My 427 SOHC Build..... Finally the time has come!

[BattlestarGalactic]

Sadly, if you run it with a bad setting long enough, it will ruin the gear set.  It doesn't take long.

[cobracammer]

Yea no biggie.  Anyway, I was going to wait a bit, but it kind of bothers me  LOL.

I ran back out there today and pulled it all apart again.  I am going to set it up with the new gear, pinion and bearings (So I know its correct).

As a side note, I was thinking about what I found on the original inspection.  As I had said, there was originally 2 pinion shims when I pulled the pinion assembly the first time.  They were 2 separate 0.020" shims.  From what I read online, it seems like the "normal" shim size needed is between 0.015 and 0.023 roughly?  Mine had 0.040" from the get go.  Seems excessive as a starting point, no?  I am thinking that the person assembling it grabbed a 0.020 pinion shim, and there were 2 stuck together?  Maybe there should have only been 1 pinion shim of 0.020" to start?  Dunno.

Let you know (and I will take some photos as I assemble) how it goes this time around.

[Drew Pojedinec]

Don’t check gear mesh until you set case spread and bearing preload.
15in lb bearing drag is decent and .008 case spread.

With a solid spacer you often need to test fit more to get everything right. I keep old bearings around that I cut internally larger for test fitting purposes. Makes it easier to take apart.

[cobracammer]

Hey Drew,

The case spread of 0.008.  I am guessing thats how you know you have to correct Carrier Bearing preload?  Its the only thing I cant find a tool for (most people seem to cut up an extra 31 spline axle and weld a nut on the end so they can check preload with a torque wrench.

is 0.008" the preload for a Ford 9"?

[Drew Pojedinec]

That is your case spread. Very good, it preloads the carrier bearings. I set it with a dial indicator.

Pinion bearings also need preload. You check it with a solid spacer by tightening pinion nut and turning the whole rotation with a dial type type wrench. The resistance is how it is measured. Ignore the break away torque and focus on a nice long steady pull once everything is moving. Should require 15 in lb or torque to keep turning.
With a crush sleeve this isn’t too hard but you can get a false positive as it gets tight BEFORE the sleeve starts to crush.
With a solid spacer you need to have your shims set on the spacer first.
I keep spare old bearings around with the center honed so i can use it to test fit. Thus avoiding having to press it on and off.

Shame you can’t drive up to Georgia, I have all the tools and junk here to do this easily.

[cobracammer]

Ok I got to that point.  I think I did it correctly and tightened the ring gear side adjuster to get. 0.008" case deflection.  Is it supposed to feel so still to turn?  I can spin it ( and its smooth) but stops spinning almost immediately.  What is proper carrier bearing preload supposed to feel like ( spinning the ring gear)?  Thanks again!

[Drew Pojedinec]

Fresh builds are tight.
Add oil and heat and it’ll be fine.

[machoneman]

Funny, but I knew a guy who would paint the ring gear with highly abrasive valve lapping compound to 'save' some gear sets somebody else installed and messed up. Old Gene would 'drive' the gears a few minutes (car on blocks, tires off the ground!) with just a spray of rearend gear fluid, then clean off the compound with white gas (or whatever he had on hand), fill the rear up and drive it! Shade tree, old school, cheap and NOT recommended.... but it often worked for him!

[cobracammer]

OK, got the pinion (daytona) support disassembled.  Findings..... 

1.Bearings are ok, but I will install new ones that came with the rebuild kit.

2. Races- also ok as there is barely 100 Miles on this car in total since installed..... I might keep the old bear races as they are in such great shape.

3. There was no crush sleeve.  This unit was originally built with a solid spacer (with no additional shims) to attain proper pre-load on the pinion.

I have a analog in lb torque wrench coming today.  This will allow me to test pre-load before installing and checking pinion depth.  Pinion depth is marked on the new pinion itself and is listed as 1.036"

I have a depth Micrometer to enable me to check and shim until I am 1.036" from Ring gear centerline.

Hopefully with this being a new ring and pinion, I will be able to see a proper pattern when its time to test.

:0)

[Drew Pojedinec]

Always save your old bearings. Sometimes the inner shell of one is helpful to fully press another on.

[cobracammer]

OK where I am at right now....

I got the pinion and housing all broken down.  Using the solid spacer and shims purchase, I went at getting 25 in lbs of preload on the pinion.

The old pinion pulled out had a solid spacer with no extra shims.  It measured 0.500" .  For Sh!ts and giggles, I reinstalled the original 0.500" spacer and gave that a try.  At 200 ft lbs or torque on the pinion nut. I had "0" in lbs of preload.  LOL

Then I disassembled and put in my new solid spacer that came with my rebuild kit (measuring 0.450") and have that a shot.  Since it was smaller, I decided to slowly torque to pinion nut and check the drag as I went.  With only 50 ft lbs of torque, it was not budging (turning).

OK....  somewhere between this 0.450 and 0.500" spacer is my ideal.  Then I tried 0.013 shim for a total of 0.463".....  no luck, 75 in lbs of torque to turn.  Then 0.018 shim for a total of 0.468.. nope.... to tight.  Then 0.480- Nope  ended up being like 0.492 or there about.......  after its all put back together with the pinion seal in place, I was getting 30 in lbs of preload (thats with the seal so about 25 to 25 without the seal.  Since the shims only came in 0.012, 0.013, 0.015, 0.018, 0.020...  I was just lucky I did not need minor  shims.  (somewhere I heard there are packs of 0.001 shims for fine tuning). 

In the end, Pinion is all set.  Will be checking pinion depth (maybe adding a shim) and then patterns!!!  I will post pictures of my patters before I reinstall.  Just to be sure I am getting the "perfect" pattern.....:0)

[cobracammer]

Alright.  Here is where we are.

I took my newly acquired tools and wanted to get an accurate pinion depth reading.  The pinion itself has the CD of 1.016" (pinion depth).  I used this method:

1st, I measured the OD of the carrier bearing race and marked that number down.
2nd, I divided that measurement in half and wrote it down.
3rd, using a depth micrometer, I measured from the parting line in the case (bearing caps) to the deepest part of the bearing journal (marking this measurement down.
4th... now, the measurement from the parting line to the deepest part of the bearing journal was 0.003" greater than the measurement of 1/2 the OD of the bearing race.  This means the parting line in the case is not actually the centerline.... its 0.003" higher.
5th, I took a measurement with the depth micrometer from the parting line closest to the pinion "tip" and marked this measurement down.  Since the parting cap is 0.003" higher than the actual center line, I subtracted the 0.003" from the pinion tip measurement and got the actual pinion depth from centerline.  Using a 0.015" shim, I was able to get the actual pinion depth to 0.017" (only 0.001" from the measurement marked on the actual pinion of 0.016")


With that completed, and after getting the pinion put together earlier today, I moved on to setting carrier bearing pre-load and backlash.  I got the pre-load set (without the pinion installed), then installed the pinion and set backlash.  I have backlash set at 0.009" to 0.010".

I torqued down the main caps, torqued down the pinion carrier bolts, and smeared on some marking compound and.........

First picture is the Drive side (seems too low for being almost exact on the manufacturers pinion depth)

Second picture is the Coast side, which seems almost perfect.

Not sure if this is acceptable because if I change pinion depth to raise drive side, I will be off of spec and it will also mess up the already perfect coast side.


The last photo is the correct pattern per US Gear (Strange).  It appears from their image that drive would be a little lower than coast, but not sure if my current pattern is ok.

Please let me know what your thoughts are!  I just stopped for the night until I consulted you all.

[Drew Pojedinec]

No expert on these. But as long as everything is to spec, sometimes getting them both *nearly* there is as good as it gets.

I have had this issue with using a case, gears, bearings etc all from different manufacturers. If it was me tho, I prefer to get the load side closer to ideal than the coast side.

[BattlestarGalactic]

Use a drill and spin the pinion as you put drag on ring gear.  If it spins smooth, run t.  If you feel a noise then alter depth a touch and run it again.  If you feel any buzz, that means it will ring while driving and is likely out of place.  Not scientific, but worked well for me.

[cobracammer]

OK guys.  Here it is.  I would ask for feed back, but there is nowhere to go from here as I went all the way up to a .040 shim and then went back to what looked the best.

I ended up back at 0.032 " shim which put the drive side and the coast side directly in the middle of the tooth.  I know it looks a little close to the tip of the tooth on the drive side, but adding shims all the way up to 0.040" did not make it go any deeper.

Here it is.  Spins smooth, backlash at 0.009" and everything torqued to spec.

First picture is Drive side

second photo is coast side

Thoughts?