FE Power Forums
FE Power Forums => FE Technical Forum => Topic started by: blykins on March 10, 2020, 11:30:38 AM
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Got pushrods on the way, but should have this one buttoned up this week, hopefully to dyno next week.
Rules are the usual.....closest guess to corrected horsepower without going over wins some goodies.
*4.090" finished bore size, 4.250" stroke
*Scat 9000 series 4.250" crankshaft
*Scat 6.700" I-beam connecting rods
*Mahle pistons, 18cc dish, 1mm/1mm/2mm ring pack, 10.3:1 compression ratio
*Trick Flow cylinder heads, no tampering, dual valve springs, 150/400 spring pressure
*Performer RPM intake with some cartridge roll in the port openings, divider cut down
*Melling HV oil pump
*Canton 15-850 pan, deep front sump with oil control
*MSD distributor
*Powerbond balancer
*Harland Sharp shafts with Precision Oil Pumps end stands, center stands, and spacers
*Lykins Motorsports non-adjustable roller rocker arms
*Trend 5/16" .105" pushrods
*One of my custom hydraulic rollers, 231/239 @ .050", 114 LSA, 105 ICL, .630" lift
*Morel standard travel hydraulic roller lifters
*Quick Fuel HR-780 carburetor
*Tuff Stuff aluminum water pump
No front end dress on this one, so we will not be turning the water pump or any accessories on the dyno.
Happy guessing!
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Curious to see this one! Think I may be a little conservative. My # is corrected HP-Edited for later post inquiring.
537 HP
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639 hp Joe-JDC
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639 hp Joe-JDC
Joe, I think you fat-fingered a number there.
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447 cubic inches x 1.43 hp/ci for that compression ratio is not out of reason, and if the heads flow 310 cfm at .630" lift, that is in the ball park for horsepower potential. The ring pack is optimal, and roller lifters, etc., all should be low resistance. The only issue is the smallish carb and header choice for the pull. I am not a fan of cutting the divider down, and a 2" super sucker would be standing by, so I may be a little optimistic, but not by much. Joe-JDC
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447 cubic inches x 1.43 hp/ci for that compression ratio is not out of reason, and if the heads flow 310 cfm at .630" lift, that is in the ball park for horsepower potential. The ring pack is optimal, and roller lifters, etc., all should be low resistance. The only issue is the smallish carb and header choice for the pull. I am not a fan of cutting the divider down, and a 2" super sucker would be standing by, so I may be a little optimistic, but not by much. Joe-JDC
The heads actually go about 330 at that lift. However, FE's typically don't go 1.43 hp/ci in street form. Not on this dyno anyway.
Smallish cam because the guy needed lots of vacuum. Pretty mild build all around. I think you're gonna be off by about 100 hp.
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Hello Brent,
Any particular reason for the 123 degree ECL?
That very very early exhaust opening with that ECL will result in torque loss.
I guess that might be the trade off for high vacuum requirement the customer has?
Anyhow - I love these builds.
Is the HP guess un corrected? Or corrected?
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508
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That very very early exhaust opening with that ECL will result in torque loss.
Eh.....I wouldn't put a bet on that one.
I don't know how you would even make any kind of correlation there without knowing the advertised durations. I could put a more aggressive lobe on the exhaust side and delay the exhaust valve opening. I give you props on being able to calculate the ECL by using the ICL and the LSA, but it's really meaningless.
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If they are all over will I win guessing 1HP?
If not I guess 499.
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522
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548 HP, and I will add an additional guess, 554 for torque
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533HP
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What is 561 horsepower Alex
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558
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541hp...
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505
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Hello Brent,
Any particular reason for the 123 degree ECL?
That very very early exhaust opening with that ECL will result in torque loss.
I guess that might be the trade off for high vacuum requirement the customer has?
Anyhow - I love these builds.
Is the HP guess un corrected? Or corrected?
Not Brent, but I am not sure the ECL has the effect you think it does. Saying the early exhaust opening kills torque, can be correct in an academic argument, but a quick peruse of the dyno forum will show many of Brent's (and mine for that matter) That 445 should be a monster
I would assume Brent has a vacuum and/or idle requirement, that's why I do it when I have to
Some examples of mine, all in the dyno forum
461 all iron, CJ carbed - LSA 114 - 237/237 - 106 ICL - 536 ft lbs, 520 HP (15 inches of vac)
461 TFS head PI carbed - LSA 114 - 235/237 - 106 ICL - - 577 ft lbs, 568 HP (16 inches of idle vac)
461 Victor single plane Victor EFI truck engine, on carb - LSA 112, 230/236 - 106 ICL - only 9.75:1 - 554 ft lbs, 490 HP (at 5000) Didn't take vac readings
I agree in general you don't want to waste the power stroke with too early of a exhaust opening, but you are also gaining on the other end with better cylinder fill and little chamber dilution and good vacuum. This 445 should be a nice mellow monster
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534
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565 hp, 529 trq, corrected.
I wasn't going to guess but.........
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559 hp ans 536 Ft lb torque
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519
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Mike got mine.
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543hp
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537.5HP. This one's gonna breathe pretty good. Will you have time to try a bigger carb on the dyno? Just for grins. 780 seems smallish for the combo.
Edit: I missed HarleyJack's 537 guess. My bad.
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537HP. This one's gonna breathe pretty good. Will you have time to try a bigger carb on the dyno? Just for grins. 780 seems smallish for the combo.
The Quick Fuels come in a little larger than spec, but I'll probably have time to try something else.
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528 HP !!!
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549 hp is my guess
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477
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490
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554hp
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500
Pat
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I wanted 537 but there are two guesses at that number already. So I will go 538.
Didn't you use to run these contests with uncorrected numbers being the criteria? I'm in favor of that myself.
Thanks for keeping our minds engaged.
JB
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I switch it up to make things interesting.
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581
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Interesting, pretty similar build to what you provided me with Brent, except for the cam specs.
My SWAG is 532.
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565 hp
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Also similar build as my 445 you specked a cam for, going to GUESS 521 HP and 545 TQ.
Jose
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When is she going on Dyno Brent.
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This coming Friday if the weather cooperates.
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I'm in for 555. Hammer down!
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548 hp at 5500, 580 torque....
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Almost 1.4 hp per cube. I wasn't expecting that. Those heads are better than I thought. Nice job, Brent!
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My 549 HP guestimate was close!
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Almost 1.4 hp per cube. I wasn't expecting that. Those heads are better than I thought. Nice job, Brent!
Doug, hp/ci is 1.23. But they are good heads!
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My 549 HP guestimate was close!
Yep, just one over!
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The last contest I was one HP over as well - lol.
Almost as if it was on purpose.
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It was 547.67 hp, which rounds up to 548. Not on purpose, but I'll send you some decals if it makes you feel better.
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Missed by 10, had 558
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Impressive
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It was a good day. Didn't get to try a bigger carburetor that someone wanted me to try, but we tried a lot of other things. A 1" Super Sucker didn't add one single number to the peak hp or torque, but it added 10 average hp and about 10 average torque.
Going from 32° timing to 30° dropped about 20 hp. Going from 32° to 34° added a few ponies over the 32°.
Peak hp was at 5500, but only dropped 5 hp at 6000.
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I guessed 777 hp. Good thing I didn't type that out loud, 'cuz I sure would feel like a dummy if anyone knew.
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777 would have been bang on if the air way better.... like a cloud of nitrous.
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777 would have been bang on if the air way better.... like a cloud of nitrous.
I woulda done 666, but I've already been kicked out of hell twice. I guess The Devil was afraid for his job.
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Well done! I nailed the HP but didn't expect the big torque numbers. That thing should be a monster and likely has great manners and a ton of vacuum.
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548 hp at 5500, 580 torque....
Wow! Killer torque. Was this with the 780 carb? Awesome build!
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Almost 1.4 hp per cube. I wasn't expecting that. Those heads are better than I thought. Nice job, Brent!
Doug, hp/ci is 1.23. But they are good heads!
My bad, I forgot about the stroker crank and based it on a 396 ci. An extra 40 cubes certainly will make a difference..lol
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548 hp at 5500, 580 torque....
Wow! Killer torque. Was this with the 780 carb? Awesome build!
Yes sir, a Quick Fuel HR-780.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49680782476_e6edb0a68c_c.jpg)
Here's the dyno sheet. A little bit of an A/F ratio imbalance from side to side. Could have been the way I shaped the divider, not sure, but a Super Sucker didn't straighten it out and neither did a large air cleaner. Regardless, it's showing lean because we were tuning for 4500' altitude on the last several pulls since this engine is going to Wyoming. Makes it a little trickier to manage time efficiently, because we wanted to make sure that it would be close enough on A/F so that he wouldn't have to do a lot of tuning once he got it in the car. We can even "drive" the dyno to simulate the A/F ratio at cruising rpm, and spent time tuning for that scenario as well.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49681072982_9e646b5d2e_c.jpg)
The torque surprised me as well. Dynos have a range of repeatability but all torque numbers after the majority of tuning was completed were in the 570-580 range.
One thing to note: we watch the oil temperatures throughout a pull, as it can be an indicator of issues. We typically see 2-3° bumps in oil temp throughout a full pull. There's a trend with the Canton and Milodon pans, in that they are so deep that the oil temperature will start going down through the pull. The dyno cell has airflow in it and those deep pans act as a radiator. Pretty neat.
All-in-all, I was very pleased with the engine and I'm a big fan of these cylinder heads. Making almost 550 hp with a 5500 rpm peak, holding to 6000 with a relatively small camshaft (231° @ .050" intake lobe) says a lot for cylinder head performance.
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Drop that oil pressure down to 50-55 psi, and pick up several horsepower. Looks like a solid build. Joe-JDC
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Drop that oil pressure down to 50-55 psi, and pick up several horsepower. Looks like a solid build. Joe-JDC
I use a lot of standard volume pumps that end up at around 60-65 psi at full song. I typically don’t do it on hydraulic roller builds that can go over 6000 rpm on a spirited jaunt.
On a long run, the oil temp would go up some from where it ran here, which would cause the pressure to go down a little....prob 10-12 psi.