FE Power Forums
FE Power Forums => FE Technical Forum => Topic started by: gregaba on September 25, 2019, 03:08:55 PM
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Going to start my 63 Galaxie next year and was sitting here thinking and started to wonder if any one has installed a turbo on a stock type 428.
I went though the search and didn't find anything on the subject. Plenty on the SOCH and Boss and T-birds but nothing on the 428 that I found.
My engine is a stock bore and stroke 428. I have new forged pistons and rods all ready and the cam choice is open.
I am also going to order the 4 bolt caps from Tmeyer when he gets them ready.
If I do boost it I will have to order new pistons as the ones I have with the heads show a 11.2 compression ratio.
Any feed back on this stupid ideal?
Greg
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What turbo and how far do you plan to push it? Fuel? air to air? manifold setup?
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Shelby had two Paxton superchargers on a couple of Cobras, one was his I believe and one was Bill Cosby's
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What i know about Turbos is that the "secret" to make
power is in the exhaust manifolds. And to avoid a lot of
Tjoff and bang use fuel injection. It is a guy around here
With a 80s Mercedes 300 Coupe. That developed 1000 horses
on wife's uncles chassidyno. Untouched shortblock, modified
combustion chambers bone stock intake. Exhaust manifold of
his own design, the K-jetronic FI swaped for a EFI
Dead reliable he use it as his daily driver
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You can put a turbo on a push lawnmower if that's what you want. It's not a stupid idea. Your best information will come from turbocharger forums. An FE isn't a distinctly different kind of engine, so what works on a LS engine will also work on an FE...or a Studebaker. What will always be most important is to pay attention to the tune up.
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What's a "Tubro"? ;D
I know I wouldn't do it in my Shelby. I barely have enough room for the battery!
-Keith
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I just had this ideal today so haven't thought it out yet. I will be running fuel injection on aluminum heads. I would want a water inter cooler regardless.I was looking at my friends 63 and noticed the extra room in the engine compartment and this is why I was interested in it. In my 68 Shelby GT500 KR convertible there was no room even to change the plugs.
I will be running the FE power intake adapter with a Trick Flow single plane intake along with The CVR electric water pump. I have everything all ready bought for the build except the 4 bolt mains and cam and if I decide to go this way then the turbo and exhaust.
Not looking for 800 HP but a good jump in power for the street.
I would like a lot of power on demand and don't mind upgrading the suspension to handle the power.
The car will be mainly be used for Saturday night cruises and 8 or 10 trips to the strip a year.
I was asking because I know very little about turbo's and am at a loss of sizing etc.
I will check out some of the turbo forums tonight and see what I can learn. The only turbo experence is what I learned when I was a mechanic at the various dealerships I worked at over the years.
Just off the top of my pea brain I was thinking of about 10 to 15 Lbs of boost should do what I want.
Greg
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I have seen procharger kits for the Fe , that or turbos would be pretty cool
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Look in members projects at 67 fair lane super stock like 4 down.
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What's a "Tubro"? ;D
I know I wouldn't do it in my Shelby. I barely have enough room for the battery!
-Keith
I think that's if you have 2 brothers?
You just have to high mount the turbo's in Shelby, plenty of room above the hood. Might be kinda hard to see around them, but those are minor details.
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Look into the idea of running E85. It has about 108 octane and you could very likely use the pistons you have. It also runs a lot cooler so you might not need to use an intercooler with all its attendant extra plumbing and weight. As a thumbnail, 15 pounds of boost will give you double the NA horsepower (actually torque.) Things can get exciting in a hurry. Use a set-up with an adjustable wastegate and start with about five pounds of boost. Move up a little at a time.
KS
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What's a "Tubro"? ;D
I know I wouldn't do it in my Shelby. I barely have enough room for the battery!
-Keith
Locally there still is (so i'm told) a 68 GT500 convertible with a twin turbo 428 built in the late 70's. I saw it on the road being driven about 15 years ago and also saw it back around 1979 . A real packaging job for sure.
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TWNPAX
not sure if the pic attached?
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I have a pair of turbo’s on an FE it’s a 427 but still the same basic engine
If I had to start over I would buy a belt driven supercharger
No expensive stainless headers to make keep the exhaust system you currently have. Torque storm seems to have a decent unit for a good price only 6 pounds of boost just what you need!
A blow thru carb would be easier but you can get better overall easier running with EFI
I have a port fuel injection. Great for tuning but the problem is you have to tune it. LOT of time and money for dyno rental
I had to learn the EFI thing and tune my own.
Hope this helps
PS just a note at 7 lbs of boost I made 741 hp at the wheels or around 900 hp at the flywheel,so 6 lbs should work great for you
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Hi
Thanks for all the comments.I will try to answer everyone.
Sand Hauler- I looked at the Procharger kit and for the money I think I would go with the Don Hampton 6-71 kit. I talked to Don about the kit and the only downside was how to mount the AC unit. I think a 6-71 sticking though the hood would be very interesting. I haven't seen one buildt like that in 35 years.
Cammerfe- I can't run E85 as it is not available in my area. I have never seen a pump with E85 in Oklahoma although I am sure you can get it in Oklahoma city or Tulsa.
It did get me to thinking [a dangerous thing for me] I have CNG in my F250 and love it and there is enough room in the trunk for a CNG tank. I don't know if anyone builds a tank to fit in the 63 but will check into it.
TomP- Would love to see the Shelby with twin turbos. Would be interested in how he routed the exhaust.
Russ67Scode- Have you posted any pictures of your engine, would like to see them.
I am with you on the learning curve on EFI. My friend has a 66 fastback Mustang with the FAST XFI injection on it.
It ran so bad you couldn't stand by it at idle because it was so rich it would burn your eyes bad. No shop in our area would touch it. I told him if he was patient I would try. I am a little slow and it took me a year and a half [I could only get it for a few hours 1 or 2 days a month] to get him a good tune on it, mostly because of the FAST program. It basically left you to your own devices and was not built for the home tuner. That was a huge learning curve and I hope I never see another one.
I think you are right I don't need 700 HP so it looks like I was way off on my boost estimate.
6 pounds sounds about right. The only thing is if I can keep my hands of the boost knob.
Strangman- Thanks for the link. As soon as I can I am going to read it.
Heo- See if you can get him to make a video od a drag run. Would love to see it.
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What's a "Tubro"? ;D
I know I wouldn't do it in my Shelby. I barely have enough room for the battery!
-Keith
Locally there still is (so i'm told) a 68 GT500 convertible with a twin turbo 428 built in the late 70's. I saw it on the road being driven about 15 years ago and also saw it back around 1979 . A real packaging job for sure.
i would like to have a dollar for every time you said,i would not do that because its a Shelby.ha ha just kidding.if i had a real Shelby i would be obsessed with keeping it bone stock original.just funnin,not picking on you.
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Look here for tons of pictures
http://fepower.net/simplemachinesforum/index.php?topic=1272.0
Page 12 and video on 13
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Thanks for the link.
I had looked at it yesterday but reread it today. All most 900 FPT at 4000 is unbelievable and on 7 LBS of boost.
I would like to have two small turbo's but will have to settle for one big one if I go that way. The lag will be a little longer but with that much power on a street car I don't think it matters.
That is one nice Fairlane and if I had the Mustang I would fix it. I have fixed worse.
Greg
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Remember, don't worry about the lag too much as that's just a few seconds where the other guy thinks that he's going to win ;)
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Any kind of lag drives me nuts. On my 08 and 10 Gt mustangs it bothered me so much I put a i think a pdm programmer on the gas peddle. I think it goes back to when I was a kid and thought I knew everything about making a car run good and would get beat in a race because of carb bog. Made me go to school and learn something about tuning.
I helped my sister in law's mother buy a Volvo S40. The dealer was trying to charge her 34 thousand for it and I got the same car for her for 23 thousand. That car really had some lag- about 3 or 4 seconds. Drove me nut's.
I may not like a single turbo because of this but with the kind of power these put out you may be right.
Does anyone have any pictures of a single turbo set uo on an FE?
Would all so like so input on what size to use on a big block.
Would be really be interested in seeing how the exhaust was run.
Most of the forums I have seen so far are for small engines.
Greg
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Shelby had two Paxton superchargers on a couple of Cobras, one was his I believe and one was Bill Cosby's
There were two. The car had many cooling issues. The gain was minimal as well because of the heat and no way to cool the air.
-Keith
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Does anyone have any pictures of a single turbo set uo on an FE?
Don't know the current status of this project. Hasn't been an update in a while.
http://fepower.net/simplemachinesforum/index.php?topic=3700.0;all
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Good link
First pictures I have seen of the exhaust.
Seemed like he had it nailed until you get to the end and he broke some ring lands.
May be 10-1 compression is to much?
Must have had some high EGT's in it. I am interested in what he did wrong with the water injection. Wouldn't want to make the same mistake.
The timing seemed to be a little to much even with the MSD ignition supposed to pull it down, but then I know very little about timing of turbo's.
Thanks for the link.
Greg
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Russ, I built a 427 Cobra and I heard about a guy having twin turbo's in one, but I don't see how he did, unless he had full exhaust under the car and placed them near the back. What is your car ? Please explain your set-up with pics here or send me a PM. I'm old, and old school, so I refer the blowers over turbo's.
I have a pair of turbo’s on an FE it’s a 427 but still the same basic engine
If I had to start over I would buy a belt driven supercharger
No expensive stainless headers to make keep the exhaust system you currently have. Torque storm seems to have a decent unit for a good price only 6 pounds of boost just what you need!
A blow thru carb would be easier but you can get better overall easier running with EFI
I have a port fuel injection. Great for tuning but the problem is you have to tune it. LOT of time and money for dyno rental
I had to learn the EFI thing and tune my own.
Hope this helps
PS just a note at 7 lbs of boost I made 741 hp at the wheels or around 900 hp at the flywheel,so 6 lbs should work great for you