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fryedaddy

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wont start
« on: February 13, 2020, 07:27:33 PM »
my 428 has not been wanting to start lately.i drove it last winter with no problems.now if i let it sit for more than 2 days,it dont want to crank.temps has been in the 35-50 range.i put new plugs in-no difference.i have msd box,dist,coil.once it finally cranks it runs like a top,starts like a champ until i let it sit for more than a day,then it wont crank.today i ran my batt down and it never started.i tried starting fluid one day and it finally started,but the next time even starting fluid diddnt help.  any ideas?
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1966 comet caliente 428 4 speed owned since 1983                                                 1973 f250 ranger xlt 360 4 speed papaw bought new

mike7570

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Re: wont start
« Reply #1 on: February 13, 2020, 07:47:24 PM »
Sounds fuel related.
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fryedaddy

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Re: wont start
« Reply #2 on: February 13, 2020, 08:47:42 PM »
the plugs i took out were gas soaked.it seems to be easily flooded in cold weather.if it dont start right away,forget it,its not going to start even if you try till the battery goes dead
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1966 comet caliente 428 4 speed owned since 1983                                                 1973 f250 ranger xlt 360 4 speed papaw bought new

dcm0123

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Re: wont start
« Reply #3 on: February 13, 2020, 09:25:35 PM »
It sounds like there are 2 problems- does not crank and sometimes cranks but does not start.

Suggest you fix the easier one first- cranking.

If it does not crank, either you have an electrical problem or the engine is hydro locked which means a cylinder has filled with a fluid (antifreeze) which can not be compressed so the engine can not rotate.

Makes sure the battery is fully charges, all battery cables are clean and tight including on the starter and the ground to the block.

If it still will not crank, Bypass the ignition switch starter contact by jumping the battery positive to the small terminal on the solenoid closest to the one which has the battery power on it. Make sure it is in park or neutral before you do this.

If it still does not crank, use a set of jumper cables to connect the terminal on the starter to the positive  battery, bypass everything. If it still does not carnk, you probably have a bad solenoid or starter.

The solenoid has to be grounded to the fender through the mounting bracket otherwise it will not connect power to the starter when power is applied to the small terminal. Clean the bracket and fender if needed so you have a good ground.

If you hear a loud clunk from the starter when you try to crank it and the engine rotates slightly, it is probably hydro locked.


« Last Edit: February 13, 2020, 09:35:43 PM by dcm0123 »
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fryedaddy

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Re: wont start
« Reply #4 on: February 13, 2020, 11:08:24 PM »
my engine is turning over when i push the starter button.it rotates but it will not start.it fires for about a half second and then it just turns over with no sighs of wanting to run.sorry for the confusion.it turns over great,good starter in it.it just dont want to run
« Last Edit: February 13, 2020, 11:12:26 PM by fryedaddy »
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1966 comet caliente 428 4 speed owned since 1983                                                 1973 f250 ranger xlt 360 4 speed papaw bought new

Barry_R

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Re: wont start
« Reply #5 on: February 14, 2020, 05:08:54 AM »
Try a coil.  Been there...
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shady

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Re: wont start
« Reply #6 on: February 14, 2020, 09:42:33 AM »
Yep, I had a new Echlin coil that acted just like that. Drove me nuts. Can't be the coil, it's new, right? Wrong.
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BigBlueIron

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Re: wont start
« Reply #7 on: February 14, 2020, 09:53:28 AM »
Does it kind of hit when you let off the key?
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fryedaddy

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Re: wont start
« Reply #8 on: February 14, 2020, 02:08:26 PM »
Quote from: BigBlueIron on February 14, 2020, 09:53:28 AM
Does it kind of hit when you let off the key?
no,it kind of hits at first then wont hit till i try it again, then it hits for a brief second again but will not crank.whats weird is if i manage to get it started,it runs like a top
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1966 comet caliente 428 4 speed owned since 1983                                                 1973 f250 ranger xlt 360 4 speed papaw bought new

BattlestarGalactic

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Re: wont start
« Reply #9 on: February 14, 2020, 02:25:38 PM »
Sounds electrical since the plugs get wet.

MSD distributor?   Get a new pickup coil.  Those typically just die, but maybe your's is weak?
Newer MSD box?  Does it have the LED light showing it's powered up?  Something else to look at.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2020, 02:27:10 PM by BattlestarGalactic »
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Larry

fryedaddy

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Re: wont start
« Reply #10 on: February 14, 2020, 03:52:26 PM »
it was slow starting a couple years ago and i put a new disc cap and rotor on it and it improved.i have a new disc pickup coil.i was going to install it with a new cap and rotor to see if that would help.my son had some mice nests in his vans electrical system.i hope i dont have mice damage.
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1966 comet caliente 428 4 speed owned since 1983                                                 1973 f250 ranger xlt 360 4 speed papaw bought new

allrightmike

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Re: wont start
« Reply #11 on: February 14, 2020, 04:31:19 PM »
If you have a stock key switch the ignition contacts may be worn out.
Mike.
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fryedaddy

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Re: wont start
« Reply #12 on: February 14, 2020, 04:42:52 PM »
Quote from: allrightmike on February 14, 2020, 04:31:19 PM
If you have a stock key switch the ignition contacts may be worn out.
Mike.
that could be it.i have a push button start button but you have to turn the key on too.im sure my stock switch is worn because it wont turn the starter over.thats why i have a start button
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1966 comet caliente 428 4 speed owned since 1983                                                 1973 f250 ranger xlt 360 4 speed papaw bought new

Heo

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Re: wont start
« Reply #13 on: February 14, 2020, 05:45:38 PM »
Try to hotwire the coil from +
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fryedaddy

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Re: wont start
« Reply #14 on: February 14, 2020, 05:54:36 PM »
now that i think about it,when i tried over and over to start it, it would try to fire when i turned the key off then back on,repeated after a while sometimes it started right up.that makes me think my switch is wore.
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1966 comet caliente 428 4 speed owned since 1983                                                 1973 f250 ranger xlt 360 4 speed papaw bought new

Heo

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Re: wont start
« Reply #15 on: February 14, 2020, 06:11:02 PM »
I had one car dont remember wich one, think it was a mustang. i had a lot of keys on the key ring
on rough road it missfired and stumbled until i just put in the ign key the wheight "missanligned" the
worn ign lock

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The defenition of a Gentleman, is a man that can play the accordion.But dont do it

Barry_R

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Re: wont start
« Reply #16 on: February 14, 2020, 07:34:14 PM »
Could be the starter relay or the ignition switch. 
The "I" terminal on the relay operates a contact that bypasses the resistor wire while cranking.
If the switch is bad it won't bypass.
If the relay is bad it won't bypass while cranking - just a quick "one hit" spark as you start or stop cranking.
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wowens

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Re: wont start
« Reply #17 on: February 14, 2020, 08:59:32 PM »
Quote from: Barry_R on February 14, 2020, 07:34:14 PM
Could be the starter relay or the ignition switch. 
The "I" terminal on the relay operates a contact that bypasses the resistor wire while cranking.
If the switch is bad it won't bypass.
If the relay is bad it won't bypass while cranking - just a quick "one hit" spark as you start or stop cranking.
Yep, had a inboard offshore boat do that. Bypass wire was corroded into at solenoid terminal. Shrink tubing held in in place and looked OK. Pulled on it, came apart. Cut off end, peeled back insulation, wrapped around terminal nut, cranked. Went fishing
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runthatjunk

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Re: wont start
« Reply #18 on: February 14, 2020, 09:39:35 PM »
I didn't see anywhere that you checked for spark.  Stick a screwdriver in end of wire from coil and see if have a good consistent spark when won't start and then work from there.
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shady

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Re: wont start
« Reply #19 on: February 15, 2020, 09:49:00 AM »
Did you swap the coil out? My bad one would still have a yellow spark to it but not enough to overcome the fuel. would fire up then stall and crank forever & flood the plugs. I would change the plugs and repeat the process.
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What goes fast doesn't go fast long'
What goes fast takes your money with it.
So I'm slow & broke, what went wrong?
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fryedaddy

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Re: wont start
« Reply #20 on: February 15, 2020, 03:39:08 PM »
went out to the garage today to see if i could get my comet started.i tried about 15 or 20 times and all it would do was try to fire briefly.then all of the sudden it acted like it might start,so i tried a few more times and right when the battery started dying,it fired up.drove it around a while,and it starts up now.i bet if i let it sit a few days it will act up again?
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1966 comet caliente 428 4 speed owned since 1983                                                 1973 f250 ranger xlt 360 4 speed papaw bought new

1964Fastback

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Re: wont start
« Reply #21 on: February 15, 2020, 04:56:20 PM »
Try Heo's suggestion of running a wire straight from the battery positive terminal to the plus side of the coil before trying to start it, to rule out a flakey solenoid or switch.  Assuming this will work okay with your ignition system.  Works with points and Pertronix 1 at least - don't want to give advice that will fry an ignition box if there are some this is a no-no for.  Not familiar with their wiring.

Pat
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Heo

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Re: wont start
« Reply #22 on: February 15, 2020, 05:48:11 PM »
Probably need to conect positive to MSD box ??? Yes to red thin wire on the MSDc If it dont start with that
Problem is not Ign lock try the coil then if not start try the dist or box


« Last Edit: February 15, 2020, 05:55:42 PM by Heo »
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The defenition of a Gentleman, is a man that can play the accordion.But dont do it

fryedaddy

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Re: wont start
« Reply #23 on: February 15, 2020, 06:52:23 PM »
thanks for the advice. i went out to the garage just know to see if it would start after letting it sit for a few hours.it fired right up,idled at 950 for a few minutes,then all the sudden it dyed like someone just turned it off.i thought oh no not again.but it fired back up to my surprise. im going to get my son to go over my wiring to see if he can figure it out for me.this is my weakest link in the automotive world,im not very good at wiring,ignitions,etc.
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1966 comet caliente 428 4 speed owned since 1983                                                 1973 f250 ranger xlt 360 4 speed papaw bought new

Heo

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Re: wont start
« Reply #24 on: February 15, 2020, 07:27:51 PM »
Does the coil get hot?
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The defenition of a Gentleman, is a man that can play the accordion.But dont do it

dcm0123

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Re: wont start
« Reply #25 on: February 15, 2020, 10:04:01 PM »
Do  have points and condenser? If so, replace the condenser.
Not sure if the MSD set up has one.
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fryedaddy

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Re: wont start
« Reply #26 on: February 16, 2020, 01:33:54 AM »
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1966 comet caliente 428 4 speed owned since 1983                                                 1973 f250 ranger xlt 360 4 speed papaw bought new
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