BBM head info

[gregaba]

Looking for some new heads for my 428.
 Looks like TFS won't be available till middlr to late sept.
When to BBM site and they have heads for $2250 which makes them competive with the TFS allthough I don't know if they are as good.
What can I expect with these heads.\Install problems,fit etc.
Thanks
Greg

[blykins]

Greg, you need to wait for the TFS heads. 

[gregaba]

I wasn't sure what the difference was in the heads but 40 cfm is a lot.
I guess I will wait for some to become available.
I would really like to put together my engine before mother nature takes her toll. I have it soaked in oil and resoak it every week.
After about $2000.00 in machine work including balancing the assembly It worries me that I would have to fix some rust [I know it would be minor]
Greg

[Yellow Truck]

Brent, I wish the TFS head had been available when I built my 445. Having said that the BBM piece was very well made. What I'm curious about is the difference in the driving experience between the TFS (with 40 more CFM) and the BBM with a blend job. Where do you notice it in ordinary driving (you know, mild start off a stop light, second gear, then a little time at WOT)?

[GerryP]

...I have it soaked in oil and resoak it every week.
After about $2000.00 in machine work including balancing the assembly It worries me that I would have to fix some rust [I know it would be minor]
Greg

Go to Lowe's and spend 10 bucks on a can of Fluid Film.  This stuff is just a step below cosmoline and will protect the parts for a very long time.  It doesn't evaporate or drip off.  Spray it, bag it, and concentrate on your 12oz. curls.

[gregaba]

GerryP
Thanks for the tip. I will go get some in the morning.
Greg

[CaptCobrajet]

I do not agree the information that is professed in this thread. 

[1968galaxie]

One must also ask what flow is required for the intended application?
What displacement and what rpm range will dictate cfm required.
A 500 cfm head on a 6000 rpm 445 inch engine will be a joke.
More flow does not necessarily mean more power.

Are the TFS heads decent - yes.
Are BBM heads equally capable? Yes.
Are Edelbrock heads capable? Yes with the right work.

Promaxx heads modified also seem to work well. Scott Foxwell has a cnc port that is 180cc and hits 340 cfm
445 pump gas build: 586 ft lbs @4600 and 628 hP at 6500 rpm.
Not bad at all!
There are many options for heads.

[blykins]

n/m

[My427stang]

One must also ask what flow is required for the intended application?
What displacement and what rpm range will dictate cfm required.
A 500 cfm head on a 6000 rpm 445 inch engine will be a joke.
More flow does not necessarily mean more power.

Are the TFS heads decent - yes.
Are BBM heads equally capable? Yes.
Are Edelbrock heads capable? Yes with the right work.

Promaxx heads modified also seem to work well. Scott Foxwell has a cnc port that is 180cc and hits 340 cfm
445 pump gas build: 586 ft lbs @4600 and 628 hP at 6500 rpm.
Not bad at all!
There are many options for heads.

All the details of the build do matter, of course, however, just so your 500 cfm comment isn't taken incorrectly...  The TFS outflows the common offerings of the other heads, while having a more direct path and smaller port volume. So, in that 330 unported to 360-ish ported (my words) super street market, with the few heads that can run there, the TFS is really hard to beat at that price.

I'd love to see more heads out there at the TFS price and quality, who knows, maybe it will keep going, maybe BBM's new work  will force TFS into a revamp to get even better.  All good to hear.  However, except for the two things Brent mentioned, and one I will, the smaller chamber size can drive compression up with a head swap on an existing build, I am pretty fond of TFS

I will also say that the parts on the set of TFS I did a few days ago were really nice.  Valve job was right up there with anyone, springs were within .005 installed height from worst to best as delivered, and the PAC springs were so close, I only had to swap a couple of spring locations to make the numbers almost exactly the same across 16.  Pretty good stuff for an off the shelf head

To the original question - I'd wait, if BBM is delivering something that is a TFS beater, maybe I'd wait for that too to see, but either way I'd be waiting LOL

[gregaba]

The intended use for my 63 is just something to drive and have a little fun in.
Saturday night cruiseing and 8 to 10 trips to the strip a year.
I had a 2013 Boss 302 that I loved but I am 100% disabled and it got to where I couldn't get in and out of the car so after 5 fun years of driving it I sold it for all most as much as I paid for it.
I am using the money from the sale to finance this build.
I have everything for the build except the heads.
I realize that for what I am using the car for I don't need aftermarket heads and the stock heads [c1's] I have would work fine.
I bought the engine complete 30 years ago for $150.00 and they pulled it.
I have been buying parts and storing them since then.
What I have done so far is have the block blueprinted and the assembly balanced.
I have all of Jays parts for the engine except the SOCH covers which I don't need but wish I did.
The block is a 428 .30 over with Scat rods and Autotec forged pistons.
I have a TFS 351C single plane intake and will be using a Holley 780.
I was going to run EFI on it but with the cam I have for it {Ford D Cam] there is no way it will work with it.
After I run the cam for 6 months then I will order a custom roller cam for it but I want to run the D cam for old times sake.
I had a set of Pro Gram 4 bolt caps but the engine builder was againest installing them because he said it might make my block weaker because of how much he would have to remove to install them so I sold them.
I have the 6R80 and adaptor for it. Do not have the driveshaft yet.
I have a 444 Detroit locker [31 spline] for the rear and will be useing the Calvert bars and mono leaf springs.
I have a Taylor-Vertex ingition box and will have to limit my RPM to 6500 because of the 2 bolt main's.
The 63 is a former race car from birth with 22,000  documented miles.
I know the car from new and have all ways wanted it so when the first owner passed away I was able to buy it from the family.
I removed the rollbar and a few of the other racing items to use it on the street.
The wheelbase is 8 inch's less then stock and the car weigh's 3460 Lb's without driver or drivetrain. There is no carpet,sound deadener,heater, or other comforts. I will add carpet and a passenger bucket seat.   
This is all I can remember off hand of what I have and how I will use the car and I plan to run like this untill I can get the money for an aluninum block and strocker kit and then build a real engine.
Greg 

[WerbyFord]

Thanks for that build detail, I was about to ask.
I can see all the points about the heads - looks like flow WILL matter in your case, but so will a better burn where BBM might have an edge, at least so far. The idea of having to sink tons of money into the TFS (no exhaust helicoils with the whole weight of the exhaust rattling on there, and the strange rocker stand pads) - you could use that same money to port & flow the BBM heads so I dont know how to compare them dollar-for-dollar.

What will you run for headers & exhaust?
Compression about 10.0 ?
What stall and gear ratios will you have on that 6R80?
Weight of car?

Either way with the "D" cam in it (probably not ideal as you know) it would be great info to get timeslips with it to compare to the Gonkulator - how "bad" is the D-cam when run out of its intended range like that? Then try another cam & compare timeslips again.

A great C8AX-D cam thread down below, I just asked about valve weights but nobody has answered yet.

[BruceS]

Greg, would love to see photos of your old '63 race car!  Bruce

[My427stang]

So I forgot the cam and the overall build, any of the heads will work fine, meaning the engine will run, sound wicked and be snarly.  In addition, a 4.44 geared 428 is going to feel strong in traffic with a loose converter with any of these

Unported though, keep in mind the difference in a C1 head to a TFS head is about 100 cfm.  That being said, if in a hurry, pick the combo that hits the compression numbers you want and timeline you want and go for it. 

I sure don't want to open a can a worms, because we beat that horse to death before, but the cam just brings you to a level where, in your case, just have fun with whatever combo you decide.  Measuring with a mike, cutting with a hatchet....

Not being a wise butt either, we do things different when we want different things... I did a 397 low riser for a guy recently, we lightened up the valve train and did beehives in a stock C3 head with 11/32 valves, went with a tight LSA cam to get some snot out of it, and rubbed all we could on the roof of the lowriser dual quad to get the air to turn a corner at the carb pads.  Never dyno'd, owner's dad was ill and he wanted it in as fast as he could, but it's a little terror and sounds like it's much more than it is.  Could it be sent home on a trailer with a milder more modern build?  Heck yes, but he is having a blast in it and is super happy.   

FWIW - It takes me 150-200 dollars of owners money to get a TFS where I call it right....don't get spooked with "tons of money"  It's a cheap way to get into the 330+ cfm small volume intake club

[gregaba]

I will eun long tube headers. I have run Hooker super comps in all my builds for quit a few years but would consider other brands but we are limited as to what we can buy for the FE
I will run 2 1/2 exhaust with the cut outs-really not sure about the muffler brand yet as that is something I havn't bought yet.
Brent sait I would be 11.4 [Just a guess when I bought the pistons] compression with these pistons.
I really won't know until I mock it up and see how far down the pistons are in the hole.
I have Cometic .40 head gaskets for it.The block was decked to 10.150.
I have yet to order the torque converter so the stall is a question and any suggestions are welcome. Gear ratio is 4.44.
I will provide before and after timeslips as I am wondering about the difference my self.
Fuel will be 130 octane CNG for both the street and strip and I will be using M&H slicks on the strip.
I have been watching the D cam thread as it really interest me.
Greg