Guess the horsepower game....

[428 GALAXIE]

I wouldn't protest if you put it back to dyno and dig another five ponies more....
Just saying   

[blykins]

It would seem the hype about the trick flow heads might be valid although can’t understand why they missed the mark on the rocker pads.. I wonder what the output might be on a 445??  Maybe the massaging of the intake is the secret...... but it doesn’t matter cause it’s a damn fine engine..

We will have to wait until there are more dyno tests done I suppose.  I think Blair has one coming up, although he may have massaged his heads to get rid of the point where they backed up and went turbulent.  I didn't touch mine, just bought them bare with valves, checked the valve job, cc'd a port, cc'd some chambers, and assembled valvetrain for the camshaft.   I have another set up of TFS heads here, but they're going on a 465ci bracket engine. 

Keep in mind that this was quite a bit of camshaft for a 390, 240/243 @ .050".  To be honest, that's within a few degrees of what I use in my 482's for a 5500-6000 rpm peak.   I put the cam on a 103 ICL.  I felt that it was necessary to do that for street car operation.  It may have made more power with the cam retarded from that position and then again, it may not have.

All of the engines that I've used BBM and SM heads on have been stroker 390's, 428's, and 427's.   I haven't put any on a 390.  I will say, that on the dyno here, the street 445's and 462's are usually around the 525-535 hp range.  So, on this dyno, the little 390 equaled the horsepower.

The engine is going in a Thunderbolt "clone", minus the 427.    Last I heard, the owner was going to stab a TKO 600 behind it and deepen the rear gear.  I think it's going to be an absolute blast.

"How much horsepower does your engine make?" 

"It made over 500 hp on the dyno."

"445?"

"No, it's just a 390." 

What's interesting, is that even using Jay's ~10% correction, it still had about 425 lb-ft of torque at 3500. 

The owner fell about 25' off a ladder a few months back and completely busted up his shoulder.   Unfortunately, we may not hear about how it works in the car for quite a while.

[blykins]

Just as a comparison....

If we compare dyno results to dyno results, this is a 427 with ported medium riser heads:

http://fepower.net/simplemachinesforum/index.php?topic=4613.0

[Barry_R]

1.19 tq/cube is a good solid number for a street performance engine.  Just under 500 should make for a fun 390

[Joey120373]

Dang, i was off by 15 HP, uncorrected anyway.

Great build, and is it safe to say the TFS heads are pretty good?

   

[preaction]

Brent did you use 93 octane fuel ?

[Joey120373]

Forgot to say thanks for sharing, you gave us really nice pictures and detailed specs, as well as a photo of the best ( and cutest ) shop helper ever.

[Eric Hardesty]

   That is a stout 390.  It is a good comparison between your average machine shop built
300-350 HP 390 and a pro engine builder.  Double the price, but almost double the HP.
 This thing should run mid to high 11’s in a light Fairlane. 

[Heo]

Well i was just 1 hp over Jays corrected Hp.....well i live at sea level so...thats my excuse

[Joe-JDC]

I think I nailed the corrected hp?  Strong street engine.  Joe-JDC

[shady]

"Shady" is right, seeing as how he upped my guess by ONE horsepower to win. Those damn Price Is Right rules that you employed, Brent

I almost feel guilty. Maybe I ought to have Brent send the goodies to you just for me being a dick. Nah, I never ever win anything so I'll relish in my victory. I did win the engine, right?

[blykins]

Will the Alternator belt be tight or loose ??
Is this the high rpm hydraulic you talked about earlier ??

558 HP is my swag for swag

This is not the high rpm one, although this one will probably get up there a little bit. 

BTW, the game is for *uncorrected* horsepower, not corrected.  Ain't no way this thing will make 558 uncorrected.  I'll let you change your answer. 

Brent, you build quite a few small blocks as far as I understand so I'll ask.  A 393/408 with heads that flowed same as the TFS would likely do 550-575 with this cam, there are so many of them out there it's a cookie cutter recipe by now.  Why do you feel the 390 would be down from there?   If you put a Victor on it, do you think it would gain up top?  I know the Victor likely wouldn't pull ahead til 5500 or 6000 on a 390, but for seems they help 20hp or so on the 445s that go to 6500 if a guy is willing to give up the low/midrange.

I'm not putting the FE down at all, just trying to solve the riddle of where the bottleneck is.  My guess is the transition from intake/intake port drops flow, but I have zero data to back it up.

If you want to compare what this engine did against other engines, we can do that...

Even if a dyno corrects 87%, it's still valid to compare against other builds on the same dyno.  The reason for the uncorrected numbers was so that the engine could be compared against other engines from other builders, on different dynos.  Most everyone will have access to the uncorrected figures.

So this engine made 538hp @ 6000 here, with 515 lb-ft @ 5000.  With the Dominator, it made 540 hp @ 6250 and carried it to 6500, with 515 lb-ft available @ 4750.

Other engines in my records that have similar horsepower to this one:

1.  445FE, Survival Motorsports heads, as cast, 235/241 @ .050", .613/.575, Performer RPM, 10:1, 525 hp @ 5500.
2.  433FE, ported C5AE-F heads, Sidewinder intake, 235/241 @ .050", .600/.600, 10.5:1, 526 hp @ 6000.
3.  438W, AFR 220cc heads, RPM Air Gap intake, 240/246 @ .050", .586/.590, 10.3:1, 535 hp @ 5700.
4.  408C, Edelbrock 351C heads, Performer RPM Air Gap intake, 240/244 @ .050", .622/.628, 10.5:1, 522 hp @ 6100.
5.  347 Clevor, CHI 185cc 3V heads, CHI 3V intake, 223/227 @ .050", .628/.635, 10.5:1, 517 hp @ 6250.
6.  347SBF, AFR 185cc heads, Victor Jr. intake, 230/236 @ .050", .600/.600, 11.25:1, 538 hp @ 6500.

I think the 390 did pretty stinkin well. 

[chilly460]

Looks good to me when looking at same dyno comps.  Nice to have another good option out there, this along with other info is making me lean to the TFS for the 462 build. 

Those 347s are making some power, trending head flow and cam size it looks like the single planes help them out quite a bit. 

[blykins]

Looks good to me when looking at same dyno comps.  Nice to have another good option out there, this along with other info is making me lean to the TFS for the 462 build. 

Those 347s are making some power, trending head flow and cam size it looks like the single planes help them out quite a bit.

That last 347 is in a little bracket car that will run 10.90's and needs the smallest restrictor plate available to run a 7.50 index.

[1968galaxie]

From Jays correction to his correction factor.

Pretty strong 390...

Edit:  OOPS!  A typo got me.  I originally had put 28.3 in the second term equation above, not 29.3.  Bad mistake.  The second term, with 29.3 used instead of 28.3, is 1.0418.  Now, multiplying the terms together you get a total correction factor of 1.0675, or 6.75%.  This means that corrected peak HP is 494, and corrected peak torque is 473.

Almost 500 hp, still an extremely well done 390!!!

Well done!!