fuel pumps electric vs mech

[GJCAT427]

I need to replace the pump on my 63 427 Galaxie  after the Beaver Springs melt down. Lost the pump after first time trial So I been stewing on going electric or replacing the standard pump. I have 2 in mind, A Carter P4600HP or the Edelbrock 1724 Both have 3/8" inlet and outlets. I don`t drive the car as much as I once did, but I do run it. I read the discussion on the FE forum about getting a RobbMC pump but getting a donor pump seems unlikely. A Clay Smith pump seems to be overkill on the inlet/outlet size for street/strip use. I know if I go electric its gonna be some wiring which doesn't bother me. Any suggestions?

[Ford428CJ]

I'm a fan of the Carter 4600HP pump. Used it on a couple different apps. From my FE 4x4, FE powered Boat and a diesel conversion in a 79 Ford 4x4. With a relay wired in and fused. They have been flawless! It's quiet and you won't be disappointed in it. Pending the HP level of course. JMHO

[shady]

I like running both. a good mech. & an electric on a switch. That way you always have a backup & the electric is nice for filling the carbs after a long period of rest.

[cjshaker]

I know nearly everyone likes the electrics now, but I'm still partial to the mechanicals. There are some drawbacks to the electrics, in my opinion. One being in the event of a bad situation, the electric will keep pumping fuel like a fire hose, which can cause a nasty situation to become very bad, very quickly. The only way to overcome that is some sort of inertia switch, like new cars have. Another is just the complication of switches and relays and more wiring to go bad or fail. And since electrics are typically located near the rear, that leaves a lot of line and hose connections between the pump and carb that can spray fuel in the event of a rupture. A mechanical only has the short distance from the bottom of the block to the carb.

I know there's a horsepower limit as to what a mechanical can feed, but you and I aren't there yet. My Edelbrock pump reliably feeds 500hp with no issues, and there are better ones that will feed up to 600+hp. I keep considering an electric for the Mustang, but I just haven't had a need to or see a reason to when the mechanical has been working without issues for so many years. Even the over-the-counter Carters have served me well on stockish engines for many many years.

That was a bummer that your pump failed at Beaver. Hopefully we'll both have the bugs worked out next year. Hope to see you and your boy there again.

[Ford428CJ]

That's when you use a oil pressure type switch. Engine dies, then the fuel pump does too. You could run that with this. Like Doug was saying

http://m.summitracing.com/parts/prf-80160?seid=srese1&gclid=CjwKEAjwmdu5BRCg1O3a-tDY0AQSJACKPgRKOA30B3Ox8qlwDoI7uhXE5GkQ5juUr4Twf9tztZuhKBoCvEjw_wcB

[AlanCasida]

I'm running a Clay Smith pump on the 521(sorry not FE) in my 66 Galaxie. It feeds a Quick Fuel 1050 just fine. I got the bottom feed adapter for mine and the inlet comes up from the bottom and the outlet from the side. I went with the mech pump for Dragweek because a several guys had problems with their electric pumps running in the heat. I had no such problems and I also got the press regulator from McRobb with the pressure bleed return adapter to help with vapor lock issues.

[jayb]

I ran that Clay Smith mechanical pump for the FE in my Mach 1 at Drag Week in 2005.  Had no trouble feeding the 700 HP 511" FE with the 1150 Dominator carb.  I also used it with a return style fuel system, which worked well also.

[machone]

Robb Mc recently made me a FE pump.  You need to supply him with a new standard pump, and he will modify it.  I got the 1100HP one for its fuel pressure adjustability.
No harm in contacting him.

[GJCAT427]

What make pump did you send him? What size inlet/outlet was it?

[Dryhoze1]

What make pump did you send him? What size inlet/outlet was it?

Hope this helps !

Past msg from Robb


The easiest is to use a low performance mechanical pump to feed our PowerSurge:
http://www.robbmcperformance.com/products/powersurge.html

Your other option is to supply us with a new old stock or rebuilt/remanufactured stock pump from which we can take the arm, upper housing and diaphragm assembly. It must be an Airtex, or AC brand part number 40345


The pump MUST HAVE a 3-5/8" diameter upper housing. All the new pumps that are still available have a smaller diameter housing or a different design and will not work with the RobbMc valve body.


Once you supply us with the correct 40345 pump, we can use it to build a RobbMc 550HP or 1100HP pump for you. The cost will be $175 for the 550HP or $275 for the 1100HP.

Robb

[Drew Pojedinec]

Have the HP4600 Carter.
Love it.  Reasonably quiet
Have it wired to an oil psi switch, pump will shut off with less than 5psi.
If a relay mounted near the battery, an oil pressure switch mounted on the engine is "too much wiring" for you, well....

In my case, living in a very hot environment, pumping fuel to an engine mounted mechanical pump picks up a lot of heat and transfers it to the gasoline.

[jgkurz]

That's when you use a oil pressure type switch. Engine dies, then the fuel pump does too. You could run that with this. Like Doug was saying

http://m.summitracing.com/parts/prf-80160?seid=srese1&gclid=CjwKEAjwmdu5BRCg1O3a-tDY0AQSJACKPgRKOA30B3Ox8qlwDoI7uhXE5GkQ5juUr4Twf9tztZuhKBoCvEjw_wcB

Hi Doug, I have a new engine build that should make decent power where I have decided to stay with a mechanical fuel pump. I chose a RobbMC pump for my needs. I like electric pumps just fine but for my "period correct" look and the benefits you stated I went mechanical.

[Landlubberatsea]

Jay, found an old thread in another forum where you mentioned that the Clay Smith needed some work to the pump and block to fit. Do you or anyone else here know if that is still the case or if they have changed the design so it will fit better now on a 390? / Jan

[jayb]

Its been so long ago I forgot about that!  When I got the pump it didn't work.  I took it apart and found that the one of the check valves was lying in the internal pump cavity, if I recall correctly.  I had to press it back into place and stake it so that it would stay there.  Then the pump worked, but I think I had to grind on the case a little to make it clear some part of the engine.  Again, can't remember for sure.

I doubt that they have changed the design any, so you might have to watch out for the same thing.  Have you got a link to the old post?  Maybe reading it would refresh my memory...

[thatdarncat]

Jay, found an old thread in another forum where you mentioned that the Clay Smith needed some work to the pump and block to fit. Do you or anyone else here know if that is still the case or if they have changed the design so it will fit better now on a 390? / Jan

If I remember correctly ( and I may not, so correct me ) I think Jay's issue with the block interference was with his aftermarket ( Shelby? ) aluminum block. I don't remember if he checked it with a Ford cast iron block.

[Landlubberatsea]

Here is the link from the good ol' days 
http://www.network54.com/Forum/74182/thread/1085271201/Clay+Smith+FE+Fuel+Pump

[jayb]

2004, no wonder I didn't remember.  The 492" engine was a factory 427 block, and after re-reading the post I do remember doing some of that grinding.  Barry also says that those pumps aren't that great, but at least the one I had kept up with my engine...

[Qikbbstang]

I'm completely lost on this "advice":
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Re:
Hope this helps !
Past msg from Robb
The easiest is to use a low performance mechanical pump to feed our PowerSurge:
http://www.robbmcperformance.com/products/powersurge.html

Your other option is to supply us with a new old stock or rebuilt/remanufactured stock pump from which we can take the arm, upper housing and diaphragm assembly. It must be an Airtex, or AC brand part number 40345
The pump MUST HAVE a 3-5/8" diameter upper housing. All the new pumps that are still available have a smaller diameter housing or a different design and will not work with the RobbMc valve body.
Once you supply us with the correct 40345 pump, we can use it to build a RobbMc 550HP or 1100HP pump for you. The cost will be $175 for the 550HP or $275 for the 1100HP.
Robb
---------------------------------------------------------------
     
The easiest is to use a low performance mechanical pump to feed our PowerSurge:
http://www.robbmcperformance.com/products/powersurge.html

              (1) Why/How does one use a mechanical pump to feed an electrical pump??  The link IS to an Electric Pump. 

              (2) The use of a "disposable" AC Pump, arm,  body w/crimped construction to build a power surge pump  ? 
              (3) Power Surge: An easy-to-install electric fuel system for carburetors and fuel injection. What kind of carb uses more than a fraction of the pressure of fuel Inj?  A pump for both F-inj and carb??
             (4) "No need to get under your car: The PowerSurge can be installed in your engine compartment. Connect it to your stock fuel pump, vapor return line and and a bypass regulator. Then connect one wire to switched 12V power and one to ground. That's it. No crawling around under the car to install. Because the electric fuel pump in the PowerSurge is submerged in gasoline, the pump is very quiet and runs very cool. Also, because it is submerged, there is no chance of the pump sucking air into the system during acceleration or cornering. "
                    The pump is submerged in gasoline- but it's installed in engine compartment....??