New FE Block, Heads, and Intakes on the horizon...

[jayb]

It is certainly a good idea to be looking at other options besides the heads and blocks described in this topic.  As mentioned at the very beginning, this topic was designed to gauge interest, there is no guarantee that any of these products will come to fruition, and the parts are probably still 9-12 months away, if everything goes according to plan.  For my part, I'm pretty committed to making the heads and intakes a reality, but I don't have any direct control over the blocks.  I'm sure things will get clearer as time goes by...

[427HISS]

Well, maybe waiting for the block is what I may do then.
Very exciting Jay.

[Rich P]

I was thinking today about the offset bore block. Now a 427 on a valve cover is cool. A 527 on a valve cover is just awesome. But today I just thought how amazing 627 on a valve cover would be. wow!

[Joey120373]

I would love to see provisions for more bell housings.
To me it seams a way better option than using an adapter.
I am looking seriously at the 6r140 for my truck, it's an almost ideal trans.
The 6r80 is awesome too, but don't think it would like the torque I'm hoping to generate.
Drag racers understandably like to keep things simple, so a bullet proof 3 speed is hard to beat. But those of us wanting a dayly driver or street/strip machine really like the idea of a wide gear spread, more gears, overdrive and a locking torque converter.
How much more would it add to the cost of the block to add a little extra meat where needed and drill & tap 6-8 more holes? Just my 2 cents.

[67gt350]

I am hoping for a big bore block with a minimal of major specification changes from stock, trying to make too many changes gets expensive. My two cents would be  to run a built C4/6 three speed and add the Gearvendors overdrive unit..a six speed that can handle 1200hp. I was bench building a big bore SOHC (632cid) and remembered that custom heads may be required as stated in Jays first post. I know that to do the 585 offset pistons - the dome?? - were used, so with a 4.6 bore a SOHC may not be possible unless someone does a custom head for this block?? With a limited number of suppliers do you think one of them would step in and work to get them available?? With the big cubes a raised intake port would be nice too even though intake spacers would be necessary. A pro port SOHC head.. then you could even move the rocker shafts around for help getting a better ratio - man I'm glad it doesn't cost anything to bench build..lol!!

[driveamerican]

I know this is a very old post but if your starting with a clean sheet how about a dual bell housing pattern for a late model transmission that would save a lot of money for people who want  overdrive in turn a cost offset overall. Just thinking sorry about being so late to the game.

[wcbrowning]

Has there been any progress on the potential new engine blocks?

The purpose of this post is to gauge interest in these parts.  No commitment to production has been
made yet, but the designs of the parts are mostly complete, and they could be brought to production
status within a year.  If you may be interested in any of these parts, please respond to the poll at
the top of the post, or if you are not a forum member, email me at jayb@fepower.net.  No commitment
is required at this point, of course, we are just trying to get a feel for interest from the FE
community.

Let's talk about the block first.  I have recently been discussing this with the block manufacturer.
I'm excited about some special features of this block that have not been previously available to us
FE folks.  I'm also interested because I have been surprised by the recent price increases of
aluminum FE blocks.  Having some experience through my intake adapter projects with foundry and
machining costs, I don't see a good reason for these price increases.  Yet a Shelby block is now all
the way up to $7250, and a Pond aluminum block is $5700.  Not sure what the price on a BBM aluminum
block is, but I think at least $4500 (anybody know)?

The block manufacturer is trying to get an aluminum block to market for a selling price of
$4000.  This is less expensive than any aluminum FE block has ever been, as far as I know.  This would be
for a standard 427 style block with replaceable sleeves, sideoiler oiling system, standard bore spacing,
with bores up to 4.35".  Steel crossbolted main caps and main studs would be included.  This would
basically be the same as some of the aluminum blocks that are already out there, but at a more reasonable
price.

Now here's what gets my juices flowing on this.  For an additional cost of about $1000, the block would also
be available with a raised cam and spread bore spacing, to allow big cubic inches.  The cam would be
raised to eliminate the interference between the rod shoulders and the cam lobes, and would allow strokes
up to 4.750", assuming a 2.200" rod journal diameter like the existing stroker cranks out there, and an
aftermarket connecting rod.  Special requirements for the raised cam version would be the use of a
429/460 timing chain with the standard FE timing gears, A specially machined version of my FE timing cover
with the removable front plate (for clearance to the raised top cam gear), and also a custom distributor
gear and spacer, to raise the distributor gear on the shaft, and provide a spacer between the bottom of the
raised gear and the ledge in the block.  Stock FE distributors (minus the stock gear), oil pumps and oil
pump driveshafts would be retained.

The spread bore version would allow bore spacing up to 4.800", and bores up to 4.600".  I have a little
experience with this kind of thing already, because I spread the bore spacing on the Shelby block
in my big SOHC to 4.700" and use a 4.500" bore.  I also was able to fit a 4.600" stroke in the SOHC,
because there are no cam lobes to get in the way of the rod shoulders.  This resulted in 585 cubic inches.

With this block, using a 4.750" stroke and 4.600" bore, cubic inches would be 632!  These dimensions are
the same as the very popular 632" big block Chevrolet.  How does a 632" engine in your 390 Mustang or
Torino sound?

Special requirements for the spread bore version would be special head gaskets for whatever bore spacing was
used (which either I or the block manufacturer would make available, probably SCE or Cometic), custom pistons,
and in some cases custom cylinder heads.  Any cylinder head with factory dimensions would work on bore spacings
up to 4.700" with a 4.500" bore, using special pistons (like what I did with my big SOHC), but going past those
dimensions would require special heads.

A tall deck version of the block is also being considered, but may be less attractive for a variety of reasons,
including tooling cost for that version. Since a 4.75" stroke and a 6.625" rod will fit with the stock FE deck
height, it doesn't seem like a tall deck offers a lot of advantages.  And it does make for a lot of complications
(special sleeves, special intake, special distributor, heavier rod, etc). However, since this is an aluminum
block with sleeves, a simple spacer on top of the block deck, coupled with longer sleeves, could be used to
increase the deck height.  Matching  spacers would have to be used between the heads and the intake and on the
end rails of the block.

The heads and intake are my part of this project.  I have been thinking about this for a long time, because
the basic FE cylinder head architecture is outdated, and is the major limiting factor in producing big
horsepower levels.  But because of the complexity of the FE intake, where pushrods, water jacket,
distributor and valve cover rail all go through the intake manifold, it is difficult to change the basic
design, so we have been stuck up to now with the basic FE architecture.

When I designed my intake adapters, I did both the medium riser and high riser/tunnel port versions.  The
high riser/tunnel port versions were designed as more or less a blank canvas, so that I could put the valve
cover rail and ports anywhere I wanted, to satisfy the requirements for both high risers and tunnel ports,
and any custom cylinder head that may come along (for example, an Edelbrock Pro-Port head).

My cylinder head design will work with a special version of the high riser/tunnel port intake adapter.  I
don't want to say a whole lot about the heads yet, except that they will feature inline valves like a
standard FE, repositioned and radically raised intake ports, and an option for radically raised exhaust ports
(with standard exhaust port locations available for shock tower cars).  They will require longer than stock
valves, custom pushrods, and a special intake rocker, but will retain the stock exhaust rockers and stock rocker
shafts.  The rocker stands will be incorporated into the cylinder heads for rigidity.  Stock FE valve covers
will be retained. All ports will be CNC ported, with different size valves and ports available to match the
application, from a 390 inch engine all the way up to a big cube engine.  I am shooting for maximum flow numbers
in the 475-500 cfm range, using the biggest valves and ports that I am planning.  But even set up with the
smaller ports and valves, the ratio of flow to port cross sectional area will be significantly better than a
stock FE port, because the radically redesigned intake port will be much more efficient than a stock-architecture
FE port.

Finally, the casting will be done so that I can machine the heads for different bore spacings, to match up with
the different bore spacings available from the block described previously.

The intake adapter will be machined to fit the pushrod and port requirements of these heads.  I am working on
four potential intakes that will fit on the intake adapter used with these heads, as follows:

- Individual runner crossram style intake, EFI only, fits under stock hood
- Plenum style intake with a front facing throttle body, EFI only, fits under stock hood
- Single 4 in either 4150 or 4500 style, two piece and split down the middle for easy porting, carb or EFI, will
not fit under stock hood
- 2X4 sheet metal style intake, fully machined (not cast), carb or EFI, will not fit under stock hood.

One thing to note here is that, so far at least, I don't have a carbed version that will fit under the stock hood.
The intake ports are raised so much that the additional height of the carburetor on top of the intake makes
for a package that is difficult to fit.  I may be able to come up with a design for this at some point, but it
would probably compromise performance somewhat.  The EFI versions get around the hood clearance issue; no carb.

I'm shooting for pricing of about $2000 for a pair of the bare heads, plus about $500 for the longer, hollow-stem
valves and $400 for the intake rockers.  This is with no valve job or hand porting done.  I sell the intake
adapters for $689, and I would expect the intake manifolds to range from $500 to $1500, depending on which type.
So the complete package, with heads, valves, intake rockers, intake adapter, and intake manifold would be in the
$4100 - $5100 range.

With these new heads and intakes I think you could build an easy 700 HP 390 stroker, a big cube 900 HP streetable
FE, or an 1100 HP race engine.

On the heads and intakes, I'm about halfway between pipe dream and full production.  I'm getting ready to start
3D printing copies of the head design for flow testing of the port designs, and I may try to CNC a billet version
of the heads, in two pieces that can be bolted or welded together, for some actual dyno testing before I go for
the tooling to get them made.  I don't have the designs for the intakes finished yet, but I'm working on them.

I don't have any control on the block; that is totally up to the block manufacturer, and all I can do
is advise.
 
Again I must stress that lots of things could come up that would cause me to abandon this project (not the least
of which is the cost), and I'm sure the block manufacturer feels the same way.  But I'm pretty excited
about this and really do want to bring these projects to conclusion.  However, I could really use a little
feedback on how desirable you guys think these things are.  So if you are interested in something like this, or
have any comments, pro or con, please post them here or let me know via email.  Thanks, Jay

[jayb]

The deal I was trying to make with the engine block designer fell through, so no progress on that.  I am still planning to do a block, but it won't be until after I have my cylinder heads finished and available.

[feadam]

Any time frame update on heads?

[jayb]

I'm hoping to have at least one sample casting to show at the FE Reunion.  Still sticking with my guess of availability for purchase at the end of this year.

[wcbrowning]

Regarding the spread bore operation you designed and performed on your 585 SOHC Shelby aluminum engine block:  Is it possible and practical, relatively speaking, to do so with a BBM iron engine block?  Would 8 sleeves be required, and is there any method of doing so that would not result in cracking?

The deal I was trying to make with the engine block designer fell through, so no progress on that.  I am still planning to do a block, but it won't be until after I have my cylinder heads finished and available.

[jayb]

No idea if that would work with an iron block.  You'd have to roll the dice and try it, keeping in mind that you might be turning the block into scrap...