what people say I should use and then they say OH NO you have the wrong parts.

Thanks again
Dave

2
FE Technical Forum / Re: Another one bites the dust. Cam lobe
« on: January 02, 2023, 08:57:28 PM »
Hi guys, Well after reading all your replies I have a lot more information. The spring number that I got from Howards was # 98632 double springs with no damper the rates they show for these are 145@1.94 closed and 422@ 1.25 open. These were the springs that were recommended by Eric Bolander western regional sales manger for Howards. He sounded like he had been doing this for a while, not just a blabber mouth salesman, and not like someone that had worked at AutoZone up until last week. The springs that were on the website were #98611 that spec'd at 145@1.88 closed and 350@1.25. I told him all the stuff I have in this motor and what I am planning to do with it. The numbers on the #98632 that I received are close to the numbers you guys are looking for, maybe a bit soft on the closed side according to Brent. So are you guys saying that I need to shim these springs a bit to raise the closed pressure? As far as vacuum goes, that we will have to see. You may be right, BUT I have run a cam with .262/.269 and .540 Int .560 Exh with 133 overlap in a 10.25 CR 427 Chevy with oval port heads and never really noticed a vacuum problem for the power brakes. So I'll just have to see, and maybe run a cannister for vaccum to help my booster if I have a problem there. The lifters that come with the Howard cam are Morel and you guys seem to like them, so I didn't think I had to worry there. I am planning to run 5W30 oil as Bolander told me that was a good idea and to expect a little lifter noise on crank up especially if it has been sitting for several days. I do appreciate all your input on this, and value your experience on this kind of engine. For some reason this particular air pump is a lot more difficult to build run and have last than a big block Chevy. I have built several of them. They are easy and easy to make good power with. My last bracket car was a 68 Camaro all steel and glass except the hood, .060 over 396 so 408, 100cc oval port closed chamber heads with a Comp solid flat tappet 11-604-5 256/266 294/304 adv dur 579/605 lift 12.3 CR Edelbrock Victor Jr port matched intake, Rons Fuel Flying Toilet on alcohol, TCI transbrake powerglide TCI 5000 converter, 12 bolt with Strange spool and axles and 488 Richmond gears. I built this all my self, the only thing I had done was having the valve job done to go up to 2.19/1.88 for the Manley race flow valves. This car ran 6.59@ 102 1/8th mile consistently. There was more in it, but I didn't feel the need to push this combo and I was limited to stock suspension with slapper bars. It was deadly consistent and that's what you look for. This Galaxie isn't my first hotrod. And neither was this Camaro. But I am being challenged by this FE build. I know by having been a Chevy guy it sets some of you on edge as does the fact that I bought ProMaxx heads. Well nobody and I mean nobody had any aluminum heads last year, or if they had them they wanted $3000 a piece for them IF you could get them to actually ship them, so I bought what I bought. I never dreamed that I would be a year into getting parts and finishing this motor. Honestly, I'm sick of it. But I have it, I love the body style and I really want to run it, but a lot of the fun has been taken out of it.

Again thanks for the help
Dave Keeton

3
FE Technical Forum / Re: Did Moroso ever make valve covers for the FE?
« on: January 02, 2023, 01:22:05 AM »
Maybe a set from Barry at Survival that were either anodized gold or powder coated gold would look pretty good.

4
FE Technical Forum / Re: Another one bites the dust. Cam lobe
« on: January 02, 2023, 12:37:25 AM »
Hey guys, First of all, thanks for all the replies and input. I appreciate that none of you really blasted me as sometimes happens in a forum. I like what you said Brent about the valve springs. I did single them up for break in. I did use break in oil but to be honest it was Jegs break in oil that is supposed to have all the ZDDP in it that you are supposed to need. Maybe that was part of it. All the lifters did rotate in the bores at any position. I made absolutely sure of that considering the age of this block. It didn't turn that much before firing on up. during break in I heard a pretty loud tapping at the rear of the passenger valve cover, I put a stethoscope to the valve cover, and I could feel that a rocker arm adjusting nut was barely hitting the baffle for the breather. I of course corrected that after I shut it down. It all seemed to be going well at that point. The next day, with the valve covers off, I checked to see if I had any rockers that had any lash or anything looked out of place. I didn't see anything wrong at this point. I pulled the rocker assys off and put back in the inside springs and set everything back to zero lash to fire it up again and adjust a bit on the timing and idle mixture. During this run as the minutes went along I heard a valve tick, like one was a bit loose. It didn't take long for that tick to turn into a loud clack so I shut it down. You are probably right Brent about too much spring pressure for a hydraulic flat tappet. I took the guy at ProMaxx's word that these springs were good for that kind of cam. On one lifter, just one, the intake on #2, the lifter wore  3/8" off the contact surface. The lifter would still spin in the bore. So, seeing this, out came the motor and trans. When I tore the motor down, all the lifters would come out the top but the bad one. It stayed in till the cam came out and I pushed it down and out. It wore all the way down into the spring inside the lifter. All the bearings had metal in them, and it killed the bearing surfaces of the crank. So I have another crank and bearings here, and I'm waiting on cam bearings.
   I also ordered a Howards Cams hydraulic roller, CL253385-10 cam and lifter kit, Adv Dur 288 int 294 ex 235@050 int and 241@050 ex .560/.560 lift LSA 110 Int CL 106. I also ordered their springs that Howards recommended #98632 that are 145@1.94 and 422 @1.25 pressures. I'll order my pushrods from either Trend or Manton. I realize a custom cam grind might give me a few more horsepower and more torque here or there, but since this is going to be a street car and occasional bracket car, it will be what it is. Again, I do appreciate all you guys giving me your input and expertise on this. I'll let you know how things go if I can ever get any parts here. I'm a retired partsman, 10 years in auto parts then 31 years at a Volvo truck dealership and getting parts now is a thousand times worse than our worst nightmare was before I retired in Jan 2020. I got out just in time. But it sure has made my hobby a pain in the butt.

Thanks again.

5
FE Technical Forum / Another one bites the dust. Cam lobe
« on: November 24, 2022, 12:45:28 AM »
Well, I got my 390 together and down it the car. .060 4.11 bore stock 390 crank and rods, ARP bolts thru out. DSS 5003-4110 10cc dish with 10.08 comp with 72cc heads. ProMaxx shocker 200 heads with 2.20 and 1.73 valves. Performer RPM intake and Performer RPM 800 carb. Now the problem. Edelbrock Performer RPM cam. This is a COMP CAM and lifters. I know I'm not the first, but I just had a cam lobe flatten out or the lifter failed and mushroomed out. Just one lobe that I can tell. The lifters will all slide up out of the bores easily except one. It comes up and stops just as the contact surface comes up to the bore in the block. Like a 400k mile old lifter. I went thru the break in process by the numbers. I have built several Chevy and Mopar motors thru the years and never had a cam break in problem. This is my first FE build, although I've had four before, just never put a cam in one. This really sucks. I guess its time to pull it all the way down with all new bearings, disassemble the roller rocker shafts and inspect them. Maybe even look at the rod bushings. Do you think that I am just one of the many many to be bitten by these COMP CAMS defects they are putting out? Any suggestions for a replacement ROLLER cam and lifters and pushrods with around the same specs as the Performer RPM cam that is 296 Adv int/exh 236 @.050 Duration 572 lift int/exh with 108 LSA 103 int centerline. I understand using the 128 rule that the 108 LSA should be correct for me. This is going in a 64 Galaxie fastback with a TCI streetfighter C6 and a TCI breakaway 2400 converter. I will be running 3.89 gears. I know, a bunch of questions. But any thoughts or ideas would be great. Thanks

6
FE Technical Forum / Re: Best valve cover gasket
« on: November 24, 2022, 12:16:15 AM »
I am using the REAL GASKETS now. I put a thin bead of Permatex Ultra Black on the valve covers, that are fabricated aluminum, and a bead at each end around the "U". I am using studs and nuts. These are going on Pro Maxx heads and Edelbrock performer RPM intake. I'm still fighting a small leak on both lower corners at the rear. No problem at the front or at the intake/head junction. So, not satisfied with them. I might try Brents suggestion.

7
FE Technical Forum / Re: 2.20 1.73 valves in 4.08 bore 390
« on: February 27, 2022, 08:13:56 PM »
Those pics are great! Thanks Ross My427stang. I'm hopeful mine will clear by as much.

Dave

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FE Technical Forum / Re: 2.20 1.73 valves in 4.08 bore 390
« on: February 24, 2022, 11:21:44 PM »
That's some good info to work with. Thanks Nightmist66. The head gaskets they recommend are FelPro 1020 that are .041 thick. Ok, blast away. Everyone always has different opinions on head and intake gaskets based on hard learned experience. I've owned 5 FE motors but this is the first I've been into. I've been into a bunch of small and big block Chevys and always ran FelPro with good results. But that's apples and oranges, I know. From what you said head gasket thickness will help with the interference issue compared to no gasket, which makes sense, so .041 thickness may help some. These are 72cc heads and the pistons I will be running are dish top that are supposed to end up with 10.3 compression. I don't need any more than that, which is about stock, on this street and sometimes bracket car.
Thanks again
Dave

9
FE Technical Forum / Re: 2.20 1.73 valves in 4.08 bore 390
« on: February 24, 2022, 09:48:11 PM »
For these shocker 200 FE heads, the flow chart they have now shows for .600 lift, 331cfm intake and 254 cfm exh flow. But you are correct, it doesn't really, specifically say if these numbers are for the 2.09/1.66 or 2.20/1.73 valves. For advertising purposes you would think they would show numbers for the larger valves as they would be bigger numbers. I guess where I am now in this, I need to go ahead and order the 445 kit and put one cylinder together to find out where the top ring travels to, so that I can notch the bore, after I've had this block cleaned bored, blah blah blah, and it is ready for this hand fitting. Ahh if it was easy anyone and everyone would be running an FE. Oh, and on the subject you mentioned if the the valves have the wider MR spacing, I don't know how to check that other than just measure from the top of the intake stem to the top of the exh stem, center to center. I don't know that spec, and I can guarantee Jason at ProMaxx will not either. If you or anyone knows that spec, I'd love to know, so that I can check.

Thanks again for your reply and all the info. You really have been a big help.
Dave

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FE Technical Forum / Re: 2.20 1.73 valves in 4.08 bore 390
« on: February 24, 2022, 05:39:58 PM »
Thanks guys, that info is of some help. I did measure with a digital caliper across the intake and exhaust valves and that distance is 4.05". So by over boring to 4.08 or 4.09 that allows for clearance, BUT when I take into account the amount of offset that the centerline is offset then the problem may show up. Knowing that grinding the bore is ok, of course not going below where the top ring travels, that puts my mind somewhat at ease. Since I am only planning to run .588 exh lift I am also hopeful that I won't have the interference issues that more lift could cause. Thanks again for your replies, I'll let you know how it goes, and if I run into any issues with these ProMaxx heads that you guys have very varied opinions about. I understand all of your thoughts and feelings about buy pure American, I'm about as adamant as you are but these times of, we might as well say zero availability of a lot of parts, make us bend our rules a bit sometimes. Besides these guys are 55 miles from me, so if I have a problem I can talk with them in person, and I figure if they work out, I was at least helping the local guys feed their families that work with Jason at ProMaxx.

11
FE Technical Forum / 2.20 1.73 valves in 4.08 bore 390
« on: February 22, 2022, 08:08:15 PM »
I am building a 390 that I am planning to to a 445 Scat stroker kit in. I haven't pulled it down yet to see where it will clean up in the bore. The heads I have, and as everyone knows it's about impossible to get aluminum heads, are ProMaxx shocker 200 with 2.20 intake and 1.73 exhaust valves. I am planning on running a Comp Cams 284H hyd flat tappet with .584 Int lift and .588 Exh lift. I have a set of PRW alum adjustable rockers 1.76 ratio. I was wondering if anyone thinks I am going to run into a valve to block interference issue? I saw a thread where it was discussed, but when I read it, it's as though I'm looking at a CIA document with some words redacted. It looks like Jay replied back in 2012, a couple times saying he had no clearance issues in a 4.08 bore. I don't recall him saying what lift he was using, but with the .584/.588 lift I plan on using, it looked like I was going to be ok since the lift was just this size. Some people have told me I had to go up to a 428 bore of 4.13 or 4.16 that the 462 scat stroker kit uses. Going that big of a bore in a 390 block probably means it will have to have sleeves in every hole. If it does look like there will be an issue, probably on the exhaust valve, which surprised me, does clearancing the the bore involve any more than very carefully grinding an area at the top of the bore, and I did see Jays comments on how far down to go, in a way that looks like GM did on there 396 big block? This is going to be a bracket/street car 64 Galaxie fastback. I would appreciate any help you guys can give me on this.
Thanks, Dave

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