Been waiting for it

[gregaba]

I knew it was coming and I just saw my first artical on getting the best gas mileage.
Whats next, another GEO Metro for us to enjoy.
Greg

[shady]

I can see the board trembling at Ford. Yeah, the small car market is back and they (Ford) aren't making any.

[turbohunter]

Gotta go to Calif. to pick up my mustang this month. Fuel will cost twice as much at best. Took three days of work to pay for it while I’m out there.
Hah

[FrozenMerc]

I can see the board trembling at Ford. Yeah, the small car market is back and they (Ford) aren't making any.

No shit, It will be interesting to see what they do short of writing Elon a big check.

Guess it may be time to befriend a few restaurant owners and convert the old IDI to run on veggie oil....

[Falcon67]

Yes, the news this AM was full of "tire pressure is important" and "maintain a steady speed on the road".  The later virtually an impossible task with all the truck traffic LOL.  None of it will make - IMHO - a dang bit of difference.  The super trick twin turbo EcoBoost seems to get the same MPG at 75 and 80, and I'll get run over at 70 so there's that.  Nobody slows down out here, even the semi's are running 78~80.  Only the occasional heavily regulated company truck seems to be down in the 68 MPH range.

Also note that the "price set new records" is incorrect.  Highest price during the last surge - 2008 - in Texas was 3.985 for regular.  I bought fuel yesterday for $3.989.  The 2008 Texas max price translated to 2022 dollars would have been $5.20.  So we're not there, not yet.  The average US record for 2008 was $4.11, WSJ says the "new US average record" is $4.17.  The 2008 record in 2022 dollars would be $5.37.  So - no "new record" in monetary terms. Don't forget the poor folks in CA where the gas tax is like $1.18 or some such.  Here it's only 0.20 plus the federal fuel tax.  And a guy in Ca said their media people like to show pictures of some off the wall price, usually from a rip off station 90 miles from anywhere. LOL

[gregaba]

I was running some errors today and some so called reporter on the radio said you could buy a EV to beat the high gas prices.
If he would have done even a little research he would know it cost more to charge a EV to 100% then to fill up your F-150.
Greg

[WConley]

I was running some errors today and some so called reporter on the radio said you could buy a EV to beat the high gas prices.
If he would have done even a little research he would know it cost more to charge a EV to 100% then to fill up your F-150.
Greg

Umm - No.  My Rivian has a 135 KW-hr battery pack.  That will get me about 315 miles.  Electricity here is $0.20 / KW-hr at night when I charge, so you multiply 135 x 0.20 and you get $27.00 for a full charge.  This is a big heavy EV with 835 HP, 4 motors, so it's not terribly "efficient".  Most of the new crossover EV's are a lot more efficient than that.

No way you're filling an F-150 for $27.00  If you're averaging 20 miles / gal and gas is $4.00, that $27.00 will get you about 135 miles in the Ford.

[Heo]

And here i pay 9 dollar for a gallon today.....

[Rory428]

Here in Atlantic Canada, the price for regular 87 octane gas was $1.87 per liter, there are 3.78 liters in an American Gallon, so $7.06 per US Gallon, in Canadian funds.I was talking to a buddy on Canadas West Coast last night, they were at $2.09 per liter, so $7.90 per US Gallon. And Diesel is a fair bit higher still. This year, I have my sights set on going to the FE Race in Beaver Springs, assuming world events allow such a thing, and I just checked Mapquest, from my home in Nova Scotia, to Beaver Springs, is right around 1800 kilometers, one way, a little over 1100 miles each way. ASSuming gas prices do not change between now and September, with my V10 F350 slurping back a gallon of gas every 8 to 8 1/2 miles, my bill for just gasoline will about 2 grand. That said, it would likely be somewhat lower, once I get into the US, and can buy that "cheap" American fuel. But this race has been on my bucket list since the first one was announced, and yeah, I flew in to watch in 2018, and had a great time, but now that I am 3000 miles closer, it`s a "must do". Even though my only FE powered vehicle at this time is the 59, (I still have the FE headers, oil pan, clutch linkage etc for the Fairmont in the shed), I just have to run something with a FE at this event. We ain`t getting any younger........

[gregaba]

I guess i was wrong on the cost. I went back and read the 2 stories and they said it cost more if you use the quick charging stations. Not if you charged at home with the 110V.
I stand corrected.
Greg

[WConley]

Yeah, here in Southern California the DC fast charge stations are over twice as expensive.  That starts getting you to the cost of an equivalent gas-powered rig.

Of course, if you're my brother and you live in Charlotte, you only pay 6 CENTS per KW-hr.  Driving an EV there is almost free.

That reporter also didn't mention the high upfront cost to get into an EV.  My EV pickup lists at about $20K more than a nicely optioned 2022 F-150 Lariat.  That'll buy a lot of gas.  (We got the EV because my wife works for Rivian and we got a subsidized deal.  That made it a no-brainer...)

[428 GALAXIE]

And here i pay 9 dollar for a gallon today.....

I hear you Heo!
I don't bother calculate gallon price because it ain't that simple.
And price of steel,iron and other heavy industry goods is in steep uphill I'll bet I'm out of work by summer ....

[Heo]

And here i pay 9 dollar for a gallon today.....

I hear you Heo!
I don't bother calculate gallon price because it ain't that simple.
And price of steel,iron and other heavy industry goods is in steep uphill I'll bet I'm out of work by summer ....

Lets hope atleast you dont get univited guests again like you got in1940

[gdaddy01]

they could be glowing, let's hope not.

[cjshaker]

When discussing the efficiency of EV's, lets not forget that they are absolutely useless in cold climates. Efficiency drops like a rock. Or how about any type of farm usage? How long would an electric tractor last pulling a huge plow, or tiller? How far does a truck go in Alaska, or any northern states/countries or provinces during the long winter months? There are millions of people who have absolutely no valid use for EV's, but hey, screw 'em, right?

[cammerfe]

I've seen that written 'SCROOM' a number of times.

KS

[BigBlueIron]

For semi and agriculture I truly don't understand why nobody has gone diesel electric, like a train. Arguably one of the most efficient ways of transportation.  And something I would interested in owning.

Seems its either all IC or electric. Hybrid is being looked over anymore.  No way would I go with a 100% electric vehicle, but that's my prerogative.

[Falcon67]

Our 2014 Fusion Hybrid was a great car.  Roomy, fast, comfy, 38 MPG more or less.  Had later issues with the PCM but that was eventually resolved.

[oldiron.fe]

                                                                                                                                                           our high might get in the 20s today- the only damn thing that will work around here is a hybrid -- ford      pickups with diesel have TWO big alternators one for electric heater - your butt will be cold for a long                  time for the truck to warm up  unless you are pulling a HEAVY load uphill around in winter here !!                    in the cold part of winter here you need real good fuel or additive to keep fuel from gelling up!! when it is really cold here -20/30 not counting wind chill this winter -40/50 exposed skin freezes in around               15 minutes-- you better have good heater for motor or indoor garage with heat or you will never start   up -- gas with synthetic oil and fuel injection may start!!   as old SOB i have been outside when it was   50/51 below zero real temp w/o wind chill--- had to add gas to keep number 1 fuel flowing to heat                home as tank was outside and fuel would not flow without gas!!---not often that cold but when it is gear lube is very close to not flowing/frozen!!   need to get rid of all the batterys after dead and do not want to be near big battery in bad crash with the battery powered fire!!     

[gregaba]

I know around here that the EMT's are having to go to school to learn how and when it is safe for them ro extract an injured person from an EV.
If they can't get the power cut off then you are just out of luck.
Greg

[RustyCrankshaft]

For semi and agriculture I truly don't understand why nobody has gone diesel electric, like a train. Arguably one of the most efficient ways of transportation.  And something I would interested in owning.

Seems its either all IC or electric. Hybrid is being looked over anymore.  No way would I go with a 100% electric vehicle, but that's my prerogative.

There are a TON of hybrid commercial vehicles on the road. We have a fleet of over 1400, currently we are 100% hybrid. They SUCK. They are un-reliable and literally double the cost in maintenance on a yearly basis's and over double on a life-cycle cost versus the identical equipment spec'd with regular diesel power. Not to mention the quadruple cost to purchase new. But, to help offset the cost is the fuel mileage increase of the hybrid. We are currently saving .63 MPG average over the 1400+ vehicles. Subtract that from the huge increase in downtime (if it's in the shop your spending money instead of making money) and the additional maintenance costs and it's a money loosing idea. The ONLY reason we still run them is because of politics. If it wasn't for ESG scoring at the Bank and the political pressure we would dump these in a heartbeat.

I'm sure the counter argument will be it's just because the technology hasn't matured. Well, we've been running commercial sized hybrids since 2003 and the reliability and cost to maintain and operate has NOT gone down 20 years and 3 generations of technological updates.

Also, ALL of the battery packs these use are either manufactured in China or are manufactured here with materials from either China or Russia. The average battery life has improved from 5 years to around 6.5 years. Let me just say, there isn't really any industry set up to handle these batteries and the ones that are "recycled", yeah most of those get shipped off shore and are burred in a field in Malaysia.

I've also seen several people fried from EV's and hybrids, both in accidents and due to unfamiliar maintenance procedures. 

I'm not a fan of hybrid or 100% battery stuff from an environmental or trade standpoint. I LOVE them from a maintenance stand point. The OT has bought me a LOT of nice stuff and contributed nicely to my retirement fund. We've also had to hire drastically more people because of them. Roughly the same fleet size in 2003 and we had around 240 mechanics, by 2007 we were around 290-310 to keep up with the additional work. Our test fleet of 100% battery stuff (on the commercial side, we've already had issues with our automotive fleet that's in-service) is likely going to be around half again as much maintenance increase as we saw with hybrids. With the increased disposal issues to go with this stuff.

[babybolt]

Ford dropped the small diesel engine in the F-150 in 2022.  They still have the diesel in the Superduty of course.

[oldiron.fe]

                                                                                                                                                               I guess i will drive the speed limit for awhile-- the battery would be dead by the time you got the glass  ice chipped off and defrosted maybe they can issue snow mobile boots and suit and shotgun fees for a rider to scrape snow/ice around here-----or a really long time ago scrape ice/snow and drive your beater if you could start it with the windows open below zero so windows would not ice from the inside -usually a pan full of charcoal under the motor could do the trick --heavy equipment either never shut off in bad weather or pipe a little copper tube dripping fuel into a cut off steel barrel keep the fire lit-- try not to burn stuff up!!-- in the late 50s had a few nasty cold winter spells never shut stuff off stuff    but  .18 cent gas helped!!!---------------- a friend works on diesel p/u&trucks the twin alternator p/us  are really bad no room like damn new car!!

[oldiron.fe]

                                                                                                                                                              -P.S. if you do not have a diesel P/U the second alternator is for electric cab heater untill you have engine heat-do not know if all ford p/u or north country sales only

[TomP]

.  And a guy in Ca said their media people like to show pictures of some off the wall price, usually from a rip off station 90 miles from anywhere. LOL

I notice that. I saw a sign showing seven bucks or so , it said in Mendocino County. So I checked Gas Buddy and several stations there are in the high four buck range.

[HarleyJack17]

RustyCrankshaft hit the nail on the head. The green energy sell is a pipe dream and only exists to create new markets, make more money. At least at current technology. We all want to save our planet, but no one wants to look past the commercials or news and actually research anything. Nothing green is actually green that is being mass marketed. But many of politicians are invested in it, so push push push the idea...sounds good must be good.
I hear what was said on the gas prices and then adding inflation into the mix. Agree but disagree. Here is AR I went from filling up once a week at $55 to $90. Inflation is a constant, but almost doubling a cost week in and week out hits everyone's pocket book. Then it gets worse as time goes on with more price increases, which we have seen historical levels on since 2019. How does inflation work there? Adjust gas to make it seem like it does not hit so hard....well what about the extra food costs, utility costs...in the end it is less and less money for end consumers, because we are the ones that pay. Business gets effected but they have the ability to pass some of the costs on to...yep us. Time will tell but fuel prices normally are a big economic indicator/driver, but in this new market, who knows...

[Quisp21]

https://theweek.com/articles/472473/chevy-volts-89000-production-cost-waste-money

[WConley]

https://theweek.com/articles/472473/chevy-volts-89000-production-cost-waste-money

That 7-year-old article is quite misleading.  The $89,000 estimate is not production cost, but includes the whole engineering program development cost amortized over 21,000 units.  That's not reality.  By the end of 2018, the numbers show that GM had sold over 177,000 units.  Production cost was closer to $28,000 per unit in parts and labor. 

Having said that, the Volt was indeed a money loser for GM.  It was necessary though to get them moving on electrification (after blowing their huge lead 25 year ago).  Like it or not, auto companies that don't embrace electrification are going the way of the dinosaur.