help with 428 cj for torino talladega

[mike714]

I'm Restoring a 69 Talladega with 428cj . The problem i have is that all of the guy's on the reg restry know one thing put it back stock and if you don't it's a sin well I'm a sinner and I don't do stock. Most of the guys that have these cars don't drive them because they are so rare. I'm going to drive mine .The car was raced by a dealer and had headers and slapper bars on it when I got it and when I took the motor apart it had thin mls head gaskets larger than stock valves adjustable rockers but it is standard bore  the writing in the lifter valley from assembly was still there and the ford sticker was still on the flywheel it had not been ran very much. My friend thinks the heads are the Canadian ones.  So what I want to do is build the motor in a way that at a glance you can't tell what I have done. I know some things you can't hide like headers . Here is what I came up with. I'm going to use a blue printed oil pump +25% volume and pressure some sort of t pan, arp main studs and rod bolts srp or Je pistons I haven't made up mind if I'm going to internally balance or leave it external but will be balanced. Stock heads blue thunder intake and thinking of roller rockers with flat cam haven't made the choice on that some advice would help there. I'm going to try to keep the compression around stock 10.6 to 11 or do I need to be in the 9 range ? Will this work?

[turbohunter]

My friend thinks the heads are the Canadian ones. 

As for me, what you can't see don't count against you.
But I'm certainly no expert.
I'm not familiar with Canadian heads. What's the deal there. Are they normal Ford part numbers, chambers, ports,etc.?
Why would they be on a Talladega?
Love to see some pics of your car.

[mike714]

It was raced by keats ford in trenton nj. The part numbers for the heads are correct n head. I don't mind taking some heat for not putting it back stock . But I was thinking the same thing if you can't see it who cares. The blue thunder intake looks the same just no casting numbers if I paint it don't think the average person can tell. The only reason I asked the question is I know just enough about fe engines to be dangerous and one of the guy's on the regrestry said not to use t pan or roller rockers because he use to race 428 and it was a bad idea, the strange thing is he the one that sells a lot of the restoration parts. You think he might be wanting to sell some parts?

[fastback 427]

Welcome to the forum and cool car mike! I had a 69 torino fastback 428,4spd, r code drag pack. Love those cars. I personally like a restomod vs all original resto. To me, headers, dizzy, cam, intake, carb, etc is all Bolt on. It can be changed back if needed. Nothing wrong with personalizing your torino as you see fit. Are you going for a driver? Street strip? Compression will depend on the fuel you are willing to run. Some of the guys here run big squeeze with a big cam too bleed off compression.  Maybe get a list of your wants and requirements for the car, then get a budget in mind and let the members here help. Great group if guys here and tons of knowledge on tap!

[turbohunter]

one of the guy's on the regrestry said not to use t pan or roller rockers because he use to race 428 and it was a bad idea, the strange thing is he the one that sells a lot of the restoration parts. You think he might be wanting to sell some parts?

That's one of the things you can be sure won't happen here.
Great guys with no agenda except they love FEs.

[jayb]

I'm Restoring a 69 Talladega with 428cj . The problem i have is that all of the guy's on the reg restry know one thing put it back stock and if you don't it's a sin well I'm a sinner and I don't do stock. Most of the guys that have these cars don't drive them because they are so rare. I'm going to drive mine .The car was raced by a dealer and had headers and slapper bars on it when I got it and when I took the motor apart it had thin mls head gaskets larger than stock valves adjustable rockers but it is standard bore  the writing in the lifter valley from assembly was still there and the ford sticker was still on the flywheel it had not been ran very much. My friend thinks the heads are the Canadian ones.  So what I want to do is build the motor in a way that at a glance you can't tell what I have done. I know some things you can't hide like headers . Here is what I came up with. I'm going to use a blue printed oil pump +25% volume and pressure some sort of t pan, arp main studs and rod bolts srp or Je pistons I haven't made up mind if I'm going to internally balance or leave it external but will be balanced. Stock heads blue thunder intake and thinking of roller rockers with flat cam haven't made the choice on that some advice would help there. I'm going to try to keep the compression around stock 10.6 to 11 or do I need to be in the 9 range ? Will this work?

Bravo!  In the words of a good friend of mine, "Stockers are Boring!"

You don't want to bore and stroke the engine any?  Cubic inches are the surest way to bigger power, and you can't see them.  You could put a 4.375" reciprocating assembly in there and bump up to 470 cubic inches, picking up boatloads of torque and horsepower along the way.  On the cam, pick out a nice roller, maybe a hydraulic if you want low maintenance.  You can run the 10.6 to 11 compression on the street very easily if you pick the right cam to optimize your dynamic compression ratio. 

It wasn't clear to me from your post if you will be running headers or not.  I hope so  , but if not get your stock cast iron exhaust manifolds extrude honed so they flow a little more.  Doesn't help a lot, but it will help some. 

I think with minimal effort you could get to a nice, streetable 550 HP with the setup described above, assuming you went with the headers.  By the way, I would also like to see some pictures of your car...

[talladega]

Hi Mike
I have 192063, maroon.  I went with a hotter cam, hvhp oil pump, T-pan, double pumper.  Very few people that see a Talladega have any idea what it is anyway and you should build it the way you'll enjoy it.  Definitely go with a looser torque converter.  Even my part throttle shifts into 2nd chirp the tires.

[fastback 427]

To my knowledge the canadian cobra jet heads are ultra rare. They were made specifically for certaun race teams in 68. They have 427 chamber and larger runners. Nhra questioned ford about them and ford explained they were export heads to canada. Nhra then factored them at an extra 80 hp. Very cool.

[Barry_R]

If I had a Talledega I would stick the original motor in a plastic bag in front of the garage for the next owner to fawn over.  And I would build a 600 HP NASCAR looking tunnel port and have some fun.

[mike714]

Thanks  guys, the reason I came to this forum is every body seams to know what they are talking about. I want to drive it on the street and some weekend racing on pump gas. The only reason I bought this car is when I was a kid my dad had 428 scj cougar and I was trying to find one when I found this car. He would sit me on the radiator support while he was working on it and that was a lot. He blew the motor 6 or 7 times but they didn't have the technology we have today and they were new and very few people knew how to work on them. That is why I'm trying to make sure I get it wright. If I don't get to carried away with it. I just didn't know if the fe had a problem with roller cam and lifters after he said that. I have built my share of motors just not fe . normally I use the +25 volume and pressure 8 or 9 quart oil pan balanced Bottom, roller cam and rockers ,forged pistons aluminum intake and heads.  Than for the help

[mike714]

My car is t he one on  thenumn regrestry under talladega dragster if you click on it there are pictures of the car when it was raced. It looks the same today well before I started cutting the rust out. I need to order the pistons srp has -5 cc then it jumps to -22 and - 26 can i run the -5 cc or do I need to run the - 22 or 26? The crank is 1 ub and had the weight in the center is that correct the flywheel has weight but the balancer didn't is that correct The rod c7ae-b the balancer Looks like c4ae

[CaptCobrajet]

I had a white Talladega many years ago..............sent you a PM.  The 1UB does have the center counterweight.  The rods are correct.  There is no weight in the damper or sleeve with a 1UB.  Only the 1UA used the weighted sleeve.

[Ididntdoit]

If I had a Talledega I would stick the original motor in a plastic bag in front of the garage for the next owner to fawn over.  And I would build a 600 HP NASCAR looking tunnel port and have some fun.

+1 on this - I would love to see it - great idea

[bn69stang]

Nice car , i agree with Barry take that motor and store it and build you a motor and enjoy the car and most of all have fun with it every time you drive it .... Bud

[mike714]

It is not the original motor. Normally I would do something like that but I'm trying to not get carried away like I did with the last car I built .it started of a restomod and ended up a drag car with a motor that wasn't streetable. But if someone wants to build something like that I have a extra talladega reproduction front clip all you need is a torino body the 600 hp motor and it's on.