FE Power Forums
FE Power Forums => FE Technical Forum => Topic started by: 67428GT500 on May 15, 2019, 12:17:51 AM
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The new pistons are JE 4.155. I was considering running the JE molly rings as well. They are 1/16 1/16 3/16. The JE rings seem a bit pricey at 140.00 being it's a common Brand X ring size. What say the peanut gallery?
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Bunch of options from Mahle and Total Seal. You shouldn't pay more than $110-115 for a set of good rings for those pistons. A 1/16"-3/16" piston ring is almost "antiquated" now and they are cheaper than the newer metric ring packs.
JE and Diamond branded piston rings are from Total Seal......the middle man has to mark them up.
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Either way, don't spend $$$ on pistons then try to save $20 on rings. Agree, getting unusual to see 3/16 oil rings and even the 1/16 uppers. Best bet is to buy from one of our supporting vendors here. Keep it in the family ;D
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Try to get something from Mahle. They make a really nice part - and they actually make rings - as opposed to making boxes...
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JE does not make rings , they buy them in bulk "sleeves" and repackage them .Total Seal does that too but does have proprietary rings made for them alone. They obviously offer many specialty and rings they modify.
"Most" rings are made by the Federal Mogul/Speed Pro/Perfect Circle/Mahle group or Hastings. Their rings are commonly "private labeled" through Engine Pro , Summit, and many others. There are some other smaller manufacturers like Pacific and Grant as well as some large Japanese companies too.
Randy
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Randy hit the nail on the head. I am not interested in cutting corners. However, paying for a box with a major name who doesn't make their own product makes sense to me. The pistons I have in the engine I am pulling are 5/64 5/64 3/16. Now that one was a hard one to get rings for as there were no file fit rings available. I wound up running speed pro. I had .022-.027 end clearances. A bit wide.
-Keith
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I have used Mahle on quite a few builds, but nowhere the amount of Brent and Barry. Worked great on every one.
However, Randy supplied me with a set of Hastings rings for one this round, and to be honest I liked them better from a build and drag standpoint. With two 4.155 x 4.25 stroke engines next to each other, the Hastings seemed to be just a little nicer. Standard tension, but seemed to have a cleaner edge, went together a bit easier with a tapered compressor and felt like they had noticeably less drag than the Mahle version on the stand right next to them
Again, no back to back running experience, and only experience so far is on the stand, but I think it's my go to ring for "feel good" assembly LOL
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That reminded me, I'm pretty sure the rings in the Falcon 351C are via Summit, OEM Hastings parts. No issues. Agree - we all want a decent part without having to pay extra for a pretty box.
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There is a term in our industry and others I'm sure , called "perceived value". This is in a nutshell, make a part and sell it for the highest price the market will bear so consumers THINK it is a superior product. While the specific part "may" be the ultimate and have significant benefits , the cost to produce is similar to the cost other manufacturers have that sell their product at lesser "inflated" prices. There are high quality , lower cost rings out there without the expensive box LOL.
Randy
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Just my experience - but I have used a lot of rings from numerous suppliers. I have had consistently good luck from the Mahle product - they actually bought out Perfect Circle manufacturing from Dana.
I have used a fair amount of the Hastings product and have "bumped my head" a couple times with their stuff from a QC perspective. Their quality improved quite a bit several years ago when a bunch of F-M ring folks moved over there after F-M pulled the plug on ring manufacturing. Still not a Mahle level from what I can perceive but obviously my experience and ability to evaluate is much more limited than it once was.
The Speed-Pro and Sealed Power stuff is primarily from Hastings nowadays. Total Seal is largely an accumulator/consolidator of product from numerous sources - hence they have the broadest market and bore size coverage of anybody. I used to sell them and JE a ton of bulk product back when I was at F-M (when F-M had an aftermarket ring manufacturing plant - long closed now). No idea whats in their boxes anymore, but I would wager on a bunch of Hastings, Mahle, and NPR pieces out of Japan - probably mixed in every carton depending on bore, radial, width etc.
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Okay, this is what I have decided on. How do these look? https://www.summitracing.com/tx/parts/mle-4160ms
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As Barry and others have noted Mahle is a top quality ring set.
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Okay, this is what I have decided on. How do these look? https://www.summitracing.com/tx/parts/mle-4160ms
That ring should work fine, but 4155MS would likely take much less grinding. The 4155MS is identified as not needing filing, but did did on my last two applications to meet .0045/.0055 per inch of bore which I like to use on the street