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FE Power Forums => FE Technical Forum => Topic started by: Urgefor on August 02, 2023, 10:01:16 PM

Title: 66 Galaxie Rack and Pinion Conversion
Post by: Urgefor on August 02, 2023, 10:01:16 PM
So I thought it would be nice to "unclutter" the engine bay a bit by doing away with the steering box and reduce the number of bushings and joints in the steering linkage. The Unisteer option (https://www.unisteer.com/products/1965-67-ford-galaxie-500-rack-pinion-kit) would be the easiest route from what I've seen after a bit of searching. Bolts up to the frame where the steering box and idler arm bracket attach. Power steering would be a nice addition (the car is currently manual steer which is super fun with the 390 sitting in the engine bay and not in motion), but pumps, lines, and power steering fluid are soooooo 2001.  EPAS attached to the steering column (https://epasperformance.com/collections/galaxie/products/1962-72-ford-galaxie) would address that issue and allow a manual rack to be used but why add clutter to one area while removing it from another?  Modern racks have EPAS built in of course, but most (if not all) rear steer EPAS racks have the electric motor mounted vertically since the vehicles are FWD by default and present clearance issues.  Vehicles like Mustangs or Navigators have racks with the motors mounted horizontally but they are a front steer configuration.

So my thoughts are:

1) Use a rack like the one in the picture (front steer) only modified so it will be a rear steer center take-off style. That means replacing the tie rods on the rack with something to attach to the existing spindle connector rods. Also, some sort of setup will be needed to turn the input shaft of the rack in the opposite direction the steering wheel is being turned so turning the steering wheel left or right will result in a turn in the same direction.  Yeesh!

2) Use the rack as designed by switching the spindles to opposite sides and converting to front steer.  Then the only hurdles would be mounting the rack, attaching the steering column to the rack's input shaft, wiring it up, and most likely an alignment.

I'm not sure what clearance issues the oil pan might present if going the front steer route, but elimination of the spindle connector rods means a rear sump oil pan would be an option.  I believe the rack could be mounted and not interfere with the strut that attaches to the frame and lower arm or the stabilizer bar. That leaves my biggest concern.  What effect will swapping the spindles have regarding caster? Adjustments to caster can be made of course, but a visual inspection with the spindles installed is a bit inconclusive when trying to determine if a swap would be feasible or not.  Thoughts?
Title: Re: 66 Galaxie Rack and Pinion Conversion
Post by: frnkeore on August 03, 2023, 02:52:03 AM
If you reverse the spindles, to a front steer, it will also mess up the Ackerman steering, that makes the front wheels turn at the different angles that they need.
Title: Re: 66 Galaxie Rack and Pinion Conversion
Post by: machoneman on August 03, 2023, 06:31:54 AM
That's a lot of work and money for mainly visual gain. No fan of that era's power steering in full sized Fords but.......
Title: Re: 66 Galaxie Rack and Pinion Conversion
Post by: Katz427 on August 03, 2023, 06:49:19 AM
All these points are valid. But if one really wants a front steer car, then the correct way is to craft a crown vic front end on the car. I have seen it , works but moves an FE up higher in the chassis, which I'm  not excited about. I know there are options, like a dry sump, or an external oil pump, with a Aviaid oil pan , both nice ,however, they are costly.  But they allow you too put the engine, where you want.
In an old chassis like a 1966 galaxie, I prefer a rear steer, and the easiest and best way IMO, is a new box, like the Borgenson. They steer nice, allow one to run more caster, without having a heavy steering feel.
Title: Re: 66 Galaxie Rack and Pinion Conversion
Post by: galaxiex on August 03, 2023, 08:18:21 AM
I have a 66 Galaxie 500XL and putting an EPS unit under he dash would be a challenge.
For the size of the car, they have very little room under the dash.
A Borgeson box would be my choice.
My car has factory P/S but I'm considering swapping to the Borgeson.

On room under the dash....
My car did not come with A/C so I installed a Vintage Air Magnum Gen IV unit.
I had to fabricate a "kick out" box on the firewall to get the VA unit to fit.
It gets very tight under there... esp with all the AC duct hoses.
I'm not surprised VA does NOT offer a "Direct Fit" AC system for these cars.


Edit:
I looked at the Unisteer Rack conversion.
Seems like a lot of monkey business for not much gain.
Title: Re: 66 Galaxie Rack and Pinion Conversion
Post by: Urgefor on August 03, 2023, 08:53:21 PM
If you reverse the spindles, to a front steer, it will also mess up the Ackerman steering, that makes the front wheels turn at the different angles that they need.

A very good point.  I had completely overlooked the Ackermann aspect.  I believe I can work around that as well. I am not using stock rims and have tons of room to move the tie rod ends outward. That should allow reversing the spindles and Ackermann to remain the same.
Title: Re: 66 Galaxie Rack and Pinion Conversion
Post by: Urgefor on August 03, 2023, 08:57:08 PM
That's a lot of work and money for mainly visual gain. No fan of that era's power steering in full sized Fords but.......

I'm not concerned with visual really.  I was thinking more about reducing the number of items requiring maintenance or replacement along with making it easer to fit the long tube headers on the drivers side.  The current set has a couple dings from the steering box.
Title: Re: 66 Galaxie Rack and Pinion Conversion
Post by: 427Fastback on August 03, 2023, 11:33:44 PM
I just put a EPAS in my 67 Mustang as its QR manual and its getting tiring.The car is a 67 Replica of the T/A cars so a pump under the hood or rack was not a option.It was a bit of work and is only visible if you bend down.No issues with the clutch pedal.20 years ago I put a complete TCP suspension in a 69 Mustang SCJ..Mustangs are rear steer and absolutely hated the way the rack and tie rods were done.I have also recently done a Borgeson conversion to a 68 Mustang..Other than the ugly eaton pump it was good..System will work with a Ford pump.Box ratio is good..
Title: Re: 66 Galaxie Rack and Pinion Conversion
Post by: randomologist on August 04, 2023, 10:04:59 AM
I have a Unisteer power rack and pinion conversion on my 69 Mustang with an FE. My experience has been mixed. Every single component in their system failed pretty quickly or were poorly designed for my application. They did replace my rack with a brand new one after the original rack failed internally after about 10k miles, but it took several months and a BBB complaint to get them to honor it. The rack replacement took place during a period of time Unisteer was bought out by Maval Manufacturing. I never got the sense they were bad people; just that they were dramatically behind schedule/workload and weren't very honest about turn around times, etc.

*The P/S pump bracket design was incompatible with some of the other mods I had and it didn't allow for much (any) real belt adjustment.
*The P/S pump periodically leaked from day 1 due to cheap/improper o-rings in the reservoir
*The P/S pump output position needed to be moved so it could be used with A/C
*The P/S high pressure hose failed almost immediately.
*Stock rag joint needed to be cut.
*The kit was missing a spacer for the stock steering shaft. I fabricated one.
*Outer tie rod shafts needed to be cut to length and there was just barely enough thread left for alignment. The rack was universal fit, despite the kit being specifically for my Mustang. Since the Galaxie is wider, this may be less of an issue.
*The bracket didn't provide adequate access to the alignment bolts. Several shops complained it was almost impossible.
*Geometry of stock steering shaft and rack mounting location was not correct and was not adjustable (this was corrected when I altered the bracket)
*K-member/mounting bracket was not fabricated properly and was bowed and hooked from the factory. Installing it the first time was a real nightmare. I didn't notice it wasn't bent exactly square from the factory until the 2nd time I installed. I needed to bend it square, after which, it installed pretty easy.
*Oil pan clearance between the inner boots and the bottom of the pan was a problem (My '63 427 has a slightly thicker pan depth at the back of the block than the super thin 390/428 FE pans used with the 67-70 Mustang from the factory, but I'm not sure the factory FEs would have fit)
*As noted, I needed to drop the rack 3/4" to clear the oil pan, which necessitated having additional tabs welded to the bottom of the non-adjustable bracket and drilling new bolt holes at precision locations. The lower bracket made me a little uncomfortable with ground clearance.

My original rack broke internally, I was told. Supposedly, it was a design flaw and my rack was replaced with a newer design. The newer design was better for the Mustang, but the new port locations required me to remake all new power steering lines. Side note, anything other than the outer tie rod ends is considered non-serviceable for my rack.

If there is one modification on my car I desperately wish I could go back in time and undo/redo with a different supplier, it's my Unisteer conversion. That said, they DID honor their warranty and the new rack has been working without an issue for the last 5 years and about 10k miles.

Title: Re: 66 Galaxie Rack and Pinion Conversion
Post by: Rory428 on August 04, 2023, 10:31:13 AM
randomologist, how was the turning circle with the rack conversion? I have no interest in a rack conversion for my 59, although Unisteer does offer one, but whenever I asked guys that have installed various rack & pinion conversions in a Mustang, Fairlane, or full sized Ford, they all said that the turning circle was greatly reduced, so a U turn, or even a sharp switchback, could not be done without stopping, and backing up, to complete the turn. I have also heard that in most cases, they had to use the modern looking GM PS pump, and aftermarket brackets, which in my opinion, look out of place in an older car, unless you actually want the aftermarket look. As for the first rack failing, my understanding is that many of these aftermarket rack kits use a rack originally designed for a lightweight FWD GM car, which makes me wonder if the rack is just too "light duty" for a much heavier vehicle with a heavy engine, and likely wider tires. Kinda like when I see a 4500 pound car or truck, with Mustang 11 front suspension, that was designed for a much lighter vehicle with tiny 13" tires.
Title: Re: 66 Galaxie Rack and Pinion Conversion
Post by: Heo on August 04, 2023, 07:02:18 PM
That Unisteer rack is a GM rack on FWDcars based on the FWD Opel Kadett/Ascona
J platform like SAAB, Pontiac J2000, sunbird,Cavallier etc.
We put one on my sons Volvo 544 that is front steer so we chose one from a RHD
postalservice Kadett and turned it upsidedown end to end
I started to install a SAAB one on my 64 Galaxie (rearsteer) and as im cheap
i dont going to pay a couple of thousand + bucks for parts i can scrounge for 50 bucks
in  friends backyards.
I Fabed up some brackets but came to close to the HP exhaust manifold with that rubber
acordeon thing, dont remember the english name, on driverside.
and had to tilt it so the pinion ended up vertical to clear othertings......needed 2universal joints
So in the end i rebuilt the factory box and are going the electric Toyota route
OR....maybe i install a complete Jaguar XJ 12 frontend, have one in the barn will get me
Big diskbrakes power rp steering about same trackwidth Jag is about same wheight as the Galaxie
We put one in Stepsons Fairlane or a XJ6 but same exept the springs
And to dont cluter up the front of the engine Mercedes have an electric P/S pump looks like a big
thermos you can hide it anywhere and you have P/S as soon as ign is on, dont need to start the engine
Title: Re: 66 Galaxie Rack and Pinion Conversion
Post by: 427Fastback on August 04, 2023, 11:40:45 PM
Alot of people are buying Toyota Prius electric assist and figureing things out on their own.Due to a divorce non of my equipment is running.I went with EPAS as they have a kit for my car and the system comes with a potentiometer to dial the system up or down.Generally I would make all my own parts.
Title: Re: 66 Galaxie Rack and Pinion Conversion
Post by: machoneman on August 05, 2023, 07:08:01 AM
I have a Unisteer power rack and pinion conversion on my 69 Mustang with an FE. My experience has been mixed. Every single component in their system failed pretty quickly or were poorly designed for my application. They did replace my rack with a brand new one after the original rack failed internally after about 10k miles, but it took several months and a BBB complaint to get them to honor it. The rack replacement took place during a period of time Unisteer was bought out by Maval Manufacturing. I never got the sense they were bad people; just that they were dramatically behind schedule/workload and weren't very honest about turn around times, etc.

*The P/S pump bracket design was incompatible with some of the other mods I had and it didn't allow for much (any) real belt adjustment.
*The P/S pump periodically leaked from day 1 due to cheap/improper o-rings in the reservoir
*The P/S pump output position needed to be moved so it could be used with A/C
*The P/S high pressure hose failed almost immediately.
*Stock rag joint needed to be cut.
*The kit was missing a spacer for the stock steering shaft. I fabricated one.
*Outer tie rod shafts needed to be cut to length and there was just barely enough thread left for alignment. The rack was universal fit, despite the kit being specifically for my Mustang. Since the Galaxie is wider, this may be less of an issue.
*The bracket didn't provide adequate access to the alignment bolts. Several shops complained it was almost impossible.
*Geometry of stock steering shaft and rack mounting location was not correct and was not adjustable (this was corrected when I altered the bracket)
*K-member/mounting bracket was not fabricated properly and was bowed and hooked from the factory. Installing it the first time was a real nightmare. I didn't notice it wasn't bent exactly square from the factory until the 2nd time I installed. I needed to bend it square, after which, it installed pretty easy.
*Oil pan clearance between the inner boots and the bottom of the pan was a problem (My '63 427 has a slightly thicker pan depth at the back of the block than the super thin 390/428 FE pans used with the 67-70 Mustang from the factory, but I'm not sure the factory FEs would have fit)
*As noted, I needed to drop the rack 3/4" to clear the oil pan, which necessitated having additional tabs welded to the bottom of the non-adjustable bracket and drilling new bolt holes at precision locations. The lower bracket made me a little uncomfortable with ground clearance.

My original rack broke internally, I was told. Supposedly, it was a design flaw and my rack was replaced with a newer design. The newer design was better for the Mustang, but the new port locations required me to remake all new power steering lines. Side note, anything other than the outer tie rod ends is considered non-serviceable for my rack.

If there is one modification on my car I desperately wish I could go back in time and undo/redo with a different supplier, it's my Unisteer conversion. That said, they DID honor their warranty and the new rack has been working without an issue for the last 5 years and about 10k miles.

Wow, you have great patience for sure. Sad that so much was wrong even if they did honor the warranty. Your detailed post is a clarion call to the efforts required, let alone downtime and cost, to re-engineering the front steering.

As a '70 Mustang owner, knowing that Ford ran in the '69-'70 Trans-Am series with mainly OEM steering, I copied the few changes Bud Moore made onto my car. No P/S but a lightened front end (all aluminum save the block) makes for a wicked, sharp cornering track ready car. I'll also note Rory's post where folks grafting Mustang II lightweight suspension and steering components to big heavy cars is highly suspect. R&P's made for lightweight cars as well are also questionable when used on big cars, let alone if one tries heavy and repeatable cornering.
Title: Re: 66 Galaxie Rack and Pinion Conversion
Post by: Urgefor on August 05, 2023, 03:39:35 PM
That is an eye opener for sure.  I would much rather put that amount of time and effort into a solution that is in line with what I want instead of "what I can get".

The easiest part of the whole conversion is lack of constraints since this is a restomod.  The car came from the factory with a 289 and 3 speed column shift and the very first change was putting in a 390 and toploader. The engine and transmission will get updates as well as things progress.

The end goal is having something that will be enjoyable to drive with some "woo hoo!" added in.  :) The '66 full size is a bit of a land yacht but I sure do like how it looks.
Title: Re: 66 Galaxie Rack and Pinion Conversion
Post by: randomologist on August 05, 2023, 03:55:06 PM
randomologist, how was the turning circle with the rack conversion? I have no interest in a rack conversion for my 59, although Unisteer does offer one, but whenever I asked guys that have installed various rack & pinion conversions in a Mustang, Fairlane, or full sized Ford, they all said that the turning circle was greatly reduced, so a U turn, or even a sharp switchback, could not be done without stopping, and backing up, to complete the turn. I have also heard that in most cases, they had to use the modern looking GM PS pump, and aftermarket brackets, which in my opinion, look out of place in an older car, unless you actually want the aftermarket look. As for the first rack failing, my understanding is that many of these aftermarket rack kits use a rack originally designed for a lightweight FWD GM car, which makes me wonder if the rack is just too "light duty" for a much heavier vehicle with a heavy engine, and likely wider tires. Kinda like when I see a 4500 pound car or truck, with Mustang 11 front suspension, that was designed for a much lighter vehicle with tiny 13" tires.

These cars didn't have a super tight turning radius to begin with at 37' 8", but I haven't noticed a huge change. I need to get out and measure it for a video on my youtube anyway, but I'd be surprised if it was much wider now. The car does okay in parking lots for me and I can make U-turns from the inside lane to a roads with 2 lanes going the opposite direction without steering using the throttle, but it is tight.
Title: Re: 66 Galaxie Rack and Pinion Conversion
Post by: randomologist on August 05, 2023, 04:01:31 PM
...As a '70 Mustang owner, knowing that Ford ran in the '69-'70 Trans-Am series with mainly OEM steering, I copied the few changes Bud Moore made onto my car. No P/S but a lightened front end (all aluminum save the block) makes for a wicked, sharp cornering track ready car. I'll also note Rory's post where folks grafting Mustang II lightweight suspension and steering components to big heavy cars is highly suspect. R&P's made for lightweight cars as well are also questionable when used on big cars, let alone if one tries heavy and repeatable cornering.

The only reason I think rack and pinion is worth considering is if a person does a lot of highway/freeway driving, which I do. My car came with factory power steering, but everything was totally shot so rack and pinion seemed like a reasonable upgrade. I'd go with a different vendor if I had to do it again. Maybe TCS. I can say the Unisteer system drives really nice and since I eventually had to go to Hydroboost and the factory Ford pump isn't a great choice for Hydroboost, I guess it worked out.

Oh, and in regard to my patience... well, I can't exactly remember how many wrenches were slung or curse words screamed, but it was probably more than one. You gotta do what you gotta do. Doesn't matter how mad a guy is while doing it, haha.
Title: Re: 66 Galaxie Rack and Pinion Conversion
Post by: AlanCasida on August 05, 2023, 07:36:28 PM
...As a '70 Mustang owner, knowing that Ford ran in the '69-'70 Trans-Am series with mainly OEM steering, I copied the few changes Bud Moore made onto my car. No P/S but a lightened front end (all aluminum save the block) makes for a wicked, sharp cornering track ready car. I'll also note Rory's post where folks grafting Mustang II lightweight suspension and steering components to big heavy cars is highly suspect. R&P's made for lightweight cars as well are also questionable when used on big cars, let alone if one tries heavy and repeatable cornering.

The only reason I think rack and pinion is worth considering is if a person does a lot of highway/freeway driving, which I do. My car came with factory power steering, but everything was totally shot so rack and pinion seemed like a reasonable upgrade. I'd go with a different vendor if I had to do it again. Maybe TCS. I can say the Unisteer system drives really nice and since I eventually had to go to Hydroboost and the factory Ford pump isn't a great choice for Hydroboost, I guess it worked out.

Oh, and in regard to my patience... well, I can't exactly remember how many wrenches were slung or curse words screamed, but it was probably more than one. You gotta do what you gotta do. Doesn't matter how mad a guy is while doing it, haha.
I swapped the OEM steering box for a Borgeson p/s unit on my 66 Galaxie. I went from over 5.5 turns lock-to-lock to just under 3.5. I really like it.
Title: Re: 66 Galaxie Rack and Pinion Conversion
Post by: Urgefor on August 07, 2023, 09:29:42 PM
I have a 66 Galaxie 500XL and putting an EPS unit under he dash would be a challenge.
For the size of the car, they have very little room under the dash.
A Borgeson box would be my choice.
My car has factory P/S but I'm considering swapping to the Borgeson.

On room under the dash....
My car did not come with A/C so I installed a Vintage Air Magnum Gen IV unit.
I had to fabricate a "kick out" box on the firewall to get the VA unit to fit.
It gets very tight under there... esp with all the AC duct hoses.
I'm not surprised VA does NOT offer a "Direct Fit" AC system for these cars.


Edit:
I looked at the Unisteer Rack conversion.
Seems like a lot of monkey business for not much gain.

I would be curious where approximately your scrub radius lands in relation to the wheel center.  Mostly because I assume your 500XL had PS from the factory and mine was manual steer from the factory.

I currently have 20" rims from a '17 Mustang on the car to allow for any disc brake conversion I might want to use when the time comes.  The specs for the rims are 20x9 with a 42.5mm offset (1.673228 inches). I'm using forged aluminum spacers that are 1.5" thick which, in theory, moved the centerline of the rim/tire inwards ~.170". Overall diameter of the tire has remained basically the same at a bit over 27". While gathering info about angles of each wheel at full turn, I peeked at the upper and lower ball joints to see where the kingpin axis/steering inclination line was in relation to the tire's center.  It is positive as shown in the picture, but much more so.  I would estimate 2 to 3 inches inward from center.  Basically I'm curious if Ford used the same scrub radius for both power and manual steer.  Any info would be appreciated.
Title: Re: 66 Galaxie Rack and Pinion Conversion
Post by: FrozenMerc on August 08, 2023, 12:06:04 PM
One more thing to think about.  I converted my '62 Mercury Monterey (read: badge engineered Galaxie) to rack and pinion during the build because the OE steering gears and assist cylinder were trashed and rusted badly, and a complete system replacement was going to run into the thousands of dollars.  I also used the late 80's / Early 90's GM Cavalier / Sunfire power rack ($99 from Napa at the time) Heo mentioned.  I had to modify the steering column by adding a support bearing to the end of the tube.  I made my own tie rods, and fabbed the mounting plates.  I re-used the OE FoMoCo power steering pump, and had the local hydraulic shop make up custom lines.  FPA actually made (hopefully still makes) headers to work with this conversion, and that is what when onto the car. 

My only complaint is that I did lose some turning radius, not that a 19 ft long wagon had that tight of a tight turning radius to begin with.  Shortening the knuckle steering arms a bit would solve this problem.  That said, the car drives great, the steering is tight and very responsive. 

(https://live.staticflickr.com/4462/36982729944_f12c1b4952_c.jpg)

(https://live.staticflickr.com/4487/37643213766_52c702520b_c.jpg)


 
Title: Re: 66 Galaxie Rack and Pinion Conversion
Post by: Heo on August 08, 2023, 02:45:35 PM
One more thing to think about.  I converted my '62 Mercury Monterey (read: badge engineered Galaxie) to rack and pinion during the build because the OE steering gears and assist cylinder were trashed and rusted badly, and a complete system replacement was going to run into the thousands of dollars.  I also used the late 80's / Early 90's GM Cavalier / Sunfire power rack ($99 from Napa at the time) Heo mentioned.  I had to modify the steering column by adding a support bearing to the end of the tub.  I made my own tie rods, and fabbed the mounting plates.  I re-used the OE FoMoCo power steering pump, and had the local hydraulic shop make up custom lines.  FPA actually made (hopefully still makes) headers to work with this conversion, and that is what when onto the car. 

My only complaint is that I did lose some turning radius, not that a 19 ft long wagon had that tight of a tight turning radius to begin with.  Shortening the knuckle steering arms a bit would solve this problem.  That said, the car drives great, the steering is tight and very responsive. 

(https://live.staticflickr.com/4462/36982729944_f12c1b4952_c.jpg)

(https://live.staticflickr.com/4487/37643213766_52c702520b_c.jpg)

That looks almost exactly as the coversion i did although i bolted the brackets to the frame
in the holes for the box/idler arm. Problem was to close between the exhaust and rubber boot
on the driverside with hp manifolds and should have been much fabrication to keep the shifter
on the tree. Well i plan to reinstall the four on the floor manual trans and build a slightly modified
"HP" manifold out of thickwall tubing then i can reinstall the R/P conversion
Title: Re: 66 Galaxie Rack and Pinion Conversion
Post by: TomP on August 10, 2023, 02:04:29 PM
Local guy put the electric assist that sits in the column on two 63 Falcons with manual trannies. Those are tight but it fit well.

 One thing with a rack is you need to watch bump steer. There are not many racks that can be mounted the right height and have the pivots in the right place for older cars. Most are way too wide and have to be mounted too low to clear the engine. I've seen some flagrant examples when cars are parking and one tire is leaving a black streak since it's 20 degrees off angle from the other and turning radius that would have truck drivers laughing.
Title: Re: 66 Galaxie Rack and Pinion Conversion
Post by: Heo on August 10, 2023, 07:34:42 PM
Local guy put the electric assist that sits in the column on two 63 Falcons with manual trannies. Those are tight but it fit well.

 One thing with a rack is you need to watch bump steer. There are not many racks that can be mounted the right height and have the pivots in the right place for older cars. Most are way too wide and have to be mounted too low to clear the engine. I've seen some flagrant examples when cars are parking and one tire is leaving a black streak since it's 20 degrees off angle from the other and turning radius that would have truck drivers laughing.
The good thing with that GM rack is that the centersection moves and have two mountingpoints close to the middle
so you fabricate a mount for the tierod ends on the correct distance and height